Wonder what it would cost to get a hold of the Flight source from Microsoft. If they have abandoned it, perhaps they could be convinced to license / sell the engine. I personally would invest my time and money into such an endeavor. Some people spend thousands on custom cars etc, I'd be willing to spend a couple g's to continue flight development.

Don't write off xplane yet.

 

Who did that ?

Actually, that is not a new idea.

 

Perhaps it's time to dust it off and put together some folks to study existing options.

I second that.

 

_______________________________________________________________________________

 

And thanks for removing the obnoxious previous post.

Even an organized effort to boost participation efforts with open-source projects like Flight Gear might be worthwhile.

And thanks for removing the obnoxious previous post.

 

I second that. Interesting the lack of content there, plus the ironic dissertation on self delusion and the implication that his forum (all two posts so far) would be free, unlike Avsim. I wish him all the luck in the world.

 

Hook

Actually, that is not a new idea.

 

Mr Allensworth,

 

Would you be willing to expand on that? What has been proposed and how long ago was it? Was it written off immediately, or given some consideration. And would you be willing to get involved in such an effort?

So should you still buy any DLC?

Do Not Lock this thread until we raise a few million $$$$$$$ :lol:

Why start a new sim, there are actually two relatively recent and quite decent flight model sims out there. DCS world (though only covering the caucasus at the moment) is a really good sim, X-Plane with some more input from the community would be fantastic. I like FSX but it's getting old, at somepoint we will all need to move on, P3D is still FSX, any major improvements are likely to break existing addons (DX11 or 64-bit) and as indicated it's still FSX...it's 6 years old.

 

I don't think people now have the patience for simulators in general, when i started out part of the fun was the thick 400+ page manual (remember Falcon 4)...even before that A320 on the Amiga? Now it's all Angry Birds...bah!

So should you still buy any DLC?

 

No one can make that decision for you, and no one can help you make it. As for me, if additional content is offered, and it's something I'm interested in, I'll buy it.

 

Hook

Would you be willing to expand on that? What has been proposed and how long ago was it? Was it written off immediately, or given some consideration. And would you be willing to get involved in such an effort?

 

How long does it take to write a million lines of source code? How many people here have the necessary skills to write it, much less the time?

 

Time was when you could crank out a good game in 125,000 lines of code. Those days are no more.

 

Hook

Severals years of developments with the right team to start with (from scratch) = severals millions of $ (I'm mot kidding with the millions)

 

Better start with somebody else engine, something like CryEngine (or who ever is welling to sell you the right to use their engine) still you will have to lay down a lot of $$ to get these right and we have not started making a sim out of it = more $$.

 

Also, you better make it an all around sim, better start with a game where you can shoot others down (that's what make money today) with missions like Tom Clancy for the "wanna be" combat pilots and a real as it get sim. for others not interrested into shooting others down.

 

Now what are the possible revenue compare to the money spent?

 

Because of the foundation of XP-10 I think it's the way to go IF and this is a big IF the owner of XP-10 is welling to give into what peoples want.....if not the same thing will happen as it did with Flight.....not enough revenue to keep it up and running as we would like it to be.

 

Listen to your customers.......

Mr Allensworth,

 

Would you be willing to expand on that? What has been proposed and how long ago was it? Was it written off immediately, or given some consideration. And would you be willing to get involved in such an effort?

 

If I remember correctly there was a meeting of several add-on developers to consider the possibility of developing a new flightsim (possibly around the time the ACES studio was closed by MS). AFAIK after some consideration it was decided to be too expensive / not commercially viable and canned.

 

I don't think people now have the patience for simulators in general, when i started out part of the fun was the thick 400+ page manual (remember Falcon 4)...even before that A320 on the Amiga? Now it's all Angry Birds...bah!

 

I think roughly the same portion of the population now has the patience for simulators. Angry Birds and the like has turned a lot more people into 'gamers' (using the term very lightly), but I don't think it has taken many people away from simming. In absolute terms the number of people that sim is probably the same, or slightly higher than in the past (because those people have always been on computers), but Angry Birds and the like have greatly increased the total number of 'computer game players', making simmers a far smaller portion of the total audience. Or are you telling me that the percentage of the population that simmed twenty years ago is anything like the percentage that has played Angry Birds now?

 

Another problem is that the cost of developing a game (and thus the number of copies you need to sell) has grown enormously. In the late 80s you could sell say 20,000 copies of a game and be profitable. Most modern big budget games need to sell 1,5 to 2 million copies just to break even.

Mr Allensworth,

 

Would you be willing to expand on that? What has been proposed and how long ago was it? Was it written off immediately, or given some consideration. And would you be willing to get involved in such an effort?

 

Sure Andy, not a problem.

 

When the majors in the flight simulation community met at Schiphol in April of 2009, shortly after ACES folded, those present were given a view of some things that were taking place in sim development, or at least components of which could be brought into a larger sim design effort. Scenery specifically. What we were shown was pretty impressive. At that same meeting, one of the commercial vendors showed some development they were working on toward bringing a sim to life as well. You have read about who that is and I won't go into much more about it.

 

AVSIM has also kicked the idea around, briefly. As Alain points out, we're talking millions of dollars in investment and years to bring that sim to a state that might be palitable to today's simmer. We concluded that we would rather do a print magazine than beat our heads against that wall. The fact that we considered a print magazine and an alternative investment tells you how bad an idea we thought starting a sim development would be. After all, who starts up a print magazine, or buys one, today in the digital age? We quickly scuttered that idea too, obviously.

 

However... the situation has changed since 2009. X-Plane, Prepar3D, Flight Gear, etc., have all shown growth with improving feature sets and user functionality. I am not sure that we need to jump off the bridge and develop an all new flight sim. My opinion is that we have a variety to chose from and FSX is by no means dead. If anything, it is more dynamic and attractive a sim than at anytime in its history.

I think roughly the same portion of the population now has the patience for simulators. Angry Birds and the like has turned a lot more people into 'gamers' (using the term very lightly), but I don't think it has taken many people away from simming. In absolute terms the number of people that sim is probably the same, or slightly higher than in the past (because those people have always been on computers), but Angry Birds and the like have greatly increased the total number of 'computer game players', making simmers a far smaller portion of the total audience. Or are you telling me that the percentage of the population that simmed twenty years ago is anything like the percentage that has played Angry Birds now?

 

I once read somewhere that games companies (more about combat sims) were still making money but that the cost in both time and money was way more than the cost and time involved in FPS games. Even PC gaming now is dumbed down, lending itself to a more casual crowd, most people seem to believe (i happen to agree) that PC gaming is dead and / or dying.

 

Another problem is that the cost of developing a game (and thus the number of copies you need to sell) has grown enormously. In the late 80s you could sell say 20,000 copies of a game and be profitable. Most modern big budget games need to sell 1,5 to 2 million copies just to break even.

 

I agree with this, but what is the reason for that? From the details i have seen it's mostly licensing costs (think things like FIFA) and engine costs. Still i remember when David Braben managed to get an entire universe (and a fun game to boot) on an 880K Amiga floppy disk!