Yep, it is definitely a FSX issue, unfortunately we will just have to live with it...

It seems it moves at a slow pace with speed. I think the faster the change in speed the faster it moves.

 

It never did it with the ngx so not sure what's causing it

 

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It's nothing to do with speed, almost entirely due to heading changes.

Ive never had the problem with the ngx but I never flew outside of europe. Surely it cant be something that only happens in the US? Ive had the problem with the 777 both at gatwick when I first got the 777 and on the tutorial flight.

 

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Having noticed it in the 777 you will now not be able to miss it in the NGX, especially if you have the HGS in use.  Simply taxi around on the ramp and watch it move around in front of you.

 

It must be something specific to the T7 though - it doesn't happen with any other FSX addon (including the NGX and JS4100)

It happens in every FSX aircraft, even the default Cessna. But the nearer the eyepoint is to the centre of the model the less noticeable it is. Long aircraft magnify the problem as this distance is greater.

 

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This issue is mentioned in the Introduction Manual but, with all due respect to PMDG, contrary to what's said there I don't think it's anything to do with FSX head motion simulation. It's much more likely to be an error in how FSX calculates where to put the VC camera position relative to the 3D model centre, which is the centre of rotation of the sim. Because the VC eye position is a point in space relative to the model (which is defined as lat,long,altitude) its position is also affected by aircraft lat/long and possibly altitude (I've not experimented with it to find out).  What I do know is that the VC eye position error moves mainly according to aircraft true heading. It moves in a circle in the opposite direction to true heading changes at twice the angular rate.  So if the aircraft turns through 180 deg the eye position is back where it started.

 

The same calculation is done in full flight simulator visual simulation, you have to convert the relative position of the pilot seat to the aircraft CG into lat/long coordinates and position the eye there in the visual scene.  No head bobbing effects in Level D simulators.  The maths and trigonometry involved is straightforward but lengthy and it's easy to make a mistake.  FSX is full of such errors that weren't properly checked and resolved by the development team.

 

I believe this could be compensated for in view control systems like EZDOK or Opus, but it would need the developers of those systems to add such a camera position compensation effect, then the user would have to scale this offset, according to aircraft length, to correctly null out the error.  Not simple, but possible. I did ask in the EZDOK forum a while back and made some video to demonstrate the effect, but either they weren't interested or simply didn't understand why it was such a problem.

 

What I did in the MD11 was to line up the aircraft to true north (not magnetic).  This puts the eye as far aft as it will move relative to the seat.  Set up EZDOK camera views to your requirements.  Now slew or taxi to a heading of 090 (true), which puts the eye as far forward as it will go, and check the views are still as you wish.  If not adjust to a compromise position and check it's still OK with heading 000 true.  Minor adjustments in x,y,z are usually enough.  Finally change true heading to intermediate values (045 and 135) which moves the eye to the maximum right and left, and check the cameras are OK there.   I was able to find good compromise positions for cameras for the MD11 and expect to be able to do so in the 777.

Yep, same for me too.

It's nothing to do with speed, almost entirely due to heading changes.

Having noticed it in the 777 you will now not be able to miss it in the NGX, especially if you have the HGS in use.  Simply taxi around on the ramp and watch it move around in front of you.

 

It happens in every FSX aircraft, even the default Cessna. But the nearer the eyepoint is to the centre of the model the less noticeable it is. Long aircraft magnify the problem as this distance is greater.

 

----

 

This issue is mentioned in the Introduction Manual but, with all due respect to PMDG, contrary to what's said there I don't think it's anything to do with FSX head motion simulation. It's much more likely to be an error in how FSX calculates where to put the VC camera position relative to the 3D model centre, which is the centre of rotation of the sim. Because the VC eye position is a point in space relative to the model (which is defined as lat,long,altitude) its position is also affected by aircraft lat/long and possibly altitude (I've not experimented with it to find out).  What I do know is that the VC eye position error moves mainly according to aircraft true heading. It moves in a circle in the opposite direction to true heading changes at twice the angular rate.  So if the aircraft turns through 180 deg the eye position is back where it started.

 

The same calculation is done in full flight simulator visual simulation, you have to convert the relative position of the pilot seat to the aircraft CG into lat/long coordinates and position the eye there in the visual scene.  No head bobbing effects in Level D simulators.  The maths and trigonometry involved is straightforward but lengthy and it's easy to make a mistake.  FSX is full of such errors that weren't properly checked and resolved by the development team.

 

I believe this could be compensated for in view control systems like EZDOK or Opus, but it would need the developers of those systems to add such a camera position compensation effect, then the user would have to scale this offset, according to aircraft length, to correctly null out the error.  Not simple, but possible. I did ask in the EZDOK forum a while back and made some video to demonstrate the effect, but either they weren't interested or simply didn't understand why it was such a problem.

 

What I did in the MD11 was to line up the aircraft to true north (not magnetic).  This puts the eye as far aft as it will move relative to the seat.  Set up EZDOK camera views to your requirements.  Now slew or taxi to a heading of 090 (true), which puts the eye as far forward as it will go, and check the views are still as you wish.  If not adjust to a compromise position and check it's still OK with heading 000 true.  Minor adjustments in x,y,z are usually enough.  Finally change true heading to intermediate values (045 and 135) which moves the eye to the maximum right and left, and check the cameras are OK there.   I was able to find good compromise positions for cameras for the MD11 and expect to be able to do so in the 777.

 

Would you be able to share your ezca profiles for the MD11 and 777? (and if you have it, 747?)

 

I just purchased EZCA a day ago and am fascinated but overwhelmed. I got the basics down, I imported Froogles profile, but I would love to see what you have done.

Would you be able to share your ezca profiles for the MD11 and 777? (and if you have it, 747?)

 

I just purchased EZCA a day ago and am fascinated but overwhelmed. I got the basics down, I imported Froogles profile, but I would love to see what you have done.

I've only set up internal VC cameras, not bothered with other effects. I haven't done this for the 777 yet either, but I will upload my 747 and MD11 camera sets when I get a chance.

It's nothing to do with speed, almost entirely due to heading changes.

Having noticed it in the 777 you will now not be able to miss it in the NGX, especially if you have the HGS in use.  Simply taxi around on the ramp and watch it move around in front of you.

 

It happens in every FSX aircraft, even the default Cessna. But the nearer the eyepoint is to the centre of the model the less noticeable it is. Long aircraft magnify the problem as this distance is greater.

 

----

 

This issue is mentioned in the Introduction Manual but, with all due respect to PMDG, contrary to what's said there I don't think it's anything to do with FSX head motion simulation. It's much more likely to be an error in how FSX calculates where to put the VC camera position relative to the 3D model centre, which is the centre of rotation of the sim. Because the VC eye position is a point in space relative to the model (which is defined as lat,long,altitude) its position is also affected by aircraft lat/long and possibly altitude (I've not experimented with it to find out).  What I do know is that the VC eye position error moves mainly according to aircraft true heading. It moves in a circle in the opposite direction to true heading changes at twice the angular rate.  So if the aircraft turns through 180 deg the eye position is back where it started.

 

The same calculation is done in full flight simulator visual simulation, you have to convert the relative position of the pilot seat to the aircraft CG into lat/long coordinates and position the eye there in the visual scene.  No head bobbing effects in Level D simulators.  The maths and trigonometry involved is straightforward but lengthy and it's easy to make a mistake.  FSX is full of such errors that weren't properly checked and resolved by the development team.

 

I believe this could be compensated for in view control systems like EZDOK or Opus, but it would need the developers of those systems to add such a camera position compensation effect, then the user would have to scale this offset, according to aircraft length, to correctly null out the error.  Not simple, but possible. I did ask in the EZDOK forum a while back and made some video to demonstrate the effect, but either they weren't interested or simply didn't understand why it was such a problem.

 

What I did in the MD11 was to line up the aircraft to true north (not magnetic).  This puts the eye as far aft as it will move relative to the seat.  Set up EZDOK camera views to your requirements.  Now slew or taxi to a heading of 090 (true), which puts the eye as far forward as it will go, and check the views are still as you wish.  If not adjust to a compromise position and check it's still OK with heading 000 true.  Minor adjustments in x,y,z are usually enough.  Finally change true heading to intermediate values (045 and 135) which moves the eye to the maximum right and left, and check the cameras are OK there.   I was able to find good compromise positions for cameras for the MD11 and expect to be able to do so in the 777.

 

Thanks for the insight. I would also greatly appreciate your 777 ezdok profile if at all possible.  :smile:

I keep getting a ping sound repeating. Anyone know what that is?

I keep getting a ping sound repeating. Anyone know what that is?

That means you're in the camera position edit mode. Default num pad 2 key to save it

I have no problems with the NGX and MD-11, but my Captain view likes to slowly pan to the right, especially after I make a lot of head movements.  I just hit F12 to face front.

 

Also, I was wondering if anyone was having trouble setting up EXDOK external views. When I try to define outside cameras, my 777 displyas incomplete as a skeleton, but the aircraft shows up fine on the spot view and the other views that PMDG designed. 

I've only set up internal VC cameras, not bothered with other effects. I haven't done this for the 777 yet either, but I will upload my 747 and MD11 camera sets when I get a chance.

 

Thanks! Looking forward to your 747 and MD11 sets, and the 777 all when you have a chance. Will you upload to this topic?

I have no problems with the NGX and MD-11, but my Captain view likes to slowly pan to the right, especially after I make a lot of head movements.  I just hit F12 to face front.

 

Also, I was wondering if anyone was having trouble setting up EXDOK external views. When I try to define outside cameras, my 777 displyas incomplete as a skeleton, but the aircraft shows up fine on the spot view and the other views that PMDG designed. 

 

you need to run EzcaConfig utility every time after new aircraft installation, just close FSX, run utility, select default settings and then apply Ezdok again. That should be the fix, but i'm not 100% sure without screenshot

Thanks for the info

Thanks! Looking forward to your 747 and MD11 sets, and the 777 all when you have a chance. Will you upload to this topic?

Yes.

Thanks! Looking forward to your 747 and MD11 sets, and the 777 all when you have a chance. Will you upload to this topic?

OK, here's a link to a zip file containing my 747 and md11 camera sets to try. Just import them from the EZCA menu.  I used someone else's NGX camera sets as a baseline but never changed the external cameras, so they won't tie up with the 744 or MD11 properly (I don't use EZCA for external views). Still you could use them as a starting point if you want external cameras.  The VC cameras are my choices but you might have different ideas.

Hope this helps someone. 

 

http://kylanwalters.com/bin/PMDG777Cameras.zip

 

I built in a compensation for the head moving, so you can always see everything on the panel

 

By the way, the viewpoint shift bug is based on your aircraft's CG. So small GA don't have it at all, while the 777 and 747 have it pretty bad. The bug is built into FSX itself unfortunately.