9 minutes ago, AnkH said:

Especially true for PBR. Same goes for those shader modification tools. Screenshots can look nice, but they never capture the stuff in motion, I suggest taking a look on the PBR promo video for the QW787 on YT. This is really something new, the plane looks far more "real" than without PBR:

Chris, thanks for taking the time to post that. I can see it does make a difference to aircraft. Whether it's enough to make me want to buy the 787 I'm not sure of. I have a GoFlight MCP Pro and using Pollypot's GIT software I can use it with the PMDG737. Not sure there is support for the QW787 yet.

Sorry to deviate.

Just now, Ray Proudfoot said:

 

Gents. If I told you the vast majority of my flying is during daytime with only rare excursions into dawn and dusk and never night then perhaps you'll appreciate PBR may not be ideal for me. Plus, to see the effect on an aircraft you have to switch to an ouside view. I may do that a couple of times in my flights but not enough to justify buying a PBR enabled aircraft.

I think PBR effects at a rainy airport might be more worthwhile especially where rain is common. So more Manchester than California!

In that case a  PBR scenery is what you need, everyone is different and everyone has different likes and enjoyment for the simulator world.

Yes, the rain effects on the tarmac at any time with PBR are astonishing.

 

Looks better in your own simulator.

Regards,
Simbol

 

 

I bought this airport 4 weeks ago, and I can relate to what Ray is saying. Not sure if the developers didn't shoot themselves in the foot with this policy - it could lead to people holding off their purchases, not buying the products any time soon after initial release. At least it should read "no free updates" on the tin, so I can make an educated purchase decision.

IMHO this is just another attempt at recovering lost sales in a diminishing market (the other is higher prices). Many people seem to think that all flightsim developers operate on market principles. But most of us are just part timers, who don't need to be commercially successful at all - bills are being paid by the real job. So none of the commercial theories really apply to pricing, effort involved or commitment.

Best regards

Edited April 8, 20197 yr by Lorby_SI

Looks like you would need wellies!

The breadth of use of the simulator is great some need the best visual setup, others need only simulate navigation accurately enough.

Edited April 8, 20197 yr by SteveW

..and everyone in-between.

 

11 minutes ago, Lorby_SI said:

I bought this airport 4 weeks ago, and I can relate to what Ray is saying. Not sure if the developers didn't shoot themselves in the foot with this policy - it could lead to people holding off their purchases, not buying the products any time soon after initial release. At least it should read "no free updates" on the tin, so I can make an educated purchase decision.

IMHO this is just another attempt at recovering lost sales in a diminishing market (the other is higher prices). Many people seem to think that all flightsim developers operate on market principles. But most of us are just part timers, who don't need to be commercially successful at all - bills are being paid by the real job. So none of the commercial theories really apply to pricing, effort involved or commitment.

Best regards

Even so, not all developers can produce software without something at least in return. I hope they all succeed in a good enough way.

 

@simbol and @Lorby_SI,

That looks pretty good. But you have to question the wisdom of JustSim deciding to apply it at an airport where there are just 55 rain days per annum. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Barcelona

You'll get far better value for money by buying a PBR-enabled Manchester where we had 158 days with rain last year (a record low) and 2012 when we had 203.

3 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

@simbol and @Lorby_SI,

That looks pretty good. But you have to question the wisdom of JustSim deciding to apply it at an airport where there are just 55 rain days per annum. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Barcelona

You'll get far better value for money by buying a PBR-enabled Manchester where we had 158 days with rain last year (a record low) and 2012 when we had 203.

PBR is not only rain induced.

PBR is not a big selling point for me. I liked the look of good quality airports and aircraft before PBR textures appeared, so it is not something that I simply must have. Yes, it is another step forward as far as realism is concerned, but it is not essential in my book. Give me a detailed non PBR version of EINN Shannon than any number of shiny PBR texture enabled versions of almost every other airport in the world!!

As for charging extra for upgrades, I did not have a problem paying peanuts for the Professional versions of Aerosoft London Heathrow and Gibraltar for P3D v4. I accepted the price of the original P3D v3 versions when I purchased them, and I did not expect to get the v4 upgrades for free.

In short....I do not really care what new customers have to pay for a product. I am more concerned with how much money is leaving my wallet!

Edited April 8, 20197 yr by Christopher Low

3 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

That looks pretty good. But you have to question the wisdom of JustSim deciding to apply it at an airport where there are just 55 rain days per annum.

Probably because you can go into themes or custom weather and make a thunderstorm

6 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

@simbol and @Lorby_SI,

That looks pretty good. But you have to question the wisdom of JustSim deciding to apply it at an airport where there are just 55 rain days per annum. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Barcelona

You'll get far better value for money by buying a PBR-enabled Manchester where we had 158 days with rain last year (a record low) and 2012 when we had 203.

Well I am discussing the technology, what it does and how hard is to implement. Bear in mind PBR add many other effects, not just rain. it is about material rendering.

Now what everyone does with it, it is their own business. Having said that I would be upset if the day it decides to rain in Barcelona I don't get to see the effects .

Now go and buy a PBR enabled content for your "preferred airport" 

Simbol.

 

Edited April 8, 20197 yr by simbol

2 minutes ago, ErichB said:

PBR is not only rain induced.

Presumably you're talking about relections off terminals etc.

1 minute ago, SteveW said:

Probably because you can go into themes or custom weather and make a thunderstorm

Blasphemy! 😁 I fly with AS16 weather - no exceptions!

7 minutes ago, SteveW said:

Probably because you can go into themes or custom weather and make a thunderstorm

lol I was going to suggest that, but you beat me to it Steve...😎 I hate it when that happens.... 😁

8 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

😁I fly with AS16 weather - no exceptions!

Which you had to repurchase as ASP4, there were no upgrades from AS16 afaik...

3 minutes ago, ckyliu said:

Which you had to repurchase as ASP4, there were no upgrades from AS16 afaik...

Incorrect. Provided you had bought one of the three earlier versions at full price you qualified for the discount. I did so qualified for the price of 25GBP.

I'm not sure of the relevance to this discussion. I use AS16 for the entire flight and every flight. Unlike an airport I certainly won't fly into and out of every day. Or week.

A while ago I asked Justsim about those costs for improved releases :

Simmarket bills the developer € 5 for each sale when a new installer has to be made ( by Simmarket )

Some developers avoid those costs by adding manual updates instead of the complete product or accept those costs. But those are developers that do not update their product that much...

So better know the other site too instead of judging without Knowing ....

Edited April 8, 20197 yr by GSalden