You want to hear something scary ?

[Dominique_K 10,150]

The MFS roadmap forecasts a SU6 mid-september !

Could somebody with a little influence inject some common sense there and ask them to delay it until the end of the year, fix first the SU5 flaws and  take their time not to pull off another SU5 after Labor day ? 

By the way, I hope that all those in favor of passing rapidly to DX 12 understand now better the reluctance of some of us. Do you imagine the gigantic mess that it is going to be ?

 

[MikeyOnTheFlightDeck 193]

You're right, that's pettrifying!  By the time they've sorted out SU5, they'll be ready to work on hotfixes for SU6.

[Bobsk8 12,739]

Just now, Dominique_K said:

The MFS roadmap forecasts a SU6 mid-september !

Could somebody with a little influence inject some common sense there and ask them to delay it until the end of the year, fix first the SU5 flaws and  take their time not to pull off another SU5 after Labor day ? 

By the way, I hope that all those in favor of passing rapidly to DX 12 understand now better the reluctance of some of us. Do you imagine the gigantic mess that it is going to be ?

 

It will be a horror story, moving to DX12 when they can't even fix the SU5 bugs. 

[Alpine Scenery 1,609]

4 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

The MFS roadmap forecasts a SU6 mid-september !

Could somebody with a little influence inject some common sense there and ask them to delay it until the end of the year, fix first the SU5 flaws and  take their time not to pull off another SU5 after Labor day ? 

By the way, I hope that all those in favor of passing rapidly to DX 12 understand now better the reluctance of some of us. Do you imagine the gigantic mess that it is going to be ?

 

Well, I would be concerned but not horrified (not just yet). The fact is they've broken the dev environment in several ways, yes there are workarounds but some of the workarounds involve RELOADING the game like 50x in one dev session, or at the very least resetting/reloading the dev session.

So they've pretty much grinded everyone's productivity to a complete hault right now, so they are not just going to be hearing it from the general PC simmer crowd, but I can assure you they are getting a ton of not so great feedback right now in private from the top 10 largest payware developers.

Edited July 31, 2021 by Alpine Scenery

[Noooch 1,084]

Don't worry, they have a devilish secret plan which lasts 10 years.

Only a few of us will see the final result 😈

Edited July 31, 2021 by Noooch

[Dominique_K 10,150]

1 minute ago, Noooch said:

Don't worry, they have a secret plan which lasts 10 years.

Only a few of us will see the final result 😈

If I understand what they said the secret (and I hope, cunning) plan started few years ago already. So it remains maybe only half of that 

 

[JYW 2,984]

Re: DX12, although not fully comparable, the move to Vulkan in X-Plane 11 really wasn't that dramatic.  On the first release, some users (inc. me) had a black screen in Vulkan so it was a no go.  They released a beta release for that within the week, and quite soon, Vulkan was working stably, offering it's huge performance advantages.  It was nowhere near as dramatic and contentious as this MSFS SU5 is!!   I think the DX12 upgrade in itself, should be quite procedural - it's whether they change tons of other existing code at the same time, that'll determine the stability of the change.

Edited July 31, 2021 by JYW

[rka 916]

2 minutes ago, JYW said:

Re: DX12, although not fully comparable, the move to Vulkan in X-Plane 11 really wasn't that dramatic.  On the first release, some users (inc. me) had a black screen in Vulkan so it was a no go.  They released a beta release for that within the week, and quite soon, Vulkan was working stably, offering it's huge performance advantages.  It was nowhere near as dramatic and contentious as this MSFS SU5 is!!   I think the DX12 upgrade in itself, should be quite procedural - it's whether they change tons of other existing code at the same time, that'll determine the stability of the change.

Wait, what? Not at all. There were constant CTDs of all kinds for a long time. Vulkan in XP was by no means a "within a week" thing. The whole Vulkan transition took like what, two years?

[Alpine Scenery 1,609]

The average in general is that if the update is only DX 11 to 12, the average performance improvement is 10% to 15% for a game. There are outliers, but that is about all most games can expect. 

A lot of people think that because some games had major performance increase (like 50%) it was due to moving to Vulkan or DX 12, but what really happens is the developers parlay game engine optimizations that are not related to the DX update into the same updates as the DX one. So it appears better than it is.

This is because it's easier to add optimizations to your final engine version, then to rewrite the latest optimizations twice.

 

Edited July 31, 2021 by Alpine Scenery

[JYW 2,984]

6 minutes ago, rka said:

Wait, what? Not at all. There were constant CTDs of all kinds for a long time. Vulkan in XP was by no means a "within a week" thing. The whole Vulkan transition took like what, two years?

Vulkan was barely conceived of, for X-Plane, 2 years ago!

11.50 was released less than a year ago (9th Sept 2020), and I'd stand by my comment that although there were some early showstoppers, by around XP11.50b3 almost anyone who wanted to (or had the specs and requirements to) run in Vulkan mode could.   The sim started, and you could fly in it.   It was only around a month or so until all major 3rd party addons were Vulkan compatible (most were, natively).

What do we have now that doesn't work in Vulkan?  ...... Librain.    There may be more but I can't think of them!

Edited July 31, 2021 by JYW

[swiesma 625]

SU5 is not even a week old and Avsim is crying like Bill Gates himself broke the engine for the next years to come. 
 

Get a life boys. 

[regis9 4,014]

Perhaps SU6 will,also include fixes needed because of SU5, or perhaps we’ll get more hot fixes before then.  Either way, I’m not going to complain about too many scheduled updates.

[Nyxx 6,993]

5 minutes ago, swiesma said:

SU5 is not even a week old and Avsim is crying like Bill Gates himself broke the engine for the next years to come. 
 

Get a life boys. 

Well you need to put that into context, flight simming for many here is our hobbie, it looks like yours could be Car's and is that an M3 of yours, if someone drove into your M3 and about wrote it of, if you got a bit upset about that, how would you feel if someone told you its "just" a car get a life....

Edited July 31, 2021 by Nyxx

[swiesma 625]

3 minutes ago, Nyxx said:

Well you need to put that into context, flight simming for many here is our hobbie, it looks like your could be Car's and is that an M3 of your, if someone drove into your M3 and about wrote it of, if you got a upset about that, how would you feel if someone tolf you its "just" a car get a life....

Believe it or not. Some time ago someone crashed into my M2. 
 

Guess what? The shop fixed it after 1 week and I got over 2000€ on top for the trouble and reduction of value. 
 

Hobby or not - it’s a complex piece of Software and it should run on everyone’s machine. 
I mean. Did you ever have a look at the hardware section in this forum and see how dummies overclock/undervolten their machines?

And then they end up here… crying….

Give the guys at Asobo some days to fix their sh*t, go out and have an icecream meanwhile. 

Edited July 31, 2021 by swiesma

[Dominique_K 10,150]

Please let us not bring Vulkan and XP yet another time. This is a MSF forum. There is a XP forum  ! Thank you for your comprehension.

Speaking of other sims, the only one that has dx12 for now is P3 D and V5 was not a rose bed to begin with.

But this is not the issue anyway. Is the MFS team as we know them now and their history of poor quality control and fumbling priorities able to deliver a major painless change ? They have to take the time to do it right for once,