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JETSET843D

EGCC Runway designator changes - how can FSX be changed?

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All,Manchester airport, England (EGCC) has recently changed its runway designations. 06L/R is now 05L/R and 24L/R is now 23L/R.I've used AFCAD to change the FS9 scenery but there isn't a AFCAD program for FSX.This highlights a problem where the default FS data is time locked with no opportunity for it to be updated.It would be very helpful to the FS community if Microsoft and Jepperson could provide updates to the FSX product so that the default scenery isn't time locked for the next 3 years. I would be happy to pay a reasonable amount for such updates.No doubt there will many other runway changes in the next three years as well as new VORs, NDBs etc. and it would be helpful if FSX could stay in sync with the real-world changes.NavData is a subscription service so something from Microsoft would I'm sure be welcomed.Cheers,

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You night be right that there is a market for updates. In this case, you might check out SDE at fsdeveloper.com to handle this type of job.scott s..

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Scott,That site appears to be aimed at scenery designers. Unfortunately I don't have the time or knowledge to learn how to use what is presumably a commercial product.Added to that is the problem of knowing what airports have changed since FSX was launched. I'm only aware of EGCC as it's my local airport and I happened by chance to come across a discussion about the runway changes.I know the ACES team still read these pages so if they feel it's technically possible and commercially viable to provide for example twice-yearly updates a comment from them would be appreciated.Cheers,

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Hi RayOver in Rochdale here Ray and didnt didnt know about the runway changes. Juist thought I'd say hello from another simmer in the NW of England!RegardsPaul EGCC

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Hi RayYeah I do have that scenery but I have just switched over to FSX, only last Sat actually, so I am will have to wait now until Machester Xtreme version comes out sometime this year. ( Looking forward to that one!}Anyway back to my my LevelD 767 and FSX....it is a fantastic Sim but it needs plenty of hosepower for sure.RegardsPaul EGCC

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Hi Paul,Great minds? I've started flying with FSX during the last two weeks after installing the patch. It's made it flyable on my relatively modest main PC.I used to fly the PIC767 years ago but as you can see from my sig I'm now in the PM camp where I fly the PMDG737 modified to remove all the panels etc.I know we're drifting off topic here. Looking forward too to EGCC Extreme. Enjoy your flying!

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>I would be happy to pay a reasonable amount for such updates.Jeppesen sells its FliteStar flight planning software covering Europe for about

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Pete Dowson has an older version of that software and he refuses to pay the extortionate cost for updates. It's okay for airlines to pay it (do they have an alternative?) but for the home user it's probably out of the question.If NavData can be obtained at reasonable rates then why would this kind of data be so expensive?On the EGCC update I obtained a new Mag Var for EGCC from the official AIC site. It's now 3.2W (old value was 5.0W). Given that the runways haven't physically moved I believe changing MagVar, runway desigs using AFCAD will have sucessfully modified the BGL. Certainly everything seems okay in FS9 up to now.

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We just are not set up for regular content updates. Its a place we'd like to get to, but we are not there yet.This is where the SDK and the developer community show their real value.

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Hi Phil,Thanks for your reply. I guess what you're saying is that the SDK provides the necessary info for 3rd party tools to be created that could modify the BGLs?Lee Swordy provided perhaps the most useful FS9 utility - AFCAD - that allowed this kind of info to be modified. What we need now is someone with his skills and know-how to produce a FSX equivalent.Perhaps in the next version of FS the deluxe version could include such a utility? It's nice to know you recognise the need for updates. Maybe we'll get them by the time FS11 arrives :-)Cheers,

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>>Lee Swordy provided perhaps the most >useful FS9 utility - AFCAD - that allowed >this kind of info to be modified. >What we need now is someone with his >skills and know-how to produce >a FSX equivalent.>and that someone exsitJon Masterson (scruffyduck) has done the same thing for FSX with his CAD program.Go get ADE for the runway number changes and SDE for the approach code changes (runway) from FSDeveloper. ADE is in public beta. It will do what you want in its current version.ADE will also renumber the taxiway signs.

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Jim,Thanks. I'll take a look at it. In the long term I would still like Microsoft to provide an update service and the response from Phil suggests we'll have it one day.Cheers,

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Pls let us know how long it took to change the data in the sim, with no special knowleadge, just following the above links. Really interested.Thanks.

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I'm very suprised the designator's can't be changed in FSX!!Just for your information, i'm not sure if it's been mention but EGTK is also undergoing modifications. RWY01-19 has been widened and an ILS installed equipt up to CAT 1 ILS. Also 09-27 has been closed. Regards,Jetset843D

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I thought I spotted a localiser array when I drove past yesterday. "Ooh, that's new" I said to myself! (Did my night rating at Oxford several years ago :) )

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>I thought I spotted a localiser array when I drove past>yesterday. "Ooh, that's new" I said to myself! (Did my night>rating at Oxford several years ago :) )Yeah, i hear work is on schedule for completion next week, so hopefully i'll be shooting a few ILS approaches rather than the NDB procedure!!RegardsJames

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I have made a revised BGL for EGCC/Manchester which changes the runway numbers from 06/24 R-L to 05/23 R-L (visually) as required and the new mag.var however this has created more problems than it has solved!1) Although aircraft request clearance from ATC nothing taxis to the runway? Suspect that landing aircraft maybe affected but didn't see any during my short test (tim constraint here!).2) The ATIS is all over the place reporting the new runway numbers and the also the old as well?3) As expected all the taxi signs are now incorrect - that is a scenery file problem I reckon??One thing about using FSXPlanner to do this - although changing the numbers was easy when the new XML file was created for this airport it appears the runway sections were not. However the editor took care of this when each section was highlighted as were the taxiways and start points.(btw, don't do any global changes with your text/xml editor as this may compromise gate numbers!!)This is obviously a 'work in progress' now - but any hints at overcoming the above ould be welcomed ;)Bye bye for now,

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How do you define extortionate? - More than you want to pay?

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I don't know where in the world you live as you've hidden your profile but in the UK it means...Exorbitant or immoderate.How would you define it?

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Runways are not separate individual elements in FS.They are part of an integrated whole which includes both visual scenery and airspace usage.Jim Vile has been doing this type of update for over 2 years and has done 14 airport for FSX already.I won't touch MagVar because changing that in FS will physically move the runway in the sim/ scenery. The MagVar in FSX 4.000. If you change the MagVar - you also need to change the entire FSX world MagVar reference files/ system. This has to stay frozen in time.To change a runway designator in FS you have to:1. Change the runway properties for the primary end of the runway.2. Delete and readd any ILS so they will be correctly associated with the 'new' runway.3. Change all taxiway sign information to the new runway designators.4. Change runway link lines (black in AFCAD) which run between nodes on the runway to the new designator.5. Change all approaches which have the runway designator in the approach code.6. You will probably want this data to be in two separate scenery files - one with approach data, one with editable data such as parking and taxiways.You have to be very careful to make sure the changed runway is not 'separated' from the taxiway system.

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Peter,I think your taxiway network has become separated from the runways for you issue #1.Secondly, where are you placing the modified file in your scenery?Jim has found that approach data works best in the Generic or Global folder and editable data in a separate file in the Addon Scenery folder.If find changing the taxiway signs easier to do in a text or XML editor with search and replace rather than individually clicking on each in a graphical tool.FSXPlanner does not add the necessary Delete Airport statements yet to tell FS to ignore items in the default APX file.Sorry to take so long to get back to you - I was on a trip last week.Reggie

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Reggie,Thanks for your reply but I won't be touching this in FSX as I don't have the skills.Peter will, I'm sure, be grateful for your help.

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latest ver has an exclude built in so you should now be able to remove those old taxi signs. Get latest.

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