10 minutes ago, Reader said:

Entering the pin on your debit card identifies you to the bank in exactly the same way as an ID card does. The only difference is that you formally identified yourself when you obtained the bank account that the debit card accesses. The pin is just a shortcut back to that ID.

Not exactly. How does that prevent against someone coming in with my card and knowing the PIN? A card without a photo doesn't validate identity.

11 minutes ago, Reader said:

As a matter of real interest, there is a wide world outside the United States of America that does not necessarily
share or appreciate the same culture, rules, laws or indeed constitution and in many parts of it, ID cards are
routine and as explained above, offer far more benefits than drawbacks.

My home country before I moved to the US did not have a national ID outside of a passport, and certainly didn't require me to carry it around. This is not a US-specific thing.

If you want to carry it around, you're welcome to. It's the mandatory aspect for no good purpose that concerns some of us.

The problem is that people assume that there's these accurate state and federal databases of people, and that there aren't any gaps in data or inaccuracies.  I mean, database technology has been around for decades now, it isn't that hard, right?  Databases are easy, but getting the data is hard.  

What happens when the data is inaccurate?  Who corrects that?  Who decides what's a mistake and what's someone trying to steal someone's id?  

Politicians especially want you to think that everything is organized and flawless.  That's not the truth.  

Has anyone been to their DMV in the last few years?  Everything goes well... until it doesn't.  Government bureaucracies are the butt of jokes for a reason.  

Just some personal examples I have for when things go terribly wrong:

My wife and I were married last century.  She took my last name way back then.  Our local election board still had her listed under her maiden name for 20+ years.  Every election year we submitted the name change request, and every year... nothing happened.  She just finally can now vote under her married name.  

A friend of mine has a very, very common last name.  He goes on a business trip and finds out on the day that "he's" on the "no fly" list.  He had to have a very difficult conversation with his boss on why this trip was cancelled last minute.  

Has anyone tried the id.me stuff?  A total mess just to prove who you are.  

The important questions are who will fix issues and why do we need this?  Is "more government bureaucracy" ever the answer?  

 

 

 

 

I'm not a fan of big govt., but that doesn't mean that I'm OK with people using fake IDs, and there are many people with driver licenses that contain false information, especially considering that some States don't perform their due diligence in verifying identity and address.  I have a relative who worked in medical billing and she told stories of how often people with no insurance would present their ID at the hospital, and then when they tried to bill them they discovered that the name and/or address was false.

First, one isn't required to have a RealID, but I think that eventually everyone should be.

In order to obtain one you must prove that you are a citizen or legal resident using a birth certificate or passport, and provide 2 different types of documents as proof of address, like a utility bill and bank statement.

It is perfectly reasonable that one must have a verifiably valid ID in order to get on a plane, train, or bus, gain entry to certain facilities, and purchase a firearm.

Ultimately, there needs to be a way to verify that a person is who they say they are, lives where they say they live, and is in your country legally, either with a Visa, or as a legal resident or citizen. 

Dave

 

You need ID to get on a train or a bus or a plane?

Why?

Why can’t you get on a plane for a domestic flight by just going through a security check to x-ray your luggage and see you haven’t got a machine gun up your rear end?

Why do you need to produce ID? 

 

27 minutes ago, DD_Arthur said:

You need ID to get on a train or a bus or a plane?

Why?

Why can’t you get on a plane for a domestic flight by just going through a security check to x-ray your luggage and see you haven’t got a machine gun up your rear end?

Why do you need to produce ID? 

 

 September 11 2001......nuff said...

18 minutes ago, Delta111 said:

 September 11 2001......nuff said...

All the 9/11 hijackers used legitimate ID issued in their own names.

 

 

9 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

In the UK we don't have to carry a driving licence

how do the police check if you have a valid driving licence 

1 hour ago, DD_Arthur said:

You need ID to get on a train or a bus or a plane?

Why?

Why can’t you get on a plane for a domestic flight by just going through a security check to x-ray your luggage and see you haven’t got a machine gun up your rear end?

Why do you need to produce ID? 

 

duh i can think of many reasons to produce an id  to get on the plane  but you already know  the  answers any way

1 hour ago, pete_auau said:

how do the police check if you have a valid driving licence 

They use the name and date of birth to check the database.
 

I don't see the slightest problem but each to his own.

 

Edited June 10, 2025Jun 10 by IanHarrison
Change

3 hours ago, pete_auau said:

duh i can think of many reasons to produce an id  to get on the plane  but you already know  the  answers any way

Indeed?

8 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

All the 9/11 hijackers used legitimate ID issued in their own names.

 

 

  Yes, Passports to get their B1 Visa's to enter the country from various M.E. countries (Mostly Saudi),,but In fact, 18 of the 19 hijackers had acquired some form of fraudulent ID, including 30 driver's licenses from various states to take flight lessons...

 Sorry, no disrespect, but you know not of what you speak....(write)..

 

Edited June 10, 2025Jun 10 by Delta111

54 minutes ago, Delta111 said:

  Yes, Passports to get their B1 Visa's to enter the country from various M.E. countries (Mostly Saudi),,but In fact, 18 of the 19 hijackers had acquired some form of fraudulent ID, including 30 driver's licenses from various states to take flight lessons...

 Sorry, no disrespect, but you know not of what you speak....(write)..

 

So this actually demonstrates that ID was pointless in the first place...

 

32 minutes ago, DD_Arthur said:

So this actually demonstrates that ID was pointless in the first place...

 

 

  Again your showing your ignorance....They were essentially anonymous AFTER entry into the U.S...They used Fraudulent I.D. to obtain D.L. 's Medicals..and to enter KBOS...

We are done, you know nothing about what your spouting.....

6 minutes ago, Delta111 said:

We are done, you know nothing about what your spouting.....

'We'? I believe you mean you are done...but thank you for proving my point;

the increasing insistence of the over-arching state on it's citizens to prove who they are or what they are doing at any given time has little to do with legitimate concerns of preventing crime but much more with authorities attempts to accumulate as much information on the private lives of their law-abiding populations.