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tjeuten

Help me decide: Eaglesoft Citation X 2.0 or PMDG 737-NGX

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Ok guys, please don't stop reading at the title and just say "oh well no doubt the 737"... I know from reading various comments all over the Internet that this is probably the best addon out there for FSX, but please consider my situation: I am not a real world pilot. I have spent the last year or so getting busy with FSX, reading books and articles about aviation and FSX, and I've learned a fair bit about VFR and IFR procedures (STARS, SIDS, Instrument Approaches, ...). I've been spending this year learning this stuff flying props and turboprops, mainly the Duke B60, Turbine Duke and PMDG JS4100, and I'm now fairly acquainted to them. I think I've reached a point where I want to move up to flying something with some more power and range, so jets are the obvious next step. Bizzjet or passenger, doesn't really matter. So I've been looking around and think I can narrow my choice to the Citation X 2.0 by Eaglesoft, or the so much praised PMDG 737-NGX. The price of both products is not an issue. But here's the deal: I've got only limited time during the week to fly FSX, so what I DON'T need is an aircraft that takes one hour to set-up (I always like starting from cold & dark). I know there will be a learning curve in either product, but once I get the hang of it, I'm looking for something which can get me from cold & dark to in the air in about 20 to 30 minutes max, as the evenings when I can fly are limited to 2 to 3 hours. So half an hour to get the bird ready, and a 1h30 trip, these are the things I'm looking for. So how would you compare both these aircrafts in terms of complexity. Once sort of mastered, are they about equal in terms of complexity (FMS, power-management, etc) or is the 737 way more complex ? Is the Citation a better bird to start with as a beginning jet-flyer, or is the step to the 737 not that much bigger and should I go for it ? In terms of controller hardware, I'm using the Saitek X-52 Pro and use the pedals of my Logitech G25 racing wheel as rudder and brake controls. Set-up with a registered FSUIPC, this works well with the GA I've been flying until now. I have no intention to change this hardware, so if either bird would require a zillion buttons on the controller, that's probably a no-go. I kindly thank anyone for replying. TJ


Mathieu Souphy

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It's been a long time since I flew the Citation X, but I'm currently training myself in the NGX. If you simply must start from cold and dark in order to enjoy the flight and you don't have much time for flying, the NGX might not be for you. I, however, hardly ever do a full C&D start - I just load a preconfigured panel state in the NGX and get right into FMC programming. Doing it that way, I can go from chocks to takeoff in about 7-10 minutes, depending on route complexity. I'm almost positive that from C&D, the Citation is a much faster startup.

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Thanks Bill, I guess a full C&D is obviously not always necessary... I guess in real life, when it's not the first flight of the day, the crew doesn't have to do a full C&D start too, do they ? Forgive my ignorance...


Mathieu Souphy

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The NGX is a pretty easy bird to both learn and fly. The NGX comes with a option to start Cold and Dark, Long Turn (a step above C and D), and Short Turn (most everything on and ready). I usually use the Short Turn option, but even starting from C and D, it only takes me about 5 to 10 minutes to go from that stage to in the air, and even less from the Short Turn option. Of course the lengh of time will vary depending on how long the route is that you have to enter in the FMC is, but normally even a trans con flight only takes a few minutes to enter. I can't speak to the Citation X since I dont own it, but the NGX is a great a/c and so far the most enjoyable bird I have ever flown in the sim since I started with FS1 back in the 80's. Good luck which ever you choose.


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Ok guys, please don't stop reading at the title and just say "oh well no doubt the 737"... I know from reading various comments all over the Internet that this is probably the best addon out there for FSX, but please consider my situation: I am not a real world pilot. I have spent the last year or so getting busy with FSX, reading books and articles about aviation and FSX, and I've learned a fair bit about VFR and IFR procedures (STATS, SIDS, Instrument Approaches, ...). I've been spending this year learning this stuff flying props and turboprops, mainly the Duke B60, Turbine Duke and PMDG JS4100, and I'm now fairly acquainted to them. I think I've reached a point where I want to move up to flying something with some more power and range, so jets are the obvious next step. Bizzjet or passenger, doesn't really matter. So I've been looking around and think I can narrow my choice to the Citation X 2.0 by Eaglesoft, or the so much praised PMDG 737-NGX. The price of both products is not an issue. But here's the deal: I've got only limited time during the week to fly FSX, so what I DON'T need is an aircraft that takes one hour to set-up (I always like starting from cold & dark). I know there will be a learning curve in either product, but once I get the hang of it, I'm looking for something which can get me from cold & dark to in the air in about 20 to 30 minutes max, as the evenings when I can fly are limited to 2 to 3 hours. So half an hour to get the bird ready, and a 1h30 trip, these are the things I'm looking for. So how would you compare both these aircrafts in terms of complexity. Once sort of mastered, are they about equal in terms of complexity (FMS, power-management, etc) or is the 737 way more complex ? Is the Citation a better bird to start with as a beginning jet-flyer, or is the step to the 737 not that much bigger and should I go for it ? In terms of controller hardware, I'm using the Saitek X-52 Pro and use the pedals of my Logitech G25 racing wheel as rudder and brake controls. Set-up with a registered FSUIPC, this works well with the GA I've been flying until now. I have no intention to change this hardware, so if either bird would require a zillion buttons on the controller, that's probably a no-go. I kindly thank anyone for replying. TJ
They are both very good aircraft - and very different. The X requires control calibration so that the FADEC will work; the NGX requires heavy duty computation for happiness. The X comes with a 30 day money back guarantee - no questions asked. The NGX is a pig in a poke - you buy it, you got it. I've got both of them and like them quite a bit, but will be happier when the first service pack for the NGX is released in the near future. Essentially, it's a coin flip. DJ

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I have both the Citation X and the NGX, and my situation is fairly similar to yours in the amount of time that I have for a flight. Prior to me getting the NGX I tended to spend my flying time between the Citation X and the Turbine Duke, neither have got much of a look in since - as much because the NGX is new to me as anything else I guess. In terms of operation I always go from Cold & Dark to Cold & Dark. In terms of complexity, both are complex aircraft - I find the NGX takes slightly longer to set up than the Citation, but the FMS I find quicker and easier to use in the NGX (if that makes sense). At a guess I would say from C&D to take-off you are probably looking at 20 minutes in the NGX and 15 minutes in the Citation - I should probably take longer for both, but that doesn't seem to be rushing too much. In the Citation you can "shortcut" the set-up by loading a flightplan from FSX itself, which speeds things up (probably where the 5 min difference comes from). At the moment I am still using a (home made) checklist for the NGX, whereas I have never needed one for the Citation. Graphically the NGX has it by a long way, not that the Citation is ugly - the NGX is just in it's own league for that. A big plus for the NGX is that you can save in the middle of a flight, exit and resume when you want. The Citation cannot do this, panel state is not saved so flights must be done in one go. If you are time limited then this can be really useful. If I had to get only one then it would be the NGX hands down, I think the Citation is a great buy as well - but the NGX has it for me !! G


Gary Davies aka "Gazzareth"

Simming since 747 on the Acorn Electron

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I too own both and I can honestly say I have never enjoyed an addon as much as the NGX. Also agree from C&D can be wheels up in 7-10 mins. Glen

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I have both the Citation X and the NGX, and my situation is fairly similar to yours in the amount of time that I have for a flight. Prior to me getting the NGX I tended to spend my flying time between the Citation X and the Turbine Duke, neither have got much of a look in since - as much because the NGX is new to me as anything else I guess. In terms of operation I always go from Cold & Dark to Cold & Dark. In terms of complexity, both are complex aircraft - I find the NGX takes slightly longer to set up than the Citation, but the FMS I find quicker and easier to use in the NGX (if that makes sense). At a guess I would say from C&D to take-off you are probably looking at 20 minutes in the NGX and 15 minutes in the Citation - I should probably take longer for both, but that doesn't seem to be rushing too much. In the Citation you can "shortcut" the set-up by loading a flightplan from FSX itself, which speeds things up (probably where the 5 min difference comes from). At the moment I am still using a (home made) checklist for the NGX, whereas I have never needed one for the Citation. Graphically the NGX has it by a long way, not that the Citation is ugly - the NGX is just in it's own league for that. A big plus for the NGX is that you can save in the middle of a flight, exit and resume when you want. The Citation cannot do this, panel state is not saved so flights must be done in one go. If you are time limited then this can be really useful. If I had to get only one then it would be the NGX hands down, I think the Citation is a great buy as well - but the NGX has it for me !! G
Ow cool so that means that for longer hops, I could save mid-flight and pick it up the next day without too much trouble ? All panel settings, and FMS config would be saved along ? That's a big plus to me.

Mathieu Souphy

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Ow cool so that means that for longer hops, I could save mid-flight and pick it up the next day without too much trouble ? All panel settings, and FMS config would be saved along ? That's a big plus to me.
Yes, works fine... I only save in cruise, and everything loads up fine - including Radar Contact as well. Never knew how important that was before the NGX..G

Gary Davies aka "Gazzareth"

Simming since 747 on the Acorn Electron

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I own both. The C750 is more of a get in a go, while the NGX is takes a little more FMS/route/W+B preplanning. That said I don't start from Cold and Dark with either of them, I mainly start with most systems on, enter my FMS info, set a few switches and knobs and I'm off. The NGX takes maybe 25% longer to get it running compared to the C750. The visuals on the NGX far surpass the C750 but in its defense, the model has been around a lot longer than the NGX. They both do LNAV and VNAV, and both accept Navigraph updates (but not required). They are actually both quite good at short field takeoffs. I've used the NGX (lightly loaded) out of a 4800ft strip. If you get really in depth the NGX beats the C750 easy peasy. Still the C750 is a solid platform and a bit faster than the NGX at altitude. I don't have a registered FSUIPC version so the fadec doesnt work for me with the C750 - but I usually redline N1 anyway haha! The C750 is about 1/3 less cost than the NGX too, and has a return policy with the F1 wrapper. Support for both products has been good in my experience. Good luck!


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HelloYou will end up with both of them anyway.Its just how it goes with this hobby, resistance is futile in my experience. They are each the best examples in their class.I have just returned to Luton EGGW from Innsbruck LOWI in the Eaglesoft CitationX having flown down there this morning in it , great fun.Its a hard call for me but I would probably get the NGX, if only because it will be the last airliner you will need to buy for a long time..Get the Citation next payday.

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The Eaglesoft Citation X V2/0 is a great plane! Once you get used to a good flow through the procedures you can preflight the aircraft in less time than it takes to align the IRSs (~5 mins at lower latitudes). It is very fast and flies by the numbers for fuel burn and time from fltplan.com. It is also one of the best handing aircraft I've used in FS as unlike many FS aircraft it is easy to trim and can be flown hands off. Also, despite the fast cruise, approach speeds are quite low (usually vref around 115-118 kts) so you can get in to a lot of places a 737 won't go. It's presently all I fly (granted in FS9.1) and I can't get enough of it. If you fly a slower cruise you can also do about 3000 nm in about 6 hours. Six hours aloft is about as much time you can get aloft in this plane with a comfortable fuel reserve. Anyways, highly recommended!

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Frankly, I would say go with the NGX, and that is not because of one being inherently better than the other, but simply by virtue of the fact that the Boeing 737 is so ubiquitous that you will find masses of training info out there for it on the internet and in books etc, so you are more likely to find some training material which suits you. Al


Alan Bradbury

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HelloPlus the NGX is going to get its ongoing issues fixed.The CX is what it is, I dont think Eaglesoft are going to fix any remaining issues this late in the game.

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Guest jahman

Go with NGX: Saving a flight so you can resume exactly where you left off is not only practical if you have little time available, but also eesential in case FSX CTDs (so with FSUIPC autosave enabled you can continue right where you left off with only a 5 minute interruption). Another issue is quickly and efficiently getting an airliner from C&D to taxiing is part of a pilot's training. Personally, the more I have to fiddle with the aircraft before take-off, the more I get my head into FSX, the more I enjoy simming. In this regard the NGX is superb due to to the complexity of it's systems. Cheers, - jahman.

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