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Spartan0536

FSGenesis NextMAP Mesh

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I have been trying to get the story on this new thing FSGenesis has been throwing out there called NextMAP which according to FlightSim renders Europe in a stunning 9.8m Mesh which is incredible detail. Most of us know with high res meshes can come some really bad problems such as the infamous plateauing of airports amongst other undesirable things. I was wondering if anyone has used this and how it stacks up to their previous products as well as FSGlobal Ultimate, anyone?

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NextMap isn't new but it is very good.. The airport plateau problem still exists however.

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9.8 ms? That's stunning! However, I can't see how installing that resolution mesh will give anything other than headaches regarding airport plateaus. I understand that one of the other products, is it Genesis (?) comes with some kind of editing option to correct any airport errors. It may be that there's some third party app somewhere that can do the same kind of thing when using an alternative mesh product. But hey, 9.8ms is unbelievable!

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USA 10m mesh free here.  Europe is 30m

 

http://simviation.com/1/browse-Terrain+Mesh-64-29

 

I actually have used that mesh and there are plateau problems all over the place, given it is freeware. however what killed it for me was in south florida there are these spikes that shoot up out of the ground and go to about 75,000 feet, after seeing this I completely uninstalled every bit of Raimondo Taburet's meshes other than Alaska and Hawaii which seem to be pretty darn good.

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I actually have used that mesh and there are plateau problems all over the place, given it is freeware. however what killed it for me was in south florida there are these spikes that shoot up out of the ground and go to about 75,000 feet, after seeing this I completely uninstalled every bit of Raimondo Taburet's meshes other than Alaska and Hawaii which seem to be pretty darn good.

oh okay I haven't been to Florida yet. So far Europe and Asia is not to bad but I also have genisis world mesh that 70m? and that may help in flattening out

 

I have also increased the tree cell size in fsx.cfg and Asia with Europe looks quite stunning

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however what killed it for me was in south florida there are these spikes that shoot up out of the ground and go to about 75,000 feet, after seeing this I completely uninstalled every bit of Raimondo Taburet's meshes other than Alaska and Hawaii which seem to be pretty darn good.

Those anomalies are quite unfortunate elements in many freeware meshes, I've noticed. I just found three huge spikes in one otherwise great freeware SE Asia mesh just outside Danang, Vietnam and there are probably a lot more. Justin from FSGenesis once explained that it is huge and tedious job to remove all the measurement errors from the original data. They exist always in every data set in various amounts. IMO fixed anomalies are perhaps the main reason to purchase some payware mesh, because many free alternatives deliver otherwise similar accuracy. It is still good we have alternatives and I wish that freeware devs keep pushing great stuff for us.

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I have all FSG NextMap for the EU and I fly all over the EU.  While I pretty much only fly in and out of major airports at 30,000'+ (PMDG MD11, CS MD80, ES CX750) I have seen very few airports with plateaus.

 

FSG NM does not do much where the terrain is pretty flat (north western France, Belgium, etc.), but once you start getting into the hills and then the Alps it really makes a difference.  But even in western France it will make real small rivers and stuff like that stand out more simply because there is more of a bank to the river.

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I would drop mad cash if FSGenesis or any other developer released worldwide hi res mesh with elevation fixes incorporated globally. It can be done!!! My wallet is open. 

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I bought the NextMap Europe bundle ages ago....I'm just saying...very nice.

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I would drop mad cash if FSGenesis or any other developer released worldwide hi res mesh with elevation fixes incorporated globally. It can be done!!! My wallet is open. 

 

 

yes it can http://www.airportdesigneditor.co.uk/

Not hard at all, open the airport, go to tools, change airport altitude

 

Plateaus are not issues IMO, they are the side effect of quality mesh

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 I had Nextmap Europe installed but found the airport plateaus problem to be pretty bad. I know my way around ADE pretty well and it's not a guaranteed fix. It was easier to just go without mesh.

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 I had Nextmap Europe installed but found the airport plateaus problem to be pretty bad. I know my way around ADE pretty well and it's not a guaranteed fix. It was easier to just go without mesh.

 

I have to say Dave, that is more or less my own feeling, regretable, but one I think I will take to rid myself of any headaches. I only ever installed one mesh product and that was NextMAP for Spain. The first time I used it was flying into Alicante, and yes, there it was, an elevation issue with a horrible cliff running around the perimeter of the airport! So IMO, unless the elevation issue can be 100% fixed, then I'm not interested. Life's too short!

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I installed NextMap Europe and had much the same experience as others above. So I backed off to the previous version of FSG mesh, which seems to be OK.

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As someone pointed out, plateaus are simply a result of higher resolutin mesh, not a glitch or anomaly like spikes on some meshes. FSX default mesh is for USA 38m, for Europe, Mexico and Canada it is 76m and for rest of the world it is as low as 306m. FSGenesis world base mesh sets resolution to 76m, if I remember correctly, and it is huge improvement to most of the world. At 76m it is very unlikely you get at least bad visible plateaus. IMO 76m is at best just decent and the difference to more precise meshes is huge. I have chosen to use high resoltion meshes as plateaus look bothering only quite short of time of the flight during landing. So, either you opt to use realistic terrain contours (which are important at least for me), go on with low resolution mesh or use high resolution meshes and start adjusting the airports, if elevation is a problem. In most cases, elevation issues are quite small and if you have some favorite airpoort or two suffering the problem, it is quite possible to edit them to your needs.

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yes it can http://www.airportdesigneditor.co.uk/

Not hard at all, open the airport, go to tools, change airport altitude

 

Plateaus are not issues IMO, they are the side effect of quality mesh

I get that. The problem is so pervasive that you could spend your life in ADE...lol.

 

FSGlobal solution (AFM) provides an overall generic approach to the problem that works efficiently, but has the added issue of inserting more .bgls into the scenery.cfg, and thus slowing down fsx load time further. And load time for global is already prohibitive as is imo.

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Just want to observe here that in many of the hillier parts of the world, airports are in actual fact, on plateaus. For example, in my home state, Utah, KOGD, KHIF, and KSGU are (or were) on plateaus or high regions nearly exactly the size and shape of the airport and facilities... It would be inaccurate to insist that they be blended into the terrain.

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Thinking about upgrading my European terrain mesh with FSGenesis NEXTMap as well. I am aware of the airport plateau consequences but does this occur predominantly with default FSX airports only? I have a lot of Aerosoft payware airports within Europe and I was wondering if the plateauing will effect payware airports as well?

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Yes, a trade off - higher detailed landscape or less plateaus.  I put in a request a ways back for the next version of ADE to include a simple tool that lets you create a ground poly around your airport.  The center of it automatically takes the airport elevation while you circle around your airport dropping in points of elevation around the outer circle either taking measurements of your current mesh or manually adding an elevation point.  The idea was it would smooth out that plateau to match the ground around the airport.

 

Hopefully they will put something in like that in the next major release as simmers could push out dozens of airports in a matter of minutes and share them like they do AFCADs.

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For example, in my home state, Utah, KOGD, KHIF, and KSGU are (or were) on plateaus or high regions nearly exactly the size and shape of the airport and facilities... It would be inaccurate to insist that they be blended into the terrain.

 

  Looking at KOGD for instance though even. Check the threshold elevations for every runway .. They are all VERY different. FSX see's an airport as simply one elevation. Sure you can take a fair bit of time to massage it using ADE which may work to varying degrees of success.

  To fix/tweak every airport you have a plateau issue with would take a very long time. I love the look that good mesh provides but it's all washed away when on approach and the airport and surrounding area looks so awful. Another case of asking more from FSX than it was meant to give us.

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Given FSGenesis's reputation to be pretty solid and they fact they put out multiple sales per year if it goes on sale for the US I might just pick it up, ADE is not so hard to use and understand to a competent level, if the NEXTMap terrain is really that good I might take the plunge, I don't mind the plateau's so much so long as its not "jagged" but rounded to look more like an incline than a sheer cliff (unless of course that is realistic for that airport). This is one of the reasons why I did not get into FSGlobal Ultimate which looks extremely accurate; speaking of which anyone used that free tool that supposedly comes with FSG Ultimate, and if so what are your thoughts?

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Given FSGenesis's reputation to be pretty solid and they fact they put out multiple sales per year if it goes on sale for the US I might just pick it up, ADE is not so hard to use and understand to a competent level, if the NEXTMap terrain is really that good I might take the plunge, I don't mind the plateau's so much so long as its not "jagged" but rounded to look more like an incline than a sheer cliff (unless of course that is realistic for that airport). This is one of the reasons why I did not get into FSGlobal Ultimate which looks extremely accurate; speaking of which anyone used that free tool that supposedly comes with FSG Ultimate, and if so what are your thoughts?

 

They are sheer cliff's.  The default airports themselves will be elevated on a plateau over the accurate terrain elevation.

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Thinking about upgrading my European terrain mesh with FSGenesis NEXTMap as well. I am aware of the airport plateau consequences but does this occur predominantly with default FSX airports only? I have a lot of Aerosoft payware airports within Europe and I was wondering if the plateauing will effect payware airports as well?

 

It is possible that payware airports can be effected as well.  It all depends on how good the developer of the airport is to "fixing" this.

 

I have NEXTMap and quite a few of the Aerosoft European airports and haven't noticed any issues.

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