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Mike T

Simulate THIS!

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How many times do we like to fly that hairy approach with nasty crosswinds and driving rain? Well, the question is can YOU do it in real life? http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/03/03...lane/index.htmlHe couldn't! :-lolEDIT: Late breaking news: Lufthansa maintenance teams report that both pilot's seat cushions were mysteriously missing. Later, both pilots complained of pain in their lower bodies and both seat cushions were found and removed from the pilot's lower intestine via emergency surgery. Both pilots are recovering and resting comfortably (on their stomachs) :-lolRegards,Mike T.

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Looks like both wings scraped, left first and then the right. I would say he tried to straighten out too soon, before his main gear touched down. Helluva crosswind though!

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I think he did a pretty #### good job... hats of to the guys dont have the option to reset the flight...rob

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How would you like to be a passenger on that flight?Can just imagine....Captain: 'ooops, sorry bout that, we are going to circle and try that again'...:D

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first - WOWI think the pilot kicked the rudder at about the right time. But that BIG left bank screwed up everything. I doubt the pilot did it. It could be the strong xwind lifting up the right wing once the relative wind changed with that rudder input.Oh well if there is one thing in life that's easier said than done that would be xwind landing. :)Jason

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You can see a gust of wind, right before he tries to touch down. Knocked the plane off it's track, he should have went around at that point I think.Not that I have never done worse in flight simulator.

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>first - WOW>>I think the pilot kicked the rudder at about the right time.>But that BIG left bank screwed up everything. I doubt the>pilot did it. It could be the strong xwind lifting up the>right wing once the relative wind changed with that rudder>input....Could be, I suppose. But isn't the left bank, as you say, a result of the pilot taking away the crab/ferry angle that he had maintained right until then? I mean the crab/ferry angle was countering the strong crosswing forces pretty well until he straightened out. Then, there was nothing countering the strong wind anymore and the forces of the wind began to effect the plane in other ways, such as lifting the winward wing. In other footage, I've seen the pilot maintain an impressive crab/ferry angle a great distance down the runway after touchdown to continue counteract the crosswind. I'm no pilot or an expert by any stretch, so my comments are meant as a learning/discussion point only.

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When you straighten out the crab angle you are supposed to bank into the wind, which in this case should have been a right bank. That's why I thought it was the wind not the pilot. Yes I've seen footages of airlines touching down with significant crab angles. I believe their landing gears are designed to take that within the max demonstrated xwind components. Another reason I think liners land crabed is that their wings are so low and so long they can't bank much to counter xwind, otherwise you will get what's in the video on your wing tip or engine.>>Could be, I suppose. But isn't the left bank, as you say, a>result of the pilot taking away the crab/ferry angle that he>had maintained right until then? I mean the crab/ferry angle>was countering the strong crosswing forces pretty well until>he straightened out. Then, there was nothing countering the>strong wind anymore and the forces of the wind began to effect>the plane in other ways, such as lifting the winward wing. In>other footage, I've seen the pilot maintain an impressive>crab/ferry angle a great distance down the runway after>touchdown to continue counteract the crosswind. I'm no pilot>or an expert by any stretch, so my comments are meant as a>learning/discussion point only.

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Looks like he had a joystick calibration problem. :)Thanks for sharing.Dave Vega

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Or maybe he had the Wilco software installed :) ... sorry guys I dont mind the Wilco bus too much after the latest patches

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I actually was trying to last night because Hamburg is my home town, and I got challenged to do it.

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It's the word "try" that worries you isn't it?Once suffered an aborted take-off on a BA flight from Heathrow.We parked on a taxi way and the pilot came on to say "we hard a warning light there, so we are just going to sit here a moment and see if we can work out what it means"I had visions of a very dusty handbook being pulled out from under the co-pilot's seat.A few minutes later "Well, we THINK we are OK and are going to go back to the runway and TRY again".After that, perfect flight!

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>It's the word "try" that worries you isn't it?I agree, knowledge is the remedy to anxiety. On a Lufthansa flight just before take-off the pilot announced that there was a problem with the flaps and that they were going to "try" to figure it out. After 15 minutes we were airborne, my friend next to me was very uncomfortable during the entire 1 hour 30 minute flight. I however was sure that everything was o.k since our flight wasn't cancelled in the first place.The point is, I knew back then what I know now, these pilots esp. in major airlines undergo serious training. The dude in command in this video knows exactly what he's doing, he must have done it before not to mention harsher simulation tests. However mother nature can be full of suprises, here as a last minute gust.Hats off to all the pilots to whom I have enormous respect after simming and trying to land in similar conditions. I would also like to "rendre hommage" to the folks who avoided a catastrophy by landing without engines at Heathrow.BTW, concerning the latest news Mike has given to us, does anybody know the condition of the cushions, I bet Lufthansa will want them back:-lol Thanks for the link and humour.regards

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Though weird thing is, Activesky has nothing extraordinary saved. If you load any time between 11 and 14h UTC, and LH44 was actually scheduled to land at 12:20 or 12:30 (both are scheduled as LH44, according to Lufthansa timetable), you will see mostly winds up to 30knots. Though reported winds go up to 250km/h. What's with that, anyone know why?

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Weather at the time.EDDH 011220Z 29028G48KT 9000 -SHRA FEW011 BKN014 07/05 Q0984 TEMPO 29035G55KT 4000 SHRA BKN008 So winds were 290/28 knots gusting to 48 knots. Dont believe the rubbish you read in the press.Rob

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Uh yeah, okay, but that landing, it looked like stonger winds than G55. Not that I am talking out of experience, but what's your opinion?

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It looks like when he kicked off the drift he didn't add enough right Aileron leaving the right wing slightly high. and a combination of bad luck when the gust hit the right wing. The A320 switches to normal law below 50ft (or maybe it's 30ft) and from what I have heard a lot of pilots dont like the Airbus logic in strong crosswinds. I'm not a Pro so again I say hats off to those guys... I would have slammed the Thrust levers to TOGA at 500ftRob

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Haha, my friend told me about that this morning.It's definatly a good thing the pilot did a go-around, otherwise that could of ended terribly!

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He did not lower his upwind wing enough to negate the drift from the crosswind a big mistake, and after this he actually managed to show some skill with the recovery he made, and believe me it is horrible to land a commersial jet with this stupid sidestick they decided to put in the airbus

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The sidestick is not the problem.... If you speak to most real world pilots they will tell you flying with a sidestick is a lot simpler then a control yoke. The Problem is with the ELAC Logic behind the scenes. If you search online you will find a story about a Emirates A340 departing from FAJS or FACT the Pilot pulled back to Rotate and the Aircraft did nothing.. the Aircraft decided his rotation rate was incorrect and rejected it! In the end the pilot WAS in the wrong as he was rotating following the Flight director (You should never do this in any aircraft) However this causes a big debate about having to reject a lot of things you have learnt when flying other aircraft that are less forgiving.People bash airbus all the time but if you understand the system logic you will be fine.Rob

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Hello all,I'm no expert but instead of blaming the Airbus technology (which has I believe fully proven itself over the years) shouldn't we debate about why the airport was not closed.Isn't 48KTS gustling crosswind above landing limitations?Regards

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I have felt for some time that too much onus is put upon the pilot about landing decisions in bad weather or ground conditions that are not either fully understood by the pilot, or explained by ATC.I think some decisions by ATC are more to do with having business as a priority rather than safety. In this case, why was this runway assigned as the active when there was an alternative safer runway available.Sure, diverting is not an ideal "business" solution, but the safety of the passengers and crew should ALWAYS be the first priority, and the landing and takeoff of aircraft shoud be considered more of a partnership between ATC and the pilot and not the pilot's sole responsibility.Ron

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The Pilot in command is just that. In command and fully responsible for himself the aircraft and anyone else on board, he has the final say. Weather conditions should always be fully understood by the pilot, if not he has no business being on the flightdeck. If anything, pressure comes from the Airlines and sometimes from pilot Ego, If the guy in front got her down safely then so can I. Also dont quote me on this but I'm fairly sure the Alternate runway was LOC only and did not provide glide path. Also the runway was a lot shorter.

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