August 6th, 2020 - Development/Insider Update

[SilentChill 43]

Did we ever get undulating runways ?   ...............can't remember

 

[badderjet 181]

3 hours ago, MatthewS said:

Tree height is a major issue for a flight sim.

 

I‘m wondering (a lot) how you come to that conclusion, but the more I have to read about this, the more I am sure you have never seen one from the inside. I can assure you most don’t even have trees. Guess why? Because apart from eye candy, they have about zero importance to a flight sim.

 

1 hour ago, Doug47 said:

I'm so glad it's a FLIGHT simulator and not a TREE simulator. 

Well, seems you got it. I fully agree. 😂👍🏻

[badderjet 181]

7 minutes ago, SilentChill said:

Did we ever get undulating runways ?   ...............can't remember

 

We did, seems even in all the countless places where they don’t „undulate“.

Edited August 7, 2020 by badderjet

[regis9 4,014]

55 minutes ago, badderjet said:

I‘m wondering (a lot) how you come to that conclusion, but the more I have to read about this, the more I am sure you have never seen one from the inside. I can assure you most don’t even have trees. Guess why? Because apart from eye candy, they have about zero importance to a flight sim

For a recreational flight sim trees are a major immersion piece.  Clearly this is a different goal than a level-d sim.  Apart from immersion, their height is an issue when they block the end of a runway from a safe or realistic approach.

[Dominique_K 10,147]

34 minutes ago, regis9 said:

For a recreational flight sim trees are a major immersion piece.  Clearly this is a different goal than a level-d sim.  Apart from immersion, their height is an issue when they block the end of a runway from a safe or realistic approach.

Anybody flying (in a sim) an aircraft in mountainous narrow  terrain knows that the trees height makes a difference and not only to calculate the final glide slope. The whole pattern or approach is impacted. I see that in PNG or in Idaho alike.  So yes, tree size matters. Recreational flying but also light commercial flying. Bush.

I also  remind you all that the size of the trees is not the only FS20 issue. We have seen trees in strange places and not very diversified specie-like and quite homogeneous in size. 

Early on, Asobo's Lionel famously said, this is a beautiful world we live in and we want to make the most of it in the sim, or something of that kind. I have the weakness to believe the team is sincere and that telling they could do better is a tribute to their sincerity. Bring on the sarsaparilla I'm rambling now😄.

 

Edited August 7, 2020 by Dominique_K

[Slides 1,552]

Avsim's reputation is well earned...

[FlyingInACessna 656]

1 hour ago, Dominique_K said:

I have the weakness to believe the team is sincere and that telling they could do better is a tribute to their sincerity.

 

Why is that a weakness, when everything we've been shown has suggested that they are sincere?

And on a side note, why is everyone here so cynical all the time? This is an incredible product we're getting and regardless of some basic flaws at release, why aren't people at least grateful for what we're getting? I feel bad for the developers at this point having to endure the constant negative feedback regardless of what they do right. Maybe transparency wasn't the key, because I bet if they hadn't said a word and dropped the sim on the 18th with nothing more than the few trailer videos they've posted, nobody here would complain immensely about something that can easily be fixed like tree height. It's like most here have lost the excitement factor already and are simply out to criticize. Asobo has done an incredible job of reading and compiling feedback, as well as demonstrating that they understand our criticisms and are working on making fixes as we speak. So give them the room to do that!

 

20 minutes ago, Slides said:

Avsim's reputation is well earned...

 

Sure is...

Edited August 7, 2020 by FlyingInACessna

[Slides 1,552]

28 minutes ago, FlyingInACessna said:

 

Why is that a weakness, when everything we've been shown has suggested that they are sincere?

And on a side note, why is everyone here so cynical all the time? This is an incredible product we're getting and regardless of some basic flaws at release, why aren't people at least grateful for what we're getting? I feel bad for the developers at this point having to endure the constant negative feedback regardless of what they do right. Maybe transparency wasn't the key, because I bet if they hadn't said a word and dropped the sim on the 18th with nothing more than the few trailer videos they've posted, nobody here would complain immensely about something that can easily be fixed like tree height. It's like most here have lost the excitement factor already and are simply out to criticize. Asobo has done an incredible job of reading and compiling feedback, as well as demonstrating that they understand our criticisms and are working on making fixes as we speak. So give them the room to do that!

 

Because for some here, this is their only reason for existing. I could say a lot more but I'll leave it at that.

[Slides 1,552]

5 hours ago, MatthewS said:

No... For sure the AI is placing the tree at a specific location, but the scale (height) could be constrained at runtime and user configurable through say an .ini file.

eg If I prefer conifers to be smaller by 25% and the "rainforest" types to be smaller by 50% (from the Asobo defaults)

treesize_conifier=.75
treesize_rainforest=.50

Blackshark and Asobo create and place millions of trees from real life sat data using machine learning.

Avsimmer: Just change the settings in the INI file.

🙃

[ChaoticBeauty 6,692]

4 hours ago, SilentChill said:

Did we ever get undulating runways ?   ...............can't remember

Here it is, a few official screenshots at the end of that update. I think you can guess who they were responding to.

 

[MatthewS 761]

 

 6 hours ago, Doug47 said:

I'm so glad it's a FLIGHT simulator and not a TREE simulator.

It's not a building simulator either and yet building height is correctly scaled... Do you understand now? 🤷‍♂️

 

6 hours ago, Dominique_K said:

Same for the trees, wrong size, wrong species or mix, wrong emplacement. Not everywhere but enough to be annoying

The AI is only placing trees individually it's not making any judgement as to their individual scale, AFAIK that's happening at runtime, but in any case a user defined scaling factor (eg in an .ini file) can easily mitigate the issue. 🤔

 

4 hours ago, badderjet said:

I‘m wondering (a lot) how you come to that conclusion, but the more I have to read about this, the more I am sure you have never seen one from the inside. I can assure you most don’t even have trees. Guess why? Because apart from eye candy, they have about zero importance to a flight sim.

That's right, no trees are better than trees that are grossly exaggerated in scale.  I know it's a concept a lot struggle with, but your brain is tricked into believing the aircraft is flying lower than it is, because we know, from walking around in the real world, the correct scale of trees (and buildings). 🤪

 

4 hours ago, badderjet said:

We did, seems even in all the countless places where they don’t „undulate“.

That's right, runways did not undulate in FS2020 until Asobo implemented that feature.  Just like tree scale (for certain types) will remain comically exaggerated until Asobo fixes it... It's not a difficult concept, oh maybe it is, sorry 🤦‍♂️

 

53 minutes ago, Slides said:

Blackshark and Asobo create and place millions of trees from real life sat data using machine learning.

Avsimmer: Just change the settings in the INI file.

Clearly you're having trouble grasping the issue.  We are talking about tree scale, not placement.  And Asobo can easily implement a user configurable scaling factor in an .ini file (for example) so that users can tweak scale themselves. 💡

 

[MatthewS 761]

6 hours ago, OneOfMany said:

Please Asobo, do not make this change until I can fly over my house and land next to my magnificent 90' conifer at least once. 

A 90' conifer is typical in the real world, but not in FS2020 🤷‍♂️

"Chock" recently posted an eyeball analysis of conifers in FS2020 by comparing them to adjacent multi-storey buildings and concluded that they are averaging 150' to 200' tall in FS2020.  Basically double their real world average size. 🤦‍♂️

Edited August 7, 2020 by MatthewS

[MatthewS 761]

45 minutes ago, ChaoticBeauty said:

Here it is, a few official screenshots at the end of that update. I think you can guess who they were responding to.

Me? Great... I'm glad they read the forums.  👏

Well Asobo, kindly post a few more screenshots of Sydney that demonstrate you have fixed the issue of comically exaggerated tree scale. 🙏

[Slides 1,552]

You can lead a horse to water... 🙃

[scotchegg 4,186]

Yes, I need to eat some humble pie about the tree issue, as I’d naively assumed the smorgasboard of PhDs at Asobo would have sorted this glaring fault a long time ago. So Matthew, I apologize and swallow the quiche of humility.

Asobo: please fix the goddam trees.