WORKINGTITLE Working Title CJ4 v0.8.0 - OPEN BETA - RNAV/LPV, VNAV, FADEC

[Flyfaster_MTN002 412]

Doing some testing with manual FP's (because have no clue how this simbrief thingy works...). Evidently MSFS defaults to Flight Following when no IFR FP exists, and allows us all to fly in Class A Airspace. When cancelling Flight Following it just re-requests it. Whoops.

[odourboy 1,289]

5 hours ago, cwburnett said:

PERF -> VNAV SETUP -> VNAV DESCENT change your FPA to 4 degrees and do your whole descent at about 220kts and you should make it 👍

(and thanks for testing out the manual FPLN - keep us informed)

Arrival at PHNL. I found I was shy of fuel so I sneaked in 300 lbs more. Then about 16 NM out, the engines died with 33 + 33 lbs still showing. Successful dead stick landing though. MSFS gave me credit even though the gear wouldn't extend so it was a belly landing!

[MattNischan 3,778]

20 hours ago, ryanbatcund said:

Question about SIDS.  What should the FMS be doing on the CATH1 PSP leaving KPSP?  Basically, I ended up hand flying most of the CATH1 because two things happened I think weren't correct.

OK, apologies for the delay.

The NavBlue data has this coded with the following legs:

• Heading 311 until altitude 877ft
• Heading 310 until PSP radial crossing 268
• Right turn direct to fix PSP (implies flyover of previous termination)
• Direct to fix EMRUD
• Right turn direct to fix PSP (implies flyover of previous termination)

The hold until altitude is not coded as such and I'm not totally sure what a good leg coding would be in this case for that procedure. Maybe hold until manual termination, but then again there's an altitude that you could technically stop holding at. However, there's no ARINC leg type that quite fits the mold. In any aircraft using this departure it looks like you'd easily be high enough by that point anyway to not have to do the hold.

I flew that, and two bad things are happening: one, as mentioned previously, flyover fixes are yet to be implemented, and secondly, the heading to intercept leg got dropped from the procedure because it's a leg type number we haven't seen before. I appreciate the report: that will be fixed in the next build!

I'm not sure why you got skipped right to TNP, but it's possible that because the fixes are so close together part of the way back to PSP it just kicked turn anticipation in right away towards the next fix. The final PSP fix in the procedure isn't labeled as a flyover, so even with that implemented, it would still do that. That being said, when they _are_ implemented, you'll be able to mark them as such on LEGS, which would be part of your check of the procedure against the chart anyway, as in real life the FMC data is _almost_ always right, but not 100% of the time, so it's worth checking the legs against the chart.

I hope that long explanation helps!

-Matt

[MattNischan 3,778]

4 hours ago, Gilandred said:

 Encountered 2 more issues on my way from PAJN to KRNT.  The aircraft was unable to smoothly make the approximately 45 degree turn at YZF - it was doing 30 degree banks left and right a few times until it finally settled back on course.  I was in Lnav mode at cruise speed approximately mach 0.76.  Second issue on approach rnav 16 runway at KRNT.  The aircraft followed the descent ok but was laterally about a half mile offtrack to the east.  I had to disconnect ap and make a sharp westward turn to find the runway.  FMA was on approach mode.

A couple questions on this:

• What was the full plan you had loaded? We can see if there are any obvious issues during a flight.
• On the RNAV, did the map and course needles show you on track or did it appear lateral guidance just gave up? In other words, was it flying you towards what it thought was the right place (but was not the right place) or was it off in its own world someplace?

-Matt

[Gilandred 690]

1 hour ago, MattNischan said:

A couple questions on this:

• What was the full plan you had loaded? We can see if there are any obvious issues during a flight.
• On the RNAV, did the map and course needles show you on track or did it appear lateral guidance just gave up? In other words, was it flying you towards what it thought was the right place (but was not the right place) or was it off in its own world someplace?

-Matt

Full flight plan was PAJN JNU5 LVD J502 SEA KRNT.  Before passing ORCUS I loaded the RNAV Y 16 PAE transition approach and solved the disco by moving PAE after ORCUS (thus removing SEA from the sequence). 
 

On the rnav the needle was offset to my right (west) so had I been dead on it I probably would have been on centerline.  For some reason the aircraft did not put me “on the needle” but it could have been operator error, just not sure why.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Gilandred

[Dillon 2,197]

I have an issue where after creating a flight plan in the default planner (KSBA - KLAS) once in the plane I have a discontinue issue with the second waypoint.  The FMC won't let me resolve it.  Tried to create the flight with different departures and the same issue. Anyone else seeing this?

[MattNischan 3,778]

7 minutes ago, Dillon said:

I have an issue where after creating a flight plan in the default planner (KSBA - KLAS) once in the plane I have a discontinue issue with the second waypoint.  The FMC won't let me resolve it.  Tried to create the flight with different departures and the same issue. Anyone else seeing this?

What's the full plan, and is the discontinuity following a vectors leg?

-Matt

[regis9 4,014]

Had a great first full flight, KSAN-KLAS.  Only issue I ran into I think is a sim issue (or an end-user, ie me issue) whereby the flightplan that was loaded in MSFS (and hence the CJ4) did not match the flightplan I had created in SimBrief, there were a whole bunch of extra intermediate waypoints.  I can confirm this as I also loaded my Simbrief plan into Navigraph charts and it displayed properly there.  I deleted the extras in the wonderfully functional FMS and finished the flight without issue while ignoring default ATC trying to send me all over the place.  I'll pay more attention next time I load a Simbrief flightplan into MSFS/CJ4 to see what it's doing.

Curious, are takeoffs in the real CJ4 always done at full power or is there some mechanism to derate takeoff thrust?  With a Vr of 107 it sure doesn't take long to reach it and then it's a bit of a rocket on initial climbout.

This really is a great aircraft, a ton of fun and lots to learn.  I'm looking forward to flying in it a lot over the Christmas break.

[Flyfaster_MTN002 412]

Tried IFR night flight using the MSFS flight planner for standard routing: KUDD TRM CANNO KMYF. First attempt engaging AP in the climb got the death roll to the left.  Restarted: CTD right after TO.

[Dillon 2,197]

1 hour ago, MattNischan said:

What's the full plan, and is the discontinuity following a vectors leg?

-Matt

I just auto generated an IFR high altitude flight from KSBA to KLAS. This issue constantly comes up one waypoint from departure where the plan is broken in the FMC and will not let me resolve it by placing the next waypoint into the FMC to clear the discontinuity.

[MattNischan 3,778]

1 hour ago, regis9 said:

Only issue I ran into I think is a sim issue (or an end-user, ie me issue) whereby the flightplan that was loaded in MSFS (and hence the CJ4) did not match the flightplan I had created in SimBrief, there were a whole bunch of extra intermediate waypoints.

This may be normal, but I'd need to see your plan. If you add airways, you'll see all the fixes along the airway to your exit on the LEGS page, as the real unit does.

1 hour ago, regis9 said:

Curious, are takeoffs in the real CJ4 always done at full power or is there some mechanism to derate takeoff thrust?  With a Vr of 107 it sure doesn't take long to reach it and then it's a bit of a rocket on initial climbout.

Yes indeed, they are, and it is totally a rocket! You usually pull back into the CLB detent more or less after 500 ft or less of climb, as TO is limited to 5 minutes. Climb should be done at 240kts or .64M after the transition. It's about 27 minutes or so to 45K per the books, and we match that.

Most flights you'd be at 40K cruise or above.

-Matt

[ryanbatc 12,857]

2 hours ago, MattNischan said:

OK, apologies for the delay.

The NavBlue data has this coded with the following legs:

• Heading 311 until altitude 877ft
• Heading 310 until PSP radial crossing 268
• Right turn direct to fix PSP (implies flyover of previous termination)
• Direct to fix EMRUD
• Right turn direct to fix PSP (implies flyover of previous termination)

The hold until altitude is not coded as such and I'm not totally sure what a good leg coding would be in this case for that procedure. Maybe hold until manual termination, but then again there's an altitude that you could technically stop holding at. However, there's no ARINC leg type that quite fits the mold. In any aircraft using this departure it looks like you'd easily be high enough by that point anyway to not have to do the hold.

I flew that, and two bad things are happening: one, as mentioned previously, flyover fixes are yet to be implemented, and secondly, the heading to intercept leg got dropped from the procedure because it's a leg type number we haven't seen before. I appreciate the report: that will be fixed in the next build!

I'm not sure why you got skipped right to TNP, but it's possible that because the fixes are so close together part of the way back to PSP it just kicked turn anticipation in right away towards the next fix. The final PSP fix in the procedure isn't labeled as a flyover, so even with that implemented, it would still do that. That being said, when they _are_ implemented, you'll be able to mark them as such on LEGS, which would be part of your check of the procedure against the chart anyway, as in real life the FMC data is _almost_ always right, but not 100% of the time, so it's worth checking the legs against the chart.

I hope that long explanation helps!

-Matt

It does...  as I never really know what the navdata is telling the FMS.  Thanks!

[earthdog 842]

17 hours ago, zihmer001 said:

First - great work.  The changes are impressive and surely seem more realistic (I've never been aboard a CJ4, let alone in the cockpit so I don't have much to compare against).  The audio is fantastic.

I'm working to replicate issues to try to help with potential bugs but I'll say that I use the Working G1000 and G3000, plus a few lighting mods; I run Rex Weather, vPilot for VATSIM, and Navigraph.  I had two CTDs last night; both KWBI to KPIT.  One was shortly after takeoff while in the SID; the second was on short final into KPIT.  Trying to see what might be going on from my end.

Just a fantastic mod; now I need to properly learn to use the FMC!

I am using the same (vPilot e.t.c.) and i had only one CTD. One thing that was different is that i as in VNAV + FLCH....I never had CTD until now if i use VNAV + V/S...I dont know if it makes any difference though (also reported to github issue).

[Dillon 2,197]

I forgot to mention on top of the broken flight plan in the FMC mentioned above I got a CTD after takeoff from KSBA (thinking maybe after takeoff the FMC will sort whatever issue it was having with letting me resolve the discontinuity by adding the next waypoint and pushing ENT to fill in the FP).  I wasn't adjusting the FMC at the time the sim just had a CTD 3,000ft into the climb out.

[earthdog 842]

I just had my 2nd CTD.

On my SID out of KSAN

It happened a couple of seconds after i switched from external drone view to VC.