23 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

As you can see, my glass is definitely half empty I just wanted to provide examples of how easily something can bug me in a flight simulator. These are issues that many of you will probably think are so minor that they are not worth worrying about. The problem is that I do worry about them. They make me feel uncomfortable, and dent my enthusiasm whenever I encounter them.

I wouldn't recommend to move to MSFS2024 either, so better to stay with your glass of water the way it's now.

 FS2024 is for me  "The Super Mario " version Game of the moment!!!. I have never seen so many photos of bugs in my life on social networks  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is counted in hundreds, thousands, millions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ????? all completely different and completely random! 

Today the glass is completely empty!!!!! and the dust accumulates day by day...

Even if iFS2024 is magnificent, (Fortunately!!!!!! at the price it costs, in euros and in frustration) I'm not going to waste my time on something like that!  There is no longer any room for debate! 

I can't even understand how a company could let this happen.It goes beyond the scope of the definition of professionalism.

although I am aware that this will be resolved after several months given the scale of the problem that doesn't excuse anything

 

 

As far as I'm concerned now i use FS2020 - Fenix A319 -Active Sky - Beyond ATC - FSLTL Traffic -Google Map Enhancement .The incredible balance of pleasure . And I fly more than 100 hours per month!

 

On 12/25/2024 at 8:22 AM, filou said:

And I fly more than 100 hours per month!

Are you retired?  Somewhat jealous you have that much free time.

600 fixes, none of them hitting the bigger issues (ATC not even close to real world, Weather/Winds so far off from reality and with seemingly zero impact to fuel and flight dynamics and ground friction) ... perhaps I'm just getting to old to wait another 20 years for a competent flight simulator ... I'll probably be wearing "depend for men" by then.  

Started flight simulation in 1982 ... some 42 years later and I have the nerve to be picky about bugs and lack of accurate implementations ... shame on me.

On 12/28/2024 at 1:01 AM, CO2Neutral said:

Are you retired?  Somewhat jealous you have that much free time.

600 fixes, none of them hitting the bigger issues (ATC not even close to real world, Weather/Winds so far off from reality and with seemingly zero impact to fuel and flight dynamics and ground friction) ... perhaps I'm just getting to old to wait another 20 years for a competent flight simulator ... I'll probably be wearing "depend for men" by then.  

Started flight simulation in 1982 ... some 42 years later and I have the nerve to be picky about bugs and lack of accurate implementations ... shame on me.

No wife, no children.  for the rest I organized myself. I chose my life as close as possible to who I am. an air simulation enthusiast. I currently fly with Airbus Fenix, Active sky and Beyondatc. It allows me another level of reality that I appreciate. All these hours that I spend flying on FS2024 allow me to realize that FS2024 in addition to its speed of execution, its good performance if you are well equipped... and its additional lipstick for an attractive effect is really average everywhere. Even the improved Google Map does much better in many places in terms of high definition of the ground. The overall color of FS2024 also looks very artificial (Cartoon). In any case, they have achieved a great masterstroke. I now doubt their passion for doing things well.  FS2024 is definitely a big disappointment. I'm waiting for a miracle.

On 12/27/2024 at 5:01 PM, CO2Neutral said:

perhaps I'm just getting to old to wait another 20 years for a competent flight simulator

Wouldn't XP12 address that for you?

3 hours ago, Noel said:

Wouldn't XP12 address that for you?

Unfortunately no ... tried Pilot2ATC (supports all the sims), and Stick and Rudder, VATSIM, PilotEdge etc.  VATSIM and PilotEdge are about the closest since they are human, but they make frequent mistakes, sometimes just never respond, spotty area coverage, etc.  It really needs to be a separate computer with many cores looking at route schedules and airports globally in real-time (takes a lot of processing power) to determine weather delay, reroutes, closed runways, TFRs, traffic density, etc.  It's not trivial and I understand that ... but I'm willing to pay to get a good ATC simulator.

Same for flight physics processing, when using 10G or higher network (each to trunk to 20G and even 100G), such physics processing in real time is better suited to another computer to do all the processing and xfer data the main graphics processing "master" PC that will handle the graphics side.

Steaming scenery isn't the answer, I have good ISP speed into my home and that seems to make no difference at all to MSFS scenery loading, still blurry and melted ... only when I fly around in circles does it resolve as it gets cached.  But the cache clears to often and new areas to fly are a horrible blurry mess again.  My ISP speed:

 

I pay for 1.2G (get almost 1.3G) and my ISP modem has a 2.5G port which runs to my 10G switch and all my NICs are 10G.  Housing scenery data on my NAS is a far better option for me.

I know I'm not alone, there are many of us in my circle of friends that have plenty of disposable income for this "hobby" but no place to spend it to get the desired experience.  Yes, we're niche, but so is flight simulation ... always has been and always will be.  I'd just like to see an "option" for those of us wanting more instead of always be forced to whatever works on a console or cheap PC because that is deemed the best "sales" target by marketing people that pay for data that suggests it is the only option.

 

1 hour ago, CO2Neutral said:

Unfortunately no ... tried Pilot2ATC (supports all the sims), and Stick and Rudder, VATSIM, PilotEdge etc.  VATSIM and PilotEdge are about the closest since they are human, but they make frequent mistakes, sometimes just never respond, spotty area coverage, etc.  It really needs to be a separate computer with many cores looking at route schedules and airports globally in real-time (takes a lot of processing power) to determine weather delay, reroutes, closed runways, TFRs, traffic density, etc.  It's not trivial and I understand that ... but I'm willing to pay to get a good ATC simulator.

Same for flight physics processing, when using 10G or higher network (each to trunk to 20G and even 100G), such physics processing in real time is better suited to another computer to do all the processing and xfer data the main graphics processing "master" PC that will handle the graphics side.

Steaming scenery isn't the answer, I have good ISP speed into my home and that seems to make no difference at all to MSFS scenery loading, still blurry and melted ... only when I fly around in circles does it resolve as it gets cached.  But the cache clears to often and new areas to fly are a horrible blurry mess again.  My ISP speed:

 

I pay for 1.2G (get almost 1.3G) and my ISP modem has a 2.5G port which runs to my 10G switch and all my NICs are 10G.  Housing scenery data on my NAS is a far better option for me.

I know I'm not alone, there are many of us in my circle of friends that have plenty of disposable income for this "hobby" but no place to spend it to get the desired experience.  Yes, we're niche, but so is flight simulation ... always has been and always will be.  I'd just like to see an "option" for those of us wanting more instead of always be forced to whatever works on a console or cheap PC because that is deemed the best "sales" target by marketing people that pay for data that suggests it is the only option.

 

It's good to read a few lines of your comment. It's full of truth. I feel so much like I'm flying in an unbalanced world. It's so frustrating. Fortunately there are some supplements to raise the level. I am ready to pay a monthly subscription to erase all this childishness.

2 hours ago, CO2Neutral said:

Unfortunately no ... tried Pilot2ATC (supports all the sims), and Stick and Rudder, VATSIM, PilotEdge etc.  VATSIM and PilotEdge are about the closest since they are human, but they make frequent mistakes, sometimes just never respond, spotty area coverage, etc.  It really needs to be a separate computer with many cores looking at route schedules and airports globally in real-time (takes a lot of processing power) to determine weather delay, reroutes, closed runways, TFRs, traffic density, etc.  It's not trivial and I understand that ... but I'm willing to pay to get a good ATC simulator.

What about BATC?  Seems like it's getting there in large part already.

What would XP12 and beyond need to do to allow you to be able to use your $$ to expand your experience or what have you, to meet your minimum acceptable standard let's say?

1 hour ago, filou said:

 I am ready to pay a monthly subscription to erase all this childishness.

I'm not quite sure there is consensus on what constitutes a desktop flight sim that would meet pretty much everyone's minimum acceptable standard, emphasis on acceptable.  I would absolutely pay a monthly subscription to have access to a more advanced and complete product.  One glaring problem though has to do w/ performance considerations.  Custom setups could involve multiple high end PCs integrated but the market for that can't be very large.   For me streaming scenery is a giant plus so I don't have interest in XP12 because of this mostly.   

It's also very easy to imagine perfection, to see what's falling short.  The problem is you have constraints imposed by performance considerations, not to mention budget.  So it's a balancing act and a challenging one for certain.

On 12/24/2024 at 5:00 AM, Christopher Low said:

Since I am a "glass half empty" kind of guy, I thought that I would bring a bit of balance to the Force on this forum by listing some of the (relatively minor) niggles that still bug me in MSFS 2020...

• missing sections of procedural grass at airports
• visible horizon line through mountains at low sun elevations
• land bars across lakes and coastal areas (river mouths/harbours etc)
• thin black lines in water (to be fair, I have only seen this once in the twelve months that I have used MSFS 2020, but it surprised and annoyed me)
• low resolution vector data in Greenland, including misalignment of vector data with lake boundaries)
• black lakes in northerly latitudes (no OSM data for certain bodies of water; examples can be seen near EFIV Ivalo in Finland, and ESNQ Kiruna in Sweden)
• bleed through of generic terrain textures in extensive ice covered areas of Iceland
• DEM issues with some small islands and cliffs (high resolution data fails to load until the user is almost on top of them)
• poor autogen rendition of circular oil tanks

The following are issues with specific airports, or missing features that I think should have been included...

• no solar panels in the fields next to the runway 08 threshold @ UK2000 EGHH Bournemouth
• misaligned runway centreline markings @ IniBuilds EGHI Southampton (I have been informed that this is being addressed, so hopefully this will be sorted very soon)
• two land bars across Southampton Water directly underneath the runway 02 approach @ IniBuilds EGHI Southampton
• generic aircraft models used at Cornwall Aviation Heritage Centre @ UK2000 EGHQ Newquay
• no solar panels @ UK2000 EGHQ Newquay
• poor parallax textures @ er.....some airports
• generic aircraft models used at Solway Aviation Museum @ UK2000 EGNC Carlisle
• ORBx removed the 3D model of the Granton Gas Holder in ORBx Great Britain North (because the PG one was preferred; that does not help non PG users)
• visible line between mismatched BING aerial images that runs between EGSU Duxford and EGSS London Stansted in England
• small messed up section of Bing aerial images west of EGSU Duxford
• blurred BING aerial textures south west of LFRB Brest Bretagne airport (apparently a French naval dockyard; there are other areas, but this one annoys me because of its relative proximity to one of my payware airports)
• misaligned runway centreline markings @ Pilot Experience LFRB Brest Bretagne
• misaligned runway centreline markings @ MK Studios EIDW Dublin v2 (a fix is apparently in the works, but no sign of it yet)
• DEM issues short of both runway thresholds @ 29 Palms LGMK Mykonos (a fix is apparently due shortly)
• DEM issues @ ORBx ESMS Malmo (recently reported and confirmed by the developer)

This final one is more a wish for an update than anything else....

• no terminal interior modelling @ Asobo EIDL Donegal

 

As you can see, my glass is definitely half empty I just wanted to provide examples of how easily something can bug me in a flight simulator. These are issues that many of you will probably think are so minor that they are not worth worrying about. The problem is that I do worry about them. They make me feel uncomfortable, and dent my enthusiasm whenever I encounter them.

Contact details for good psychiatrists are more than welcome

Oh, and Merry Christmas!

 

I mean, if THAT is all you have to worry about, life is pretty dang good! 😁👍

On 12/25/2024 at 6:21 AM, Christopher Low said:

I forgot to mention the ridiculous number of trees. As an example, I was on final approach to runway 12 at EGPK Prestwick last night. This took me right over the top of Royal Troon golf course (one of the famous collection of courses that hosts the British Open). Now, this is a links course in the real world, with hardly a tree in sight. Unfortunately, the MSFS 2020 version (and I am guessing that it will be no different in MSFS 2024) looks more like a parkland course, with a significant number of trees lining many of the fairways.

Not a disaster by any means (and certainly nowhere near as much of an issue as those annoying land bars), but still something that needs to be sorted out.

 

Most of  the stuff in your first post I can live with but as you say, the trees is a biggie.

I mainly fly from out of the way small strips and the majority of such in Europe have trees all over the shop with many placed so as to make the airstrip practically unusable and many parts of the landscape very over - populated with trees (I do wish reality would become more like the sim in that instance)

I've read that its to do with the software mistaking sat imagery of bushes and shrubs for trees and auto generating them, but I have no knowledge of that subject just second hand statements

Little change with 2024 I gather.

 

Luckily there are some great community addons and fixes for some of the airstrips and areas

 

Current MSFS 2020 players (steam) - 5940
Current MSFS 2024 players (steam) - 3570

Personally my MSFS 2020 cup overfloweth and my 2024 cup lays empty, cracked, with a big chip in it like the chip on my shoulder.  

If BATC or FSHud worked with XPlane I would give it a try.  

Edited December 30, 20241 yr by Langeveldt

My MSFS 2020 cup is definitely overflowing, and I do not even have an MSFS 2024 cup!

16 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

My MSFS 2020 cup is definitely overflowing, and I do not even have an MSFS 2024 cup!

Wait so, are you overflowing or half empty? 

I am trying to be positive!

Edited December 30, 20241 yr by Christopher Low