When pilots report objects in the sky

[Rocky_53 1,579]

Nice one Matt, I have to hold my hand up and admit I had a 'thing' for lady Penelope!

[CoolP 283]

There are things about UFO I fail to accept.. that purple hair. Sorry. :unsure:

[Scatterbrain Kid 1]

The SETI (Search for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence) program has been scanning the heavens for radio messages indicating alien life, but what if aliens have already been to earth?

For example one guy appeared on earth and said-

"I am not of this world" (John 8:23)

"I know where I came from and where I am going. But you have no idea where I come from or where I am going" (John 8:14)

"I'll tell you things hidden since the creation of the world" (Matthew 13:35)

 

Would you listen to him Spock?

"Affirmative, I'm all ears"..

[HiFlyer 9,360]

The Fermi paradox (or Fermi's paradox) is the apparent contradiction between high estimates of the probability of the existence of extraterrestrial civilization and humanity's lack of contact with, or evidence for, such civilizations. The basic points of the argument are:

• The sun is a young star. There are billions of stars in the galaxy that are billions of years older;
  
• If the Earth is typical, some of these stars likely have planets with intelligent life;
  
• Presumably some of these civilizations will develop interstellar travel, as Earth seems likely to do;
  
• At any practical pace of interstellar travel, the galaxy can be completely colonized in just a few tens of millions of years.
  
• The observable universe is currently believed to have at least 80 billion galaxies.
  

According to this line of thinking, the Earth should have already been colonized, or at least visited. But no convincing evidence of this exists. Hence Fermi's question "Where is everybody?".

 

One explanation is that we are alone, or are the first civilization in this galaxy.

 

A scarier explanation is that everyone else is hiding, and we don't really wanna find out from what. (In which case, Earths expanding radio bubble is bad, bad news for us)

 

I guess the third possability is that they are here playing hide and seek, presumably studying us, in which case they better like what they find, since its been postulated that any truly logical species will eliminate any dangerous rivals in the area before they have the chance to develop relativistic weapons.

 

http://sciencefictio...-weapon-impact/

 

Such weapons are nearly impossible to detect or stop, and you don't want any possibly nasty interstellar neighbors to have them. In fact, it might not be sane to allow anyone at all except yourself to have them, friendly or not. Not when the survival of your species might be at stake.

 

In that scenario, Galactic history might then consist of long periods of intense silence; punctuated by brash outbursts by naive young civilizations announcing their locations...... Followed again by silence as the relativistic reply to that outburst arrives on target.

[CoolP 283]

You are not playing Mass Effect, do you? B)

[HiFlyer 9,360]

I have, but only played a few minutes of the first game to test the installation was working correctly for the kids. I never got back to it.

 

I have actually been thinking about this since I was a kid myself.

 

It occurred to me that the Federation in the Star Trek universe was almost impossibly Utopian to allow ships that could end all life in an instant to fly freely around the planet. Even a private shuttlecraft is an extinction level event ramming a planet at near lightspeed. And its already been shown that there are terrorists and extremists in the Star Trek universe.......

 

Same reason I am wary of Space Elevators. Too tempting for some numb-nut to target, and the consequences would be.... extreme.

 

The human race is not sane, and we have technology. Why would we think aliens would be any better?

[CoolP 283]

Ok. It's just a nice setup and great story in my eyes. Comes close to some things you've mentioned, explaining periods of silence.

 

But who mentions Fermi also mentions Drake's equation, on the possible number count.

 

By the way, it's interesting to read how the science minds answer the question on what to do when it comes to sending out signals or trying to make contact. I think Hawking opts for a 'lay low' approach. I'd have to look up his reasons on this, but maybe he is coming from the thinking that the more advanced life will always end up trying to rule the less advanced one.

 

My idealistic mind tends to differ as I think that there may well be an advanced stage which has gotten rid of the dominance and control attitude. Obviously, mankind is.. in another stage.

 

I guess the third possability is that they are here playing hide and seek, presumably studying us

If that's the case, they currently find us.. surfing the web, posting all there is as a pic or vid and then tweet about it.

 

I don't want to be an Alien (scientist)! :lol:

 

The human race is not sane, and we have technology. Why would we think aliens would be any better?

Good question. I think the 'consensus' (if there is something like that) is that the longer a civilization has managed to survive with weapons of mass destruction being available, the more advanced its society must be.

 

By this, an alien race being able to really travel the universe must also be capable of developing devastating weapons. Perhaps like the ones you are describing.

 

In the end, they would have found a way to deal with their own internal wars and causes. This does not mean that there are no conflicts, but it does mean that they don't escalate into the extinction of the entire race.

 

I don't know how the current nuclear warhead count on Earth is, some 16.000 or so? But if we manage to have those weapons and don't use them, we have made one step towards the advanced stage.

 

Unfortunately, the current 'solution' seems to be to control each and every human being, which is not how stability establishes.

[HiFlyer 9,360]

@CoolP

 

If they are studying us, they see that in any show dealing with aliens, they are horrors to be killed by the planet-full, or are completely dominated by human beings. I would not find that encouraging, and its all throughout our art and literature. (just like death)

 

I also note that some philosopher in ancient times might very well have argued that once we learned to survive the awesome destructive potential of gunpowder weapons, we would finally mature towards peace.... I am also mindful of wars to end all wars.

 

Hows all that working out?

 

[CoolP 283]

Yes, 03:07 and following. I guess that, from the 'human' perspective, he's very much spot on. Means if the Alien folks are 'just like humans but with faster ships'.

 

Now the more positive approach would be to see the technological progress being connected to the one in a society. That's not as easy as it sounds, just take a look at the speed of our technology advancing and, at the same time, asking numerous questions on e.g. ethical standards.

 

Just because you can build or create things doesn't mean that you 'can' or 'should'. So those hurdles are just getting higher and higher.

 

 

If we were the ones discovering some other life, the science folks once again have interesting viewpoints. Take Carl Sagan for example.

There are so many examples of human misuse of the Earth that even phrasing this question chills me. If there is life on Mars, I believe we should do nothing with Mars. Mars then belongs to the Martians, even if the Martians are only microbes. The existence of an independent biology on a nearby planet is a treasure beyond assessing, and the preservation of that life must, I think, supersede any other possible use of Mars.

So that one guy, a scientist for life, would take a step back and let his drive on exploring the unknown rest for the sake of protecting and respecting the other life. I find that not only food for thought but also very noble in the first place.

[HiFlyer 9,360]

And scientists have been allowed control of policy since when?

 

Here are even more wonderful and true words from Mr Sagan: Yet even as we type, the warships are underway. When do you believe this will change?

 

And why should those "out there" really be any more sane? I really don't know about us. Another reason for the silence might be that technological civilizations overwhelmingly tend to destroy themselves long before reaching the point of star travel.

 

I hope that's not it, though.

 

[CoolP 283]

Devon, is the world really that bad when you see folks following Mr. Sagan or wishing for an end of the global race for the most efficient and powerful military?

 

No, I'd say that still enough folks ask questions and that still enough folks realize that, in the end, we only have this one planet we're on and it doesn't even make sense to be able to blow the whole pace up.

 

So maybe the hardliners see their last years coming, hence the move to control and read each and every one. That's not how they will win and I guess they already know it. :smile:

 

 

Nice video by the way. Find the original picture leading to the 'pale blue dot' quote at the NASA site, they still host it with honour.

[HiFlyer 9,360]

We shall see.

[CoolP 283]

Now lets fight over gel vs. foam. :lol: Aliens don't shave.

[HiFlyer 9,360]

Anyone knows that foam is superior. Especially since I developed kinetic kill vehicles first, and they are all aimed in your general direction. I am sure you will see sanity, and the logic of my position, given the circumstances.... -_-

[Jason Howell 1]

I think this thread is great. And i also love how ONE scene from a movie has such a hold on people (the close encounters of the third kind ATC scene) It is just an affirmation that Steven Spielberg is a great moviemaker. CEOTTK is one of the better movies ever made, and was sadly drowned out by all the noise of Star Wars, as they both came out in 1977.