Just Flight Piper Arrow III Preview

[jpe828 624]

Seems pretty realistic! Perhaps the most realistic prop we have seen in the sim so far... which would be excellent, and would have to be in my hangar. 

[sd_flyer 6,049]

1 hour ago, ThomseN_inc said:

Whats your point?

My point is you brought this so you should elaborate.

I've been in club business for very long time. I rented and leased aircraft . I have experienced everything from tear and wear to serious accident of airplanes I owned (that were leased to the club).

So I'm curious what is the club name?Operational expenses, membership fee and son. I wonder how they can afford to redo interior every  several years? is that too much to ask?

[ThomseN_inc 1,128]

1 hour ago, sd_flyer said:

is that too much to ask?

Yes it is. Because at the end of the day this has nothing to do with the OP or my opinion about those "used look" planes in MSFS. I'm not here to discuss politics of our flying clubs. Some people really like to make the biggest discussion out of everything. No thanks.

[CaptainNick 575]

2 hours ago, jpe828 said:

How well modelled are airplane systems on the XPlane p3d version? I don't know much about Just Flight quality.

They did pretty good. Maybe not quite A2A quality, but certainly not bad. I have flown the p3d version a bunch and it is quite enjoyable. Well worth the money I spent on it.

[sd_flyer 6,049]

15 minutes ago, ThomseN_inc said:

Yes it is. Because at the end of the day this has nothing to do with the OP or my opinion about those "used look" planes in MSFS. I'm not here to discuss politics of our flying clubs. Some people really like to make the biggest discussion out of everything. No thanks.

Now, you completely lost me. I'm sorry I didn't ask you discuss politics of flying clubs. A simple fact check yield nothing. 🙂 You could have left it " I like new look" or something like that. LOL  Now you intrigued me with  that that mystery club of your. And as more you avoid to answer simple questions as more it drift to imaginary world 🙂

[ThomseN_inc 1,128]

8 minutes ago, sd_flyer said:

Now, you completely lost me. I'm sorry I didn't ask you discuss politics of flying clubs. A simple fact check yield nothing. 🙂 You could have left it " I like new look" or something like that. LOL  Now you intrigued me with  that that mystery club of your. And as more you avoid to answer simple questions as more it drift to imaginary world 🙂

I'm ok with that! Happy flying!

[Chock 17,769]

I'm the complete opposite. I can't be doing with posh interiors on aeroplanes, it makes me afraid to touch anything in case I leave a fingerprint on it lol. Gimme scuffed paint on the controls of something any day of the week, either in the real thing or a simulated version. 🤣

Edited January 21, 2021 by Chock

[HighBypass 2,339]

3 minutes ago, Chock said:

Gimme scuffed paint on the controls of something any day of the week

I find this to be an excellent aide memoire; if a lever or button is all shiny and pristine, it has obviously never been touched for a good reason. The scuffed pait lets me know what to use to operate the machine..  🍻

[Chock 17,769]

Just now, HighBypass said:

I find this to be an excellent aide memoire; if a lever or button is all shiny and pristine, it has obviously never been touched for a good reason. The scuffed pait lets me know what to use to operate the machine..  🍻

That's a good point. It's a bit like the adage of never having a meal at the house of someone with pristine set of pans hung up in the kitchen for show.

[sd_flyer 6,049]

Talking about realistic texturing

This one used to be top of the line with Aspen and TIS-B long before ADS-B was mandated in US. One of the first I learn about Aspen

Below is typical average flight school "classic" Arrow. Unfortunately it was totaled  by a renter (a newly certified commercial pilot  to be exact) after brilliantly handling cross wind landing at  at St George airport (Utah) striking wing, tail and engine upon suddenly appeared hangar! (no worries PAX and pilot were OK)

Finally  Turbo Arrow. It took little over 6 month of average renter to kill that turbo engine LOL

 

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

I have found it varies a lot.  Compared to a 1000 hour engine rebuild a cockpit reupholster and spruce up to keep an aircraft looking spiffy is not a huge cost every few years and some clubs are more than happy to pay for it.  For others the $5 an hour or whatever it adds to running costs is a big issue and they do the minimum.

Though I must say I only ever came across one older club plane that looked like brand new from the factory, an immaculately restored vintage C150 at the Aero Club in Coff's Harbour about 10 years back. These days they just have a jabiru.

[sd_flyer 6,049]

8 minutes ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

I have found it varies a lot.  Compared to a 1000 hour engine rebuild a cockpit reupholster and spruce up to keep an aircraft looking spiffy is not a huge cost every few years and some clubs are more than happy to pay for it.  For others the $5 an hour or whatever it adds to running costs is a big issue and they do the minimum.

Though I must say I only ever came across one older club plane that looked like brand new from the factory, an immaculately restored vintage C150 at the Aero Club in Coff's Harbour about 10 years back. These days they just have a jabiru.

Club represents whole bunch of private owners who lease their  aircraft to the club. Club will give some money back after taking their fee, pay for insurance, parking  fee and so on. Owners are responsible for scheduled  maintenance and all unforeseen tear and wear. What they earn can’t simply how to the pocket as unforeseen damage/maintenance  may require significant expanses.

Club role is supervise renters, apply safety/insurance requirement, keep up with required maintainable in timely manner  and so on . But in the end it’s up to owner who decides how much money pay for maintains credit  or how much to charge for rent . For example If owner X charges too much, renters would pick more competitive options. So owner gotta stick with local “market”

Furthermore , if owner A is mechanic his  maintenance cost will be significantly less than say owner B who is not. Or   if owner C restored himself upholstery, club can’t turn around and say to owner D  to do the same . What  if owner D  could not afford to pay someone else or simply does’ t want to do it . He/she may simply leave to other club.

But club needs to retain as many owners as they can. Because variety or quantity of airplanes  that what draw more renters. Clubs who don’t to a good job simply perish ...

Now, I don’t want to go into “relatively” inexpensive because it really has broad meaning . Fir some people 100k may be relatively inexpensive for some 1k. 

 

 

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

2 hours ago, sd_flyer said:

Club represents whole bunch of private owners who lease their  aircraft to the club. Club will give some money back after taking their fee, pay for insurance, parking  fee and so on. Owners are responsible for scheduled  maintenance and all unforeseen tear and wear. What they earn can’t simply how to the pocket as unforeseen damage/maintenance  may require significant expanses.

Club role is supervise renters, apply safety/insurance requirement, keep up with required maintainable in timely manner  and so on . But in the end it’s up to owner who decides how much money pay for maintains credit  or how much to charge for rent . For example If owner X charges too much, renters would pick more competitive options. So owner gotta stick with local “market”

Furthermore , if owner A is mechanic his  maintenance cost will be significantly less than say owner B who is not. Or   if owner C restored himself upholstery, club can’t turn around and say to owner D  to do the same . What  if owner D  could not afford to pay someone else or simply does’ t want to do it . He/she may simply leave to other club.

But club needs to retain as many owners as they can. Because variety or quantity of airplanes  that what draw more renters. Clubs who don’t to a good job simply perish ...

Now, I don’t want to go into “relatively” inexpensive because it really has broad meaning . Fir some people 100k may be relatively inexpensive for some 1k. 

 

 

ah ...

Aero Clubs in Australia are non profit making bodies that usually own the aircraft that the members rent. 

The only one I was every a member of owned a C172 and meetings often involved long discussions about stuff like how much fuel to leave in the club plane when it was parked after renting (filling it up might seemingly be considerate but it severely restricted the next members take-off weight) and whether to upgrade to a more powerful Lycoming at the next 1000 hourly at a slight increase per hour for members renting it (the decision was "no" on the basis that the bigger engine would be an ongoing higher expense for the club indefinitely).

Clearly different here to North America.

[sd_flyer 6,049]

7 minutes ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

ah ...

Aero Clubs in Australia are non profit making bodies that usually own the aircraft that the members rent. 

The only one I was every a member of owned a C172 and meetings often involved long discussions about stuff like how much fuel to leave in the club plane when it was parked after renting (filling it up might seemingly be considerate but it severely restricted the next members take-off weight) and whether to upgrade to a more powerful Lycoming at the next 1000 hourly at a slight increase per hour for members renting it (the decision was "no" on the basis that the bigger engine would be an ongoing higher expense for the club indefinitely).

Clearly different here to North America.

They are not profit here as well. But guess what? They pay for Club Office,  people who track maintenance, ferry airplanes, supervise and so on. So there is a profit in nonprofit LOL

By the way I actually visited Australia  about 10 years ago. I also rented and flew bitten up Piper Warrior out of  Moorabbin, and talked to different folks around airport. In fact, I loved my trip to Australia. I learn how to drive car from the right seat. I stumbled upon submarine in the middle of nowhere LOL I went to Sydney opera, and night asian market in Sydney downtown..Man when all thus covid word not allowed is over I'll be back!  LOL

[spacedyemeerkat 421]

12 hours ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

[Fools & Horses video snipped!]

Thank you for posting that. Haven't watched Fools & Horses since I've been an adult (and I'm now nearly 50!). Chortled out loud a couple of times, lovely start to my Friday.