Do you get a free update when a new version of Office comes out, as a token of goodwill? LM & XP give you free upgrades, as a token of goodwill? 

Just now, Wobbie said:

Do you get a free update when a new version of Office comes out, as a token of goodwill? LM & XP give you free upgrades, as a token of goodwill? 

Bad example, Office365 is a subscription service which guarantees you'll always have access to the latest version of the software.

Your 2nd example may be more apropos, however you can't resonably compare development costs of merely updating an add-on to that of developing a whole new version of a simulator.

21 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

I still believe there is a strong business case to be made for converting their FSX products to MSFS if the incurred cost is trivial.

You have no clue what your're typing. They have a Container for legacy aircraft which uses FSX lookup tables,  like hard coding the flight dynamics. The new engine is closer to X plane engine (blade element theory). There's nothing "trivial" about converting to all new flight modeling. And that's just the beginning, the gauges and system displays are different code, the textures are PBR and it will probably be surround sound to rework. Plus they need to invest the time to retest all this stuff. No, no, this definitely is not "trivial", dude.

4 minutes ago, Greazer said:

You have no clue what your're typing. They have a Container for legacy aircraft which uses FSX lookup tables,  like hard coding the flight dynamics. The new engine is closer to X plane engine (blade element theory). There's nothing "trivial" about converting to all new flight modeling. And that's just the beginning, the gauges and system displays are different code, the textures are PBR and it will probably be surround sound to rework. Plus they need to invest the time to retest all this stuff. No, no, this definitely is not "trivial", dude.

^ what I'm talking about.  Not going to engage you further on this subject.

You offer numerous statements of fact without providing first-hand knowledge or direct evidence to back them up.  This is nothing more than your opinion.  

Edited October 2, 20196 yr by TechguyMaxC

33 minutes ago, Wobbie said:

Do you get a free update when a new version of Office comes out, as a token of goodwill? LM & XP give you free upgrades, as a token of goodwill? 

There is a difference in providing a new version of a product or proving the same product for pretty much the same platform. Or to put it differently.

Is there justification ("work deserves payment")

a) for charging NGX for P3D4 customers full price for the NG3 for P3D4 or MSFS? Yes

b) for charging NGX for P3D3 customers a small upgrade fee for NGX for P3D4? Yes

c) for charging NGX for FSX customers the full (elevated) price for NGX for P3D3? Absolutely not. I don't know how much work they did, but it can't be much more than the v3 to v4 transition if at all considering other devs can provide a single installer for all-around support for FSX and P3D1-3 charging a single price

d) for charging NGX for FSX customers the difference (of higher P3D pricing) as an upgrade for NGX for P3D3? I will go with Yes here as well

e) for charging NG3 for P3D4 customers full price for the NG3 for MSFS? Well that's a tricky one. Let's just say if the transition isn't much simpler than starting from scratch then yes, but they won't sell a single P3D4 version, if they don't offer an upgrade price (at least not to those that are planning the switch to MSFS), especially considering they probably won't get that thing out much earlier than MSFS itself. I know I wouldn't. I would however consider it if they'd offer the MSFS version as an upgrade price.

I must add I did buy there products all over again for P3D3, so it's hard not nuking them for that without being hypocritical. I was in a pretty bad situation. After using P3Dv3 I couldn't look back to FSX and the Sim wouldn't have been the same without them. I don't know I kind of feel exploited at some point. Not that I wasn't able to enjoy it, but I still felt bad about actually supporting this kind of "steal", especially at the prices they are charging. But one things for sure, they won't get a nickel for their NG3 for P3D4 if they're going all full price for a potential MSFS version. I will gladly resist and wait this time.

 

Edited October 2, 20196 yr by OSJJ1985

PMDG are top of the top tier developers but their reputation is suspect and iffy! Why?

Back in the day when Prepar3D V1 was released and the whole debate about

installing FSX addons in P3D got started nearly all of the main developer said they would not

support P3D because it was not an entertainment product. Back then it was possible to shoehorn

pretty much any FSX addon into P3D including PMDG. They made it very clear to everyone that

to do so was a breach of the EULA. As the move from FSX to P3D was underway

many developer started to change their tune re support. If I recall correctly PMDG and Flight1 where among

the last to publicly state they would be supporting P3D. It was supposedly all about liability and licensing.

When the NGX was released for P3D it was apparently little more than the exact same code with a P3D

Installer/wrapper. But it came with a hefty price increase. Correct me if I am wrong but I think it was nearly 50%

more than FSX version. (Or should I say the same one with the FSX Installer/wrapper). But the crux of the matter

for the simmer is that if you had already shelled out for the FSX version you still had to pay full price for the P3D

version. I would say to this date that was a huge blunder by PMDG. Despite all the liability Blah Blah Blah and

the licensing Blah Blah Blah justifications, the optics are that we got taken. And that has stuck to PMDG like glue.

If MSFS 2020 is indeed backward compatible, It seems to me an opportunity for PMDG to make that reputation 

go away and return to the time when virtually no one had a bad word to say about them!

Edited October 3, 20196 yr by Avidean

I love PMDG's products and it would be very cool to use there amazing products (or newer versions of them) in this new sim. The new Microsoft Flight Simulator does look amazing from what has been shown so far. 

It would also be nice to see some fresh new talent developing in the flight sim space. Or even the prospect of this new platform making the development process of 3rd party add-ons easier for the veterans of the industry. 

 

 

Personally I'm not terribly interested in seeing a lot of developers all making the same plane. PMDG already makes a great 747. Leonardo already makes a great DC9. I'm not going to buy another company's 747 because I already have a great one.

I'd rather the next great offering to be something that hasn't already been done extremely well. I'd love to get my hands on a *good* 727. Or an L1011 (yeah, I know, there's one out already, but honestly it kinda sucks). I think there's a lot of room out there, especially for making classic jetliners that are more challenging to fly than the modern stuff.

I'd really love to see someone come out with a PMDG/Leonardo-level small jet. Probably the closest we have right now is the Falcon 50, and as good as that is, it's not PMDG-good. I'm hopeful that we'll see a lot more effort from more than just a few companies put into making planes that look great and, equally important, work well.

 

1 hour ago, eslader said:

Personally I'm not terribly interested in seeing a lot of developers all making the same plane. PMDG already makes a great 747. Leonardo already makes a great DC9. I'm not going to buy another company's 747 because I already have a great one.

I'd rather the next great offering to be something that hasn't already been done extremely well. I'd love to get my hands on a *good* 727. Or an L1011 (yeah, I know, there's one out already, but honestly it kinda sucks). I think there's a lot of room out there, especially for making classic jetliners that are more challenging to fly than the modern stuff.

I'd really love to see someone come out with a PMDG/Leonardo-level small jet. Probably the closest we have right now is the Falcon 50, and as good as that is, it's not PMDG-good. I'm hopeful that we'll see a lot more effort from more than just a few companies put into making planes that look great and, equally important, work well.

 

Just Flight L1011 Pro Edition is very good....NO SUCKY👍

4 minutes ago, Arthur42417 said:

Just Flight L1011 Pro Edition is very good....NO SUCKY👍

Unless they've updated it since I abandoned FSX, we'll have to agree to disagree. 😉

 

I would love to have a high quality business jet.....with an autothrottle. Something like a Hawker 850.

Same here, I was expecting high quality business jet for years, but nothing

A Falcon 7X would be awesome

I've wanted a good 7x for a *long* time. At this point, though, I'd rather an 8x. Just look at that cockpit:

 

And it'd be nice if someone would do a Primus Epic avionics package.

 

3 hours ago, eslader said:

Unless they've updated it since I abandoned FSX, we'll have to agree to disagree. 😉

 

FSX lol FSX VERSION is Prehistoric.......i'm talking about the new P3Dv4.5 Pro Edition Line from Just Flight:  VC10 and L1011👍

 

 

Edited October 3, 20196 yr by Arthur42417

Here's a history lesson. At one point, PMDG insisted they wouldn't develop for P3D. At another point Orbx swore they wouldn't develop for XP11. Right now, Orbx has banned talk of MSFS on their forum and PMDG is bashing it.

Regardless of the arrogant attitudes we sometimes see, these companies are beholden to what the market demands. They will not be able to hold grudges at the cost of the almighty dollar. If MSFS is what it looks like it will be, they will have no choice but to eat crow and start making addons for it.