4 minutes ago, dmwalker said:

Admirable.

Agree 100%  That's the way to do it, rather than giving money.  Way to often the money is used to buy booze or drugs.

42 minutes ago, charliearon said:

Way to often the money is used to buy booze or drugs.

Well, I'm noy a member of the Temperance Society.  I give them a dollar there are no strings attached.  I suspect some of them do use it for booze or drugs.  I'm not a reformer.  So that doesn't keep me from doing it.

Noel

Behind our local super market there is a large wooded area. Many homeless people live there. They often sit in the parking lot with a "please help me" sign around their necks. Across the street is a McDonalds. I'll often take an order and bring it back to them. I learned a long time ago that most donated money goes straight up the nose.

Well, you're helping out Doug.  Admirable.  But I'll still give a buck if it's handy.

Noel

1 hour ago, birdguy said:

It seems like everytime I talk about charity and giving a dollar or so people come out of the woodwork telling me what a fool I am because they are all scams.

Noel, I am just like you with regards to giving a dollar or two to the homeless. That doesn't happen too often to be a burden. I shop at Aldi's at least once a week and I will nearly always give my unlocked cart to the first person who needs one. It's only a quarter anyway, but it does put a smile on faces whenever I do so. In case you don't know, the carts at Aldi's are locked up and one has to slip a quarter in the slot to release the lock. When returning the cart to the corral, the quarter is returned. It's their way of keeping the carts from being stolen. 

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...I have to say I'm more excited by some of the non-human projects than by landing on Mars. Maybe because Mars is too familiar. I wish I could live long enough to see a successful probe land on Europa, for example, but, if I'm lucky, I may, at least, live to see the first images from the James Webb space telescope.

26 minutes ago, n4gix said:

I shop at Aldi's at least once a week and I will nearly always give my unlocked cart to the first person who needs one.

I never heard of that.  When I go to the super market I usually just pick up a cart in the parking lot.  But I never heard of renting a shopping cart for a quarter.

We don't even have parking meters.  Not even downtown.

I've been away from the big city for so long...almost 25 years now.  I hope never to have to go back a beehive or anthill.

Noel

Edited December 14, 20214 yr by birdguy

3 minutes ago, birdguy said:

But I never heard of renting a shopping cart for a quarter.

The fun starts when you realise you don't have a quarter. In my case (No Frills in Toronto), the shopping cart requires a dollar coin.

As I recall, SpaceX offered 30% or some such figure over the market value to most of the residents of the village who didn't want to deal with the notices to leave their residences due to potential overpressure events, or let them stay if they were willing to put up with it. Boca Chica is home to several spaceflight enthusiasts who have not sold out to SpaceX, and are only too delighted to be up so close to the making of history. Many of them run very active youtube and twitter accounts with cameras all over the site, to such an extent that Elon himself finds their live feeds useful to keep tabs on how things are going when he isn't present and has publicly stated as such on his personal twitter.

2 hours ago, birdguy said:

Well, you're helping out Doug.  Admirable.  But I'll still give a buck if it's handy.

Noel

The only folks to whom I give money are the ones with a dog (or cat). McDonalds won't take care of that.

3 hours ago, JB3DG said:

As I recall, SpaceX offered 30% or some such figure over the market value to most of the residents of the village who didn't want to deal with the notices to leave their residences

I wouldn't take 100% over the appraised value of my house.  I've been living in it for 25 years.  My wife and I have put a lot into and into the yard.  It's a large yard since we are on a double lot.  I like my neighbors and the neighborhood.  I'm across the street from one of our city's largest parks.  The house is a part of us.  Realtors and appraisers just look at cold values.  They don't give a dam what you've put into it or how much you love it.  Nor does the guy who wants you out of the way.

Noel 

4 hours ago, dmwalker said:

In my case (No Frills in Toronto), the shopping cart requires a dollar coin.

A looney Dougald.

I gotta tell what I did after I got back from out trip to Canada.  We entered Canada from New York and then drove south to Toronto where we spent a couple of days.  Went up CN Tower.  Then we drove west stopping at Saulte St Marie, Thunder Bay, Winnepeg, Saskatoon and Edmonton where stayed a couple of days visiting an internet friend.  He gave me an aerial tour of Edmonton in a Cessna 182.  Then we drove to Lethbridge to visit another internet friend.

After we got home I had about 30 Canadian dollars in paper money. 

I googled the Vancouver white pages and picked a name and address and mailed them the money without a return address or a note or anything else.  Only the money was in the envelope.  Of course the envelope had a Roswell NM postmark but nothing else.  I'll bet they still talk about that eh.

I still have Canadian coins in a desk drawer including a looney and a twooney.

Noel

16 hours ago, birdguy said:

SpaceX is a private company and if I'm not happy about it speak to my government?

 

You've taken a number of sentences, eliminated the ones in the middle, and joined two together.

SpaceX is a private company.

NASA at the behest of your government is employing that private company to put the first women and next man on the Moon. And also for a future mission to Mars. So yes, if you aren't happy then you should complain to your government and tell them not to buy that product.

As for the goal of making mankind a multiplanetary species, that is the gaol of Elon Musk. Ive not heard your government comment on this and no, they aren't spending your tax dollars on it.

Putting Musk's (and Zubrin's) making mankind a multiplanetary species aside for a moment and considering if your governments goal of going back to the Moon and on to mars is a good thing to back:   The Moon has many resources we will need in the future, including Helium 3 that is an ideal fuel for Nuclear Fusion. It's relatively easy to get there. There's valuable science that could be furthered there (including space telescopes) in fact we have merely scratched the surface in terms of the knowledge that could be gained from Moon exploration. Its ability to act as a testing ground for missions further afield.  And the other reason is political of course, in that both the Russians and Chinese are interested in the Moon, and the last thing we need is an imbalance in terms of a Russian and Chinese presence and no US presence. That would be very dodgy indeed in terms of the balance of power.

Its also worth remembering hat a multitude of quite wonderful technological innovations were spawned by the Apollo missions to the Moon, including Cat Scanners that save lives. So yes, we can expect further technological developments as a result of our endeavours on the Moon and Mars and beyond.

 

16 hours ago, birdguy said:

I'm not a big fan of spaceflight; government or private.  It's an extravagance that ignores the problems on earth.

 

It doesn't ignore the problems on Earth, many of the satellites in orbit now are monitoring the planet and helping to gather further science in regard to the threat of climate change.  

And no its not an extravagance, its as valuable technology. Try telling the military, the merchant navy, airliners, private citizens in their boats, ambulances, the police, you on a weekend trip, that GPS is now offline because Noel doesn't like spaceflight and many of you can drown at sea.  🙄

Valuable remote sensing makes up one third of all satellites.

Space helps connect the remaining 49% of the world without connectivity. And lack of connectivity costs lives. 

Almost all SDG's (Sustainable Development Goals) benefit from space technology.

Over 100 satellites have been launched just to monitor our atmosphere.

Solar energy forecast quality boosted 30% by space technology

Space tech provides spatial information regarding food production precision irrigation and farming techniques.

Earth observation and global positioning tools have been developed to display real time cartography of infectious disease locations.

Satellites help stop illegal logging illegal fishing and illegal wildlife trade.

I could go on all day but I'll leave it there.

And finally, if you'd like to google the benefits that have come from the Apollo program you will be very surprised.

So no, its not an extravagance and its not a "bit of fun" for billionaires. Its a vital industry. 

 

 

 

15 hours ago, dmwalker said:

So, will the Mars colonisation be controlled and operated by the US government with, probably, military personnel in command 

 

We don't know, colonisation is some years away. The US government, as far as I know, hasn't commented on or expressed interest in Mars colonisation. They are just employing private industry to get us the the Moon again and Mars later.

So the only difference between Apollo and the forthcoming Mars and Moon missions is that private industry is being employed to do it, because its faster and cheaper and more efficient. 

 

Quote

Musk's only involvement will be providing the spaceship?

 

Correct. 

 

Quote

I suppose this is the new space race. If the US doesn't set up some sort of colony soon, China will do it first in 2033.

 

Looks like it yes. China aims to send its first crewed mission to Mars in 2033. And they're working on a manned Moon lander now.