4 hours ago, carmined said:

Not just in Germany, but everywhere!

I bought my yoke, throttle quad and then my rudder pedals just in the nick of time before you cannot find these items anymore at least right now. I got most of mine from Sporty's and they are fresh out of anything for weeks now, I bought mine in early July 2020. I just checked. They are on order for ... wait for it! ... Oct 15! ... Believe me it was just dumb luck on my part, I could have just as easily waited closer to this past week and would have screwed myself pretty good. Thank GOD I'm a terribly impulsive buyer and addicted to clicking on "buy" buttons when it comes to flight sim software and hardware or I would have suffered mightily just when things have gotten severely exciting!

United001

3 hours ago, LHookins said:

Lots of people like DCS for air combat or even just flying.  There are a lot of people here flying both.  I haven't tried it myself.

Hook

 

You really should give DCS a try. They have aircraft and scenery map sales quite often so you can set yourself up with varied flying and combat experiences without spending a lot initially. They take their aircraft flight models very seriously. I wasn't really much interested in helicopters, and then I got into DCS and learned the Huey and well... I couldn't believe what I had been missing. 

    Based on some of your previous posts it sounds like you struggle sometimes with flight sim burnout? I find it great to have something like DCS to alternate with Civ flight sims, depending on the particular mood I'm in. 

2 minutes ago, kingm56 said:

Is that a personal attack?  I don't think so; however, calling posters dumb certainly is.   I never called you dumb, stupid, or suggested you were inebriated.  You certainly can't say the same; its probably the impetus of peoples negative opinions towards you.  However, like you, I have no desire to continue to debate you on this subject; I certainly don't agree with the vast majority of your musings and your attacks on people who don't share your opinion, especially as it relates to P3D.        

You're still carrying on Avsim forum drama with that post, mate. I have moved on.

I got my helicopter fix back in the Janes days, and with the Dodosim 206 in FSX.  My first helo sim was Sierra's 3-D Helicopter Simulator from 1987.  At one point I tried to join the military as a helicopter pilot but failed the physical.

Done plenty of rotary wing, thank you. 🙂 

Last time I took a break from fight simming I sailed a square rigger in Vehicle Simulator.  Also enjoyed the Super Yacht Athena.  That one's got an interesting history, and may or may not be for sale as you read this.

The time before that I did a lot of reading.  It wasn't books, it was entire series, and several I read twice.  Lindbergh's "Spirit of Saint Louis."  Twice.  Best recommendation:  Bob Buck's "North Star over my Shoulder."

Normally I avoid burnout by flying a different kind of aircraft, or somewhere new.  Plenty of new places in MSFS, limited number of aircraft with analog gauges. 🙂 

But thanks for the suggestions. Right now, keeping up with all the forums is a full time job.

Hook

 

2 hours ago, OzWhitey said:

So Mathijs says the ratio of P3D to MSFS will be 1:500. Sure, maybe. What about the ratio of P3D to MSFS when you look at "people who will spend $100 on an addon plane". I think you'll find P3D scores a lot more highly there.

 

30 minutes ago, thepilot said:

That is the right question to ask. I think Kok overestimates the amount of people willing to fork out up to 50% of the game's own price for a single (mediocre) Aerosoft addon airport – assuming, for illustration purposes, the MSFS standard version and Munich Professional at the current P3D going rate. Many will be content to fly around with what they get. I'd buy more from Aerosoft for P3D if their products were of higher quality.

I think you're both underestimating the amount of money to be made on the market when certain developers concentrate on real microtransaction products. Addons that are so cheap that almost everyone will buy them.

The big moneymakers may possibly not be 30€ or even 15€ airports, surely not 100€ airplanes, but landmarks packages developed by some kid no one's ever heard of before, with some Blender skills , and selling them for 5€, max.

Edited August 16, 20205 yr by Der Zeitgeist

9 minutes ago, Der Zeitgeist said:

 

I think you're both underestimating the amount of money to be made on the market when certain developers concentrate on real microtransaction products. Addons that are so cheap that almost everyone will buy them.

The big moneymakers may possibly not be 30€ or even 15€ airports, surely not 100€ airplanes, but landmarks packages developed by some kid with Blender skills no one ever heard of before, and selling them for 5€, max.

• Orbx are already pricing their addons lower than they have previously, but they're also not likely to be that impressive as they look like P3D ports. Would you buy Orbx LOWI when you already have MSFS LOWI? I probably would, but I think I'm in a small minority.
• Conversely, PMDG want around $130 for the NG3.

I actually agree with your point, it's been my belief for a long time that MSFS will massively expand the market and allow for DLC at prices similar to other games. Sell 10,000 NG3's for $130 or 200,000 for $13, which will you choose..

But I think it will take a while for prices to equilibrate, as flightsim addon devs are used to the crazy prices that have been charged for years. And I would still argue that the P3D user base is made up of simmers who are much more likely to spend money on DLC than the casual gamer who is new to the flight sim genre, hence Mathijs' direct comparison of user numbers being the wrong metric to use.. 

Edited August 16, 20205 yr by OzWhitey

9 minutes ago, OzWhitey said:

Sell 10,000 NG3's for $130 or 200,000 for $13, which will you choose..

10,000!  Definitely the 10,000.

If you don't know why, imagine having to support a PMDG aircraft with 20 times the number of people with questions/complaints, total noobs who should never have been buying a PMDG in the first place.  At the $13 level they can't afford to hire the number of off-shore support staff that would be necessary.

I recommend raising the price.

Hook

 

6 hours ago, ca_metal said:

It comes as no surprise to me.

And this is something people that are complaining about gaming youtubers “playing” it should have in mind before complaining about it.

Hopefully a bigger market will mean solid improvements over the years and guarantee the viability of the project.

Exactly. I watched a video yesterday by a gamer with 4.35 million subscribers that had never flown a simulator before and he was loving it, flying over places he had been to. The video had 193,000 views after one day on youtube. The more the merrier. Just noticed his first MSFS video has 346k views in two days.

Edited August 16, 20205 yr by desbean

7 minutes ago, OzWhitey said:

• Orbx are already pricing their addons lower than they have previously, but they're also not likely to be that impressive as they look like P3D ports. Would you buy Orbx LOWI when you already have MSFS LOWI? I probably would, but I think I'm in a small minority.

Don't think airports. Think bridges, churches, and castles.

What will everyone in MSFS do in two days? Fly over their hometown. What will they notice first? Their house is there, but the church is missing, the bridges are underwater, and the famous castle nearby was turned into an office block by the glitchy AI.

If there's some really smart developer out there, they spent the last few months building nothing but churches, bridges, castles, sports stadiums, and will sell them for 1€ or something like that.

Just now, Der Zeitgeist said:

Don't think airports. Think bridges, churches, and castles.

What will everyone in MSFS do in two days? Fly over their hometown. What will they notice first? Their house is there, but the church is missing, the bridges are underwater, and the famous castle nearby was turned into an office block by the glitchy AI.

If there's some really smart developer out there, they spent the last few months building nothing but churches, bridges, castles, sports stadiums, and will sell them for 1€ or something like that.

Orbx have already announced the "bridges chruches and castles" idea, they have a pack for London now.

It mainly makes sense for well-known areas that are not covered by photogrammetry, and London fits that bill. Placing a generic church or bridge in your neighborhood sounds more like a freeware project that individuals would do if given the right tools. 

I also noticed several girls and women commenting on how they would love to try this game out. I think that is going to be awesome having more women in the hobby. 

5 minutes ago, Andreas Stangenes said:

I also noticed several girls and women commenting on how they would love to try this game out. I think that is going to be awesome having more women in the hobby. 

I'm not sure how I feel about that. Perhaps we should take a poll of the Avsim membership before agreeing to such a radical change?

3 hours ago, OzWhitey said:

Mathijs is hardly an unbiased source. He has been making a very big deal about his links to Asobo, and the fact that he is distributing MSFS for them. Aerosoft have also not been producing much in the way of quality products for Prepar3d v5, so it's not surprising that their addon sales have dropped. I'm sure I've spent a thousand bucks on P3D addons this year, but hardly any of that has been Aerosoft. If they made some top-tier planes or some real P3D v5 airports rather than rehashed, overpriced "Professional" versions then maybe we'd do more business.

So Mathijs says the ratio of P3D to MSFS will be 1:500. Sure, maybe. What about the ratio of P3D to MSFS when you look at "people who will spend $100 on an addon plane". I think you'll find P3D scores a lot more highly there. MSFS's prime purpose is gaming. Prepar3d's is not. The gamers who were illicitly using P3D may leave, but that sim will still exist for its core purpose.

Go and look over on the PMDG forum where serious airline simmers tend to congregate. There's interest in MSFS, but also plenty of people planning to continue with their Prepar3d journey. The death of other simulators has been greatly exaggerated.

I don’t understand people thinking that the other sims will die. They aren’t subscription mmos trying to compete for subscribers to stay afloat against an entrenched behemoth like World of Warcraft. They don’t need to have anyone buying any merchandise to continue having a player base. 

It’s silly hyperbole. Might their community shrink? Sure. Will it entirely evaporate and cease to exist? Not likely. And their community may be better for it, leaving only those who are genuinely passionate about the product. Could be more of a win than a loss for those people, time will tell.
 

He might not be very objective, I agree, but on the other hand, he retails plenty of addons for p3d and xp, and up untill this point it has been Aerosoft's main income stream. So by his post he is signaling that his firm is steering more towards MSFS in the future. It's pretty important no matter how objective he is. 

Whether or not his ratios are off or not is a different matter of course. But it is interesting him being open with his predictions. 

Just now, Anthracite said:

I don’t understand people thinking that the other sims will die. They aren’t subscription mmos trying to compete for subscribers to stay afloat against an entrenched behemoth like World of Warcraft. They don’t need to have anyone buying any merchandise to continue having a player base. 

It’s silly hyperbole. Might their community shrink? Sure. Will it entirely evaporate and cease to exist? Not likely. And their community may be better for it, leaving only those who are genuinely passionate about the product. Could be more of a win than a loss for those people, time will tell.
 

Prepar3d is an interesting one. Despite having used the sim for almost 10 years, I still don't really know what LM's agenda is for developing it. For a 47 billion dollar company, it's a really small project and the target market is pretty speculative. If it's really designed for pro training, you'd think they would have put some serious dollars into it, but it often seems like more of a 'hobby-sized' project like X-Plane.

What is certain is that LM seems to want a simulation training platform, and they are certainly big enough to keep the project going even if every single recreational simmer decides to leave.