Skywolf

Excellent Response by FSLabs

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Posted (edited)

Hi all,

I just saw this post being mentioned on reddit https://forums.flightsimlabs.com/index.php?/topic/17605-19-june-2018-news-update/

And I have to say it is an excellent response.  They go in depth on how they are moving forward, and in a nutshell....this makes me feel positive about the company.  I have been wanting to try their products.  Bottom line is we all make mistakes (even if the intention is right), it is all about perception isn't it.  We all are human.

FSLabs is taking big courage with this step and it is a very positive one.

One of things I would suggest to FSLabs is work with PMDG, Majestic, Orbx, Flight 1, Lockheed Martin - especially on how they deal with activation/drm etc. 

This is a great direction taken by FSLabs, and all of these companies do make our sim hobby excellent.

Please keep the responses civil on this thread.  I am just passing the message

PS - FSLSpotlights is free now, I can't wait to try it when P3D 4.3 is out

Edited by Skywolf
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Some may call this “damage control” but i’ll just give them a honest thumbs up, commendable response FSLabs!

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Woozie said:

Some may call this “damage control” but i’ll just give them a honest thumbs up, commendable response FSLabs!

Even Apple did damage control with Antenna gate/Apple Maps (i know, completely different issue...along the same lines in weird sort of technicality...lol).

And Yes, it is very commendable response by FSlabs

Edited by Skywolf
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The money quote:

Quote

Beginning with the forthcoming update to our A320-X product, we have decided that we are going to put our trust in you entirely.  While our product installer will still ask you for the serial number issued to you after purchase, we will be eliminating all additional validation that was previously occurring at product run-time.

I'm impressed. I hope it doesn't hurt their bottom line too much but they're heading in the right direction. An activation system that causes much more inconvenience for paying customers than it does for the pirates is never a good idea, in my opinion. The takeaway lesson is forget the pirates, you can't get their money anyway, concentrate on getting mine. As an owner of the FSX FSLabs A320, the chances of me buying the P3D v4 version have just increased.

Pity it took the recent charlie-foxtrots to get them to that point, though. Hopefully the lesson has been learned. 

Bonus news: Spotlights is now free.

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That’s very good news and a brave decision by FSL to lighten the validation checks on a licence. I suspect they may have discussed the validation situation with other developers and have concluded that piracy is all but unstoppable. But they were damaging their good name with recent decisions.

Given Froogle publicly stated he would not be commenting further on FSL it will be interesting to see if he now changes his mind and gives them due credit.

The news about Concorde’s development is especially welcome. Good luck to all the FSL team and I hope things go well for them.

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Glad to see the spotlight back on excellent products instead of abysmal PR.  They can't really do more than that

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Glad to see the spotlight back on excellent products instead of abysmal PR

I see what you did there :wink:

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Ray, having just read Lefteris' post in that link, I was totally unaware what had happened to FSLabs as I have been away from here for ages.

What a sad indictment that there is no way in this day and age to combat piracy. It's like the police saying,' we cannot prevent crime, you are on your own!'..

Agree with you re:good news about Concorde.

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Rick,

A sad reflection on society when some people don’t think they should pay for anything including music.

Fortunately most people are honest and if I ever come across anyone who had a pirated copy of any FS software I’ll let my feelings be known.

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Posted (edited)

To be honest, piracy will unfortunately, always find a way, so it really doesn't matter much to legitimate users whether the thing is password protected or whatever, it's just something which makes life harder for legit buyers, but legitimate users will stump up the cash and tolerate the protection because they understand that you only get what you are prepared to pay for; those who are shortsighted enough to not pay for what they get and who then whine about there being no cool add ons, will continue to break the law and find ways to do so whatever protections are in place. So ultimately, as was ever the case, protection methods are merely a brief challenge for hackers and pirates, thus of doubtful use anyway.

Thus I appreciate a developer putting their trust in buyers, because buyers always trust them and pay for the things they want, as I'm sure most Avsim users do too. At this point I only have the FSL A320 for FSX, but I'll put my money where my mouth is and buy their P3D V4 one when that update comes along. That's the real way to show support for developers under threat from people nicking their hard work. So good on FSL for having the integrity to accept that some people will always defraud them, but  not make those who are their friends, who pay for their efforts, then also pay the price exacted by those who hurt the hobby by stealing stuff.

And who cares what any youtube reviewer says about any of this anyway? If any of em have dismissed FSL and said they won't talk about them again, well then good riddance to them, let's see how long that edict lasts, it'll be a good indicator of their integrity, or lack of it more like..

Edited by Chock
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1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

I see what you did there :wink:

Sharp as a razor you are.

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55 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

A sad reflection on society when some people don’t think they should pay for anything including music.

It's insidious. Society is one terminally sick puppy

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Credit where it is due. Glad that cooler heads seem to have at least temporarily prevailed at FSL.

James

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10 minutes ago, ErichB said:

Sharp as a razor you are.

Been turned into Yoda you have. 😀

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Glad to see FSL getting their act together and hoping for a drama free future from them, I think they have a great product and I am looking forward to their next release. As far as froogle opinion of FSL, I take it with a grain of salt as this guy is part of the beta team for a competitor....

John

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9 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Been turned into Yoda you have. 😀

I thought someone would quip about that. :smile:

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1 minute ago, ErichB said:

I thought someone would quip about that. :smile:

Quip, or do not, there is no try.

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19 minutes ago, honanhal said:

Credit where it is due. Glad that cooler heads seem to have at least temporarily prevailed at FSL.

James

Temporarily? Why would you suggest it’s only a temporary change of heart? 🙄

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40 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Temporarily? Why would you suggest it’s only a temporary change of heart? 🙄

I'm not saying it's temporary; I'm saying we don't know yet. FSL have repeatedly been caught doing less-than-savory things and then been forced to apologize (or at least backpedal), only to then be caught again. While I hope this announcement represents a genuine and lasting change in their ethos/approach to doing business, I'm just suggesting that I will "trust but verify," as they say. I hope my caution turns out to be misplaced.

I don't want to harp on the negative here, and I'm only expanding on this since you asked. I'm encouraged by the announcement and really do hope this is how things will be from here on in.

James

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5 minutes ago, honanhal said:

I'm not saying it's temporary; I'm saying we don't know yet. FSL have repeatedly been caught doing less-than-savory things and then been forced to apologize (or at least backpedal), only to then be caught again. While I hope this announcement represents a genuine and lasting change in their ethos/approach to doing business, I'm just suggesting that I will "trust but verify," as they say. I hope my caution turns out to be misplaced.

I don't want to harp on the negative here, and I'm only expanding on this since you asked. I'm encouraged by the announcement and really do hope this is how things will be from here on in.

James

You did say temporary James but I'll accept it was with caveats.

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I am inclined to suppose that if a lot of the critics of not just FSL, but of other developers too, had experienced having six or seven year's worth of their work stolen repeatedly, they'd at least be a bit more understanding of why that might lead one to go a bit over the line in attempting to prevent that. Not saying it was above criticism, but as ever, walk a mile in another man's shoes and all that.

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That was indeed a good response. And what really made me jump for joy was the information regarding the Concorde. Would really love to see that gorgeous addon in P3D v4. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Chock said:

And who cares what any youtube reviewer says about any of this anyway? If any of em have dismissed FSL and said they won't talk about them again, well then good riddance to them, let's see how long that edict lasts, it'll be a good indicator of their integrity, or lack of it more like..

Love it Chock!

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3 hours ago, Skywolf said:

Hi all,

I just saw this post being mentioned on reddit https://forums.flightsimlabs.com/index.php?/topic/17605-19-june-2018-news-update/

And I have to say it is an excellent response.  They go in depth on how they are moving forward, and in a nutshell....this makes me feel positive about the company.  I have been wanting to try their products.  Bottom line is we all make mistakes (even if the intention is right), it is all about perception isn't it.  We all are human.

FSLabs is taking big courage with this step and it is a very positive one.

One of things I would suggest to FSLabs is work with PMDG, Majestic, Orbx, Flight 1, Lockheed Martin - especially on how they deal with activation/drm etc. 

This is a great direction taken by FSLabs, and all of these companies do make our sim hobby excellent.

Please keep the responses civil on this thread.  I am just passing the message

PS - FSLSpotlights is free now, I can't wait to try it when P3D 4.3 is out

So, we're celebrating a company's decision to behave ethically?  If I steal your money, and vow never to do it again, should I be celebrated?  Seriously, what choice did they have?  They have been blasted on Reddit and YouTube; concerning the latter, Froogle stated he will never speak about FSL again due to their poor ethical track record.  Actions speak louder than words; to date, I think it's fair to question Lefteris ethics, as they related to software development and running a business.  Concerning the latter, this is a pure business decision, nothing more and nothing less; surely you recognize this fact!  Time will tell if they remain committed to this path; I will hold my applause and my money until I see said change over a significant period of time.  Our community is awesome and we deserve nothing but the best!  Just because they build quality addons doesn't give them the right to do what they want.  If they disappear, I assure you someone will rise-up and take their place; outstanding developers have come and gone over the last 4 decades. 

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27 minutes ago, Chock said:

I am inclined to suppose that if a lot of the critics of not just FSL, but of other developers too, had experienced having six or seven year's worth of their work stolen repeatedly, they'd at least be a bit more understanding of why that might lead one to go a bit over the line in attempting to prevent that. Not saying it was above criticism, but as ever, walk a mile in another man's shoes and all that.

Sir, I enjoy reading your post; more importantly, the respect you show towards all perspectives.  With that said, I have to disagree with a few of your assertions.  First, FSL is not the only software company to be plagued by thief's; yet, I have yet to see said companies employ totalitarian (illegal) methods to 'strike back' at piracy.  Also, I find your condemnation against a certain YouTuber to be perplexing.  Specifically, calling out his ethics for refusing to publicize a company with CONFIRMED ethical violations?  I can't help but chuckle at the irony; the YouTuber has done nothing wrong; in fact, he's trying to do the right.  Yet, you call him out for not supporting a company with a well-deserved bad reputation?  Should AVSIM be chastised for banning BlackBox? 

Chock, I have nothing but admiration and respect for you; again, your post are entertaining, fun and educational!  When your gone, your presence is missed.  I'm honestly trying to understand your perspective!  Thank you , Chock! 

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