Will MSF2020 be the first Sim to open up to casual Gamers?

[LHookins 3,103]

Third party developers will cater to the hardcore serious simmer and that is how it should be.  The default aircraft will be approachable by first timers, and *that* is how it should be too.  

Hook

[Wobbie 938]

3rd party developers have catered for the casual simmer as well. Not all simmerz are PMDG type simmerz. Bugatti Adventures was certainly not fit for the so-called hard core summer. Air ships, also not. There are space addons as well. Simming should not be elitist, and we, or some of us should not marginalize other gamerz/simmerz. 

Don't forget that the core game comes from a game studio. 

[shawty1984 106]

9 hours ago, HiFlyer said:

Look to their shareholders and cancel it if it doesn't do what they need it to do. They did it with FSX, they did it with flight, and I can't see them being all that much more sentimental with this if it's not pulling in the numbers they need to make the investment worth it.

And no, I don't really believe that flight simulators are boring to people. There are flight simulators of all sorts out there that are doing quite well thank you.

It's the level of complexity that can turn away people who don't find that sort of thing interesting, and yes, if there is no provision made for various levels of users, then you will lose people.

I see no evidence that Microsoft in this instance has been so stupid as to not provide multiple levels of accessibility to draw in and hopefully retain the widest possible Market.

They have said as much, and I believe they have never changed from their core understanding of the widespread appeal of aviation.

Over and above all of that, I guess we will soon find out, won't we?

What have Microsoft got in MFS to bring in casual gamers? You don't seem to be answering it. The answer is nothing, because like it or not, flight simulators are boring to casual gamers. You don't believe they are boring, but you wouldn't as you've signed up to a dedicated forum on the subject. 

I'm not wanting to argue, but we need to look at the big picture. While initially it might do well, I can't see many newer gamers sticking around. 

[Wobbie 938]

You seem to have forgotten that MSFS will be released on Xbox, to the 60M+ gamers out there.

It goes not matter how long they play, it's all about the numbers. That's the actual bigger picture. We, simmers, seem to have an elitist opinion of ourselves!

[LHookins 3,103]

25 minutes ago, shawty1984 said:

The answer is nothing, because like it or not, flight simulators are boring to casual gamers.

If flight simulators were THAT boring then FSX wouldn't have sold as many as it did. 🙂 

Casual gamers aren't what you think they are.  It is these same casual gamers who will be introduced to flight simming by MSFS and some will decide to pursue their private license and maybe even a career in aviation.  Even FSX had this effect and you know what default FSX was like in the beginning.

Hook

[ThrottleUp 617]

Im very happy the new sim is coming to consoles. All over social media I see comments like:

• No interest in flight sims...until now, this looks amazing, joystick ordered! 
• If this has VR I'm in!
• Wow the whole WORLD? Insane, pre-ordering!  
• I feel I can travel now during the covid19 crisis!

It will introduce a whole new set of gamers to flight. And who knows...perhaps it will fire off that spark in some of them and encourage them to make it a career one day.

[in2tech 588]

Also why Multiplayer is so important and I would think why they always show videos of the fast stunt type planes, I forget their names,  in a lot of official videos that show the aircraft flying next to the Space Needle I think, close to the cliff's and shores, doing flips and stuff. If you think everyone buying MSFS or getting Game Pass are exactly the same as the next person, you are wrong. Some people want to have fun with their friends or flying stunt planes by themselves, landing challenges, landing on sand barges, mission's, water landing, checking out landmark's, trying to land on the Golden Gate bridge ( that's me and my friends in multiplayer ), and I am really old, when we are not doing our own thing in the simulator, something like a career mode program, the more options the better.

I don't care what someone does in MSFS if it makes them happy, if they buy it or subscribe to it, as long as there is constant flow of money to continue development. So everyone can so their thing 🙂 Bring on the Xbox crowd too. It's not like them trying to crash into each other is going to bother me, well maybe if I am in a Public Multiplayer, but that's my fault for joining a Public server, and if I don't like it I can leave 🙂 If we can get 1/4 of the 60 million Xbox users, that would be a win, right? Cha Ching 🙂 

August 18th, the FUN begins 🙂 I said the word FUN again, oh oh, I am in trouble!

[Janov 2,383]

1 hour ago, ThrottleUp said:

encourage them to make it a career one day.

Just not in the next few years...or decade. No career in aviation to be had.

Edited August 7, 2020 by Janov

[ErichB 3,642]

11 minutes ago, in2tech said:

don't care what someone does in MSFS if it makes them happy, if they buy it or subscribe to it, as long as there is constant flow of money to continue development.

Precisely.  It's the individual user experience that counts -  and from what I've seen so far there is a lot here to keep everyone from gamers to serious simmers interested. 

The gaming crowd is more than likely to be transient and not stick around once they exhausted the relatively short attention spans.  But the younger gaming crowd will also include budding aviation geeks and enthusiasts and that's needed to grow our world.    Even if you don't particularly want to learn how to fly complex aircraft, the sim offers a great, interactive and educational geography experience.  It's virtual aviation tourism done in the most amazing way from your home.

For long time flightsimmers like myself,   this is everything we have ever wanted in a sim.    Yes, some third party deliveries will take time, but that will come.

Every item noted,  on every wish list (for a base flight simulator), ever written on these forums over a period of many years is being delivered on 18 August.     

 

[LHookins 3,103]

20 minutes ago, Janov said:

Just not in the next few years...or decade. No career in aviation to be had.

So much for the dread Pilot Shortage. 🙂 

So, what's the time line like?  Fly MSFS for a while, long enough to decide you want to fly for real.  Research flight schools, try to line up financing.  Start lessons.  Solo.  Fly as finances permit.  Work on additional certifications.  Do some instructing to build hours while waiting for a job to open up somewhere, or just fly for fun without making it a career... lots of people do that, too.  Be willing to take the flying jobs no one else wants.  This won't be an overnight process in any case.

OR... fly MSFS for a while, determine you want to make flying a career, research aviation universities, arrange financing, get accepted, get a four year degree.  Still not overnight.

OR... fly MSFS for a while, decide you like flying, join the military to be a pilot.  You are guaranteed a job, and you may even get to fly once in a while. 🙂 

Eventually the dread Pilot Shortage will return and jobs should be easier to get.

Hook

[Chock 17,769]

What even is a 'casual gamer'? Most people who are into playing computer games are anything but casual about it, just go on a Call of Duty multiplayer server and listen for ten seconds. 🤣

Edited August 7, 2020 by Chock

[ThrottleUp 617]

15 minutes ago, Chock said:

What even is a 'casual gamer'? Most people who are into playing computer games are anything but casual about it, just go on a Call of Duty multiplayer server and listen for ten seconds. 🤣

I think when its comes to flight sims that term applies to those who just wanna hop in a jet that spawns with engines running on the runway with their buddies in multiplayer and off they go doing barrel rolls in an A320, racing in F18s & trying to do Immelmann turns in Cessna 172 😃

...vs. the other extreme where the simmer puts on pilot uniform + captains hat, checks the weather, loads the plane, flight plans as per RW procedures, pokes the FMC setting up the legs, walks around the chair pretending its the external preflight and then does 15hr long haul in a PMDG in real time ending with hard IMC approach to minimuns in driving rain and crosswind 😃

I like that our hobby has those two kinds of simmer...and tons more in between!

Edited August 7, 2020 by ThrottleUp

[Krakin 5,748]

The biggest draw for the "gamer" crowd right now is the graphics

[Chock 17,769]

I don't even know why people think the word gamer is some sort of pejorative. If anyone has played something like a massively multiplayer online RPG - and these are some of the most popular types of game - they will know that learning all the stuff in one of those makes learning the systems on an airliner look like a breeze in comparison...

A typical MMORPG has multiple classes of player character you can choose from, with each of these classes having many skills available (literally in the hundreds), and these change depending on which weapon the player is holding too, but you can hold two weapons and can also change them on the fly and the effects combine, so there's even more permutations. Most characters have a character skill tree with several specialisations which can be further tuned for additional effects, and these in turn affect all the preceding stuff, meaning the number of things which can affect stuff is staggeringly complex.

But it doesn't end there. All of the above stuff is affected by the player's character progression level, so you have to know all the combinations of these skills, plus armour and weapon effects and statistics, and how to use these, which means you also have to learn all the chain combinations of the keyboard or controller presses to make these work at the right time.

But it gets even more complicated because, with it being a massively multiplayer online game, your opponents can be any of those different classes you could have chosen to play, and they have the same bewildering array of skills, equipment and options to choose from, so you have to also know those as well in order to combat them. And all of this is just one part of the game.

This is a bit more complex than knowing you have to flip a bleed air switch on the overhead to crank the other engine.

 

Edited August 7, 2020 by Chock

[LHookins 3,103]

... and using an "autopilot" to increase skills is considered a cheat and can get you banned for life from a game server. 😄 

Those games have their elitists, too.  "You've nerfed your build, dummy!" when you choose a single wrong skill.

Hook

Edited August 7, 2020 by LHookins