1 hour ago, JYW said:

Unfortunately from my perspective, while it is based on the M500, more has been removed than added.

It flies well and the sounds are great. But personally I'm disappointed and regret the purchase. I would simply never choose to fly this over the M500. To me it feels like a default aircraft level, 'lite' version of the full-featured M500.

So let's think back to the $45 FSW Legacy last month at 24 hours after release. It was an absolute dumpster fire for over a week, and even once the handling was decent-ish, there were quite a few systems fixes that had to be implemented, etc.

I've only done 2 ultra-short hops so far, and so far I'd rate the $25 M600 a heckuva lot higher than the $45 Legacy at a similar point in time.

While I am indeed concerned that the 1st Party Status might lead to an addon that isn't fixed as quickly as FSW fixed theirs (etc), I think it's appropriate we let this bake for awhile, figure out what's really a permanent issue vs just some Day 1 bugs and such, and revel in the realization that at $16.49, it costs way less than many trash addons. 🤙

In the meantime, I'm going to pay attention to a new and stunningly well modeled bird to give Asobo and FSR a reasonable amount of time to figure things out 😎👍

Edited yesterday at 09:06 PM1 day by UrgentSiesta

2 hours ago, JYW said:

To me it feels like a default aircraft level, 'lite' version of the full-featured M500.

I agree. It definitely feels closer to the standard TBM 930 than the excellent FSR M500. However, it is still an enjoyable add-on, especially at this low price.

34 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

I don't think it's a fair comparison as the M500 is strictly an FSReborn product. The M600 is, well, made for Microsoft, on behalf of FSReborn. It's intentionally made at a certain standard (set by Microsoft).

I want to just mention something to be transparent before I say the next part. I was offered a free copy of the Phenom 300E with the intention that I would make some free community paints - which I happily did, and thought that was a very reasonable offer from Raul. I've met Raul yesterday at the Expo (and again today). He is a wonderful human overall. Aside from this, I've got no other connection to FSReborn. I own most of their products which I purchased myself (aside from the Phenom). I've also painted a few FSR500 paints for free (but did not receive the FSR500 for free)- I love that aircraft - bought with my own hard earned cash.

Anyway, I actually met Jorg yesterday as well - he is also a wonderful human. I jokingly said I bought 2024 on Day 2 - because well, we all know what happened on day 1 - and he LAUGHED! Not like a nervous laugh, a real laugh - he's really down to earth and he's passionate about the MSFS franchise. There's so much legal red tape and garbage that we mere mortal simmers are not privy to (and that's fine). Now this part is my rant: It is not against FSR but more directed towards Microsoft. In my opinion, Microsoft is strongly advising developers with whom they have a close relationship to, to "downgrade" the quality of textures, in favor of console. Xbox S and X CANNOT run 2024 the way a PC with a RTX 5090 and 9800X3D with 64GB ram will ever be able to (or even a much more mid tier system like my 12700K and RTX 4080). I'm really EFFING tired of PC users getting visually downgraded products because of Xbox. But my 8utt-hurt feelings don't matter because money always comes first. I'm saying this honestly...because Microsoft is a business and they need to make money. The Xbox (and now PS5) sales ARE THE REASON WE STILL HAVE MSFS. This is not conjecture, it is a fact, stated by multiple 1st party persons. The Phenom released with beautiful 4k textures - and Raul HAD TO reduce them to 2k. The amount of console complainers was through the roof! Its a poopy situation for us niche PC people... but he had no choice. The same happened on the M600. It was created with beautiful 4k textures. It HAD TO be reduced to 2k to save VRAM on Xbox.

How does it compare to the M500? Some things are better like the G3000, Garmin GI-275 stby gauge, autothrottle and autoland (HALO), the 5 bladed prop with different performance characteristics, the M600 is a little faster in climb and cruise. IMHO, t's not as well-rounded as the M500. It was never intended to be! I'm just going to speak plainly here. I believe the developers of these "joint-style" addons are meant to create watered down versions. If FSR made an FSR600, it wouldn't have looked like this. Things were designed at a certain level, a level much lower than the FSR500, intentionally - this level is set by Microsoft and NOT FSReborn. And to make matters more difficult...textures were downgraded even more... so we have what could have been a visually stunning addon, dropped to almost pre-MSFS visuals (in a few areas but the majority is MSFS standard imo).

I still think the asking price is well worth it. IMO it's not that buggy like some are claiming. It may be a streaming issue as TimHH was showing me a pic of his plane and his AP modes were all working fine. Some of the complaints are user errors. There was a guy on their discord saying it went left on takeoff. AHHH...yeah derp derp dude! It's a massive engine with a lot of torque!

I agree entirely.

And after having been satisfied with the FSR500 and now the FSR Phenom (both of which I consider to be UNDER-priced relative to their peers), I don’t have any issue with Raul (or Jorg!).

And since this is Day 1.5, I’m just not sussed over the noted or suspected issues so far.

My main observation so far, though, is that the Expert Series doesn’t have a great track record so far…

Let’s hold hope that the M600 has its legitimate issues fixed far sooner than the ATR did.🙏

IMHO, those of us who’re going to be hyper critical of addons should really just wait at least a month before buying. There are ALWAYS going to be issues, esp just a couple days in.

1 hour ago, UrgentSiesta said:

IMHO, those of us who’re going to be hyper critical of addons should really just wait at least a month before buying. There are ALWAYS going to be issues, esp just a couple days in.

I have come to the same conclusion, just give the developers some time to get wider feedback and make changes. I basically never buy things on the first or second day anymore as too many times I have judged wrong, made wrong decision and never used the addon again. I am pretty discerning with the aircraft I fly and if it doesn't measure up I inevitably retire it.

I actually hope Raul revisits the M500 and brings it to native 2024 and maybe even adds the missing standby instruments.

1 hour ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Microsoft. In my opinion, Microsoft is strongly advising developers with whom they have a close relationship to, to "downgrade" the quality of textures, in favor of console.

This has been evident for quite some time, it is the way it is and is going to remain. As you said Ryan, without a shadow of a doubt, the only reason we have this platform is because of consoles and so in the end for practical and legitimate business reasons they need to come first, I have no issue with that. It was interesting to hear Jorg during his presentation refer to how careful they are being with PlayStation so as to conform to Sony's requirements and not upset them; they are clearly putting real effort into this and developing for it. The direction of X-Box Studios is to become platform agnostic, to get their games on more and more consoles, it is the direction we are going and it is what makes this possible.

I got a new rig last year, actually November 2024, and I deliberately did not get a 4090 and after debating it did not even get a 4080. I went with a 4070 Super because it was clear the additional capability was not really going to be worth it in MSFS and I do not need that kind of power for anything else I do. I run MSFS in 2K with high and ultra settings and am very happy with the look and performance. It probably saved me 1,500 dollars and I am actually quite happy about that. I think the days of purchasing very high end hardware to run flight simulation are past, it is just not worth it (well not sure about X-Plane requirements and I am sure P3D still needs a monster machine and adjustments to the infinity mask). I kind of wish they could find a way to adjust settings higher for those of us on PC but they do not seem open to that and it may not even be very practical, I don't know.

11 minutes ago, Cognita said:

I think the days of purchasing very high end hardware to run flight simulation are past, it is just not worth it (well not sure about X-Plane requirements and I am sure P3D still needs a monster machine and adjustments to the infinity mask). I kind of wish they could find a way to adjust settings higher for those of us on PC but they do not seem open to that and it may not even be very practical, I don't know.

Oh, believe me, monster spec machines are still great for other simulators!

But in the end, they all have significant issues: XP is still relatively slow despite the recent significant multicore improvements, DCSW has quite a few rather fundamental shortcomings (like no realistic weather(!)), and P3D still looks way behind the times (I would’ve even bought v6, but there’s only a literal few addons that are compatible).

In the end, I’m getting to where MSFS is the best overall experience for me aside from air combat.

And even on the rare occasion I get genuinely frustrated, I just remember that flight sim is absolutely better than it’s ever been.

In re the FSR500, I can’t see Raul doing a v2 of that just because of the overlap with M600, but it’d be great if he did. And as usual, I’d be happy to throw him some money to do it.

In sum, the 600 is good enough for me to keep flying it and try to advise MS on what really needs to be fixed. For e.g., I do notice significantly LESS drag when fully configured on this 600 than with the 500 - and the 500 itself didn’t have nearly enough drag. As such, it’s fairly difficult to get it slowed down on approach, when the prop at idle should be acting like a giant speed brake.

Let’s see where it shakes out in the next month or two. 🤙

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

I see the same low res skins, EXCEPT with the Default FS Reborn skin - that doesnt' seem to be affected in the same way.

That is a lot lower than my plane is. I run HIGH textures as well. @JYW

11 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

That is a lot lower than my plane is. I run HIGH textures as well. @JYW

I did a local install like I usually do, but yeah, I’m still seeing those jaggies.

I’ll do a reinstall Monday-ish and see if that shakes anything loose.

In the meantime, I can’t see the low res livery from the PIC seat, so no harm for now 😁

12 hours ago, JYW said:

I think there's a major issue with LODs (for at least some users, on some configs)

This is with texture resolution set to HIGH in MSFS2024. (Note that the decals textures are fine. But take a look at the stripes on this default livery 🫢)

I don't use MSFS dynamic mode, nor AutoFPS, so nothing is 'pulling' the quality down here. In these pics I had 39.9 FPS (locked to 40) with frame gen giving an effective 79 FPS.

I was expecting an upgrade to the M500 which I generally enjoy. In all honesty it's a huge downgrade and I'd say that unless you really need a few extra knots, this purchase is not worth it, if you have the M500. For the £23 I paid for this in it's current form, I'd rate it 2 stars.

It's a downgrade to the M500 in terms of textures, functions, immersion and bugs. It's an upgrade in sounds.

Something is extra bad on your end. I also run HIGH textures. Mine are acceptable - not as nice as I'd prefer, and I make my painters higher res. But this is what I see. The interior is the same as yours though.

[url= by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/185132751@N02/]Ryan Butterworth[/url], on Flickr

Edited 21 hours ago21 hr by ryanbatc

Just a head's up regarding textures.... ULTRA vs HIGH is a large difference on the glareshield for some reason. ULTRA doesn't seem to affect much else vs high (exterior is the same) but the glareshield area is right in your face so people would instantly see it pretty low res at HIGH.

(kinda hard to see with tiny pics on the forum now ARGH!)

[url=

by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/185132751@N02/]Ryan Butterworth[/url], on Flickr

[url= by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/185132751@N02/]Ryan Butterworth[/url], on Flickr

18 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

Just a head's up regarding textures.... ULTRA vs HIGH is a large difference on the glareshield for some reason. ULTRA doesn't seem to affect much else vs high (exterior is the same) but the glareshield area is right in your face so people would instantly see it pretty low res at HIGH.

(kinda hard to see with tiny pics on the forum now ARGH!)

[url=

by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/185132751@N02/]Ryan Butterworth[/url], on Flickr

[url= by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/185132751@N02/]Ryan Butterworth[/url], on Flickr

Ryan, fwiw, the links to external / enlarged don’t seem to be working (for me, at least).

many thanks for sharing!

13 minutes ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Ryan, fwiw, the links to external / enlarged don’t seem to be working (for me, at least).

many thanks for sharing!

Yeah something changed at this site... it no longer allows for large photos or being able to click the link. I wonder if its a loading time thing. It's weird I can embed it but no one can click on the pic to enlarge

5 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

Yeah something changed at this site... it no longer allows for large photos or being able to click the link. I wonder if its a loading time thing. It's weird I can embed it but no one can click on the pic to enlarge

I’m still sharing same way from Google Photos - seems to work same as before…

Been using the Garmin Autoland and the HALO™ Safety System in the Expert Series 2: Piper M600-when I pressed Autoland to land me at Northolt AB, instead of landing neatly on the runaway, the M600 veered towards a photogrammetry spike, whoops.

No such whoops with an autoland at YSSY though.

I would have happily paid the same money to have a 2024 native version of the M500 instead. Is it ever going to be updated? I keep reading that the developer is a perfectionist but they seem to be happy to keep the 500 within 2020 limits when 2024 offers so much more.

The M500 is at least three years old now. He can't keep updating everything for free when he has new planes to build.