But who flies a simulator out of the box? In MFS I have spent more on airports than I would like to admit, because most of them are very bad and I am a person who is not very demanding and in X-plane most of the airports I use the default ones.

2 hours ago, GCBraun said:

Because it just is, at least right out of the box.

Yes, I have made this point many times.

38 minutes ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Easy: All you have to do is fly helicopters or bush planes. 😎

Got me there 😁

With "seeing traffic even miles away" is (among others) meant, that you can see the chem... contrails of other planes tens of miles away (depending on what you set up in Livetraffic). And if you zoom in (like if you would use binoculars in reality for e.g. planespotting from your balcony) you can see the plane at the beginning of the contrails.

 

3 hours ago, Rimshot said:

What I'm trying to say is, although the skies are busy, it is very hard to spot other traffic.

Ah, got you.  I wasn't suggesting if its in the sky it WILL be seen - as you say other traffic can be hard to spot.  In XP12 the traffic is going to be visible if conditions allow, where in MSFS it probably won't be because the LODs will cull the aircraft quite close by.

3 hours ago, Rimshot said:

of course dependent on your position relative to the sun, you definitely do not see other traffic from miles away...

If conditions allow traffic miles away to be seen, you will see it in XP12 because traffic is not culled early due to low LODs. in MSFS traffic is culled from the display when it should still be visible.

Edited July 9, 2025Jul 9 by MrBitstFlyer

1 minute ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

s. in MSFS traffic is culled from the display when it should still be visible.

Along with taxi signs, airport buildings amongst a whole host of other things. The LOD is absolutely atrocious in MSFS. 

8 minutes ago, uwespeed said:

With "seeing traffic even miles away" is (among others) meant, that you can see the chem... contrails of other planes tens of miles away (depending on what you set up in Livetraffic). And if you zoom in (like if you would use binoculars in reality for e.g. planespotting from your balcony) you can see the plane at the beginning of the contrails.

In my XP12 I can see the aircraft at the head on the CONTRAILS, tens of miles away without the need to zoom in.

41 minutes ago, UrgentSiesta said:

ADSB shows the skies usually crowded, but other than the Heavies, it's hard to spot aircraft.

Absolutely agree, but at least they are drawn in XP12.  Just as IRL, if conditions allow, you can spot another GA a long way off.  However, if conditions are poor you may not see the other GA when it is quite close.  The point is, in MSFS2024 you will not see the other traffic unless it is very close because of the way that sim Culls the traffic when it should still be visible.

14 minutes ago, uwespeed said:

With "seeing traffic even miles away"

I would be able to see the aircraft in your second shot, not just the contrail. It may just be a couple of pixels, but it will be there.

Perhaps we are not all seeing traffic as far out due to settings or PC system?

I think this thread would probably have gone in a better direction if you left out “the best” and comparing to “other sims”.

In my experience, promoting a platforms works best when you don’t “compare” and don’t use words/phrases like “the best”.  But show what the platform can do, regardless of “in the box” or with “add-ons”.  When you communicate like that, you can lose much of your audience.

Videos tend to work better for promoting as they show a more complete picture (including FPS overlay if deemed important to the presentation which may or may not be important pending what is being portrayed).

XP has a lot of good stuff, so do other platforms … let the good speak for itself and users will decide “best”.  Otherwise threads just turn into long debates distracting from the initial objective and in some cases end up being closed as another X vs. Y sim.

But thanks for sharing the add-ons used … I’m not familiar with Apple Maps Pro so will have to research that and see how I can make it work for me.

Rob.

21 hours ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

Apple Maps Pro

Never used those before.

https://maps.apple.com/frame?map=satellite

Looks almost cloudless, but the color matching between some tiles is meh.

57 minutes ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

Got me there 😁

Not meant as a gotcha at all.

You know I'm a big fan of XP, too 😁🤙

53 minutes ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

Just as IRL, if conditions allow, you can spot another GA a long way off.

53 minutes ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

The point is, in MSFS2024 you will not see the other traffic unless it is very close

Now I am curious about your definition of 'a long way off' and 'very close'. Again, when traffic is 'a long way of' you'll probably never see it in real life, so what's the benefit if a sim is capable of showing it? I'll have to fiddle with X-Plane again and try LiveTraffic to see for myself how it looks 👍

Edited July 9, 2025Jul 9 by Rimshot

1 hour ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

I like to call it 'arcade'. 

The term 'subjective' was already mentioned in this thread and your remark is a perfect example. I do understand what you mean by it though. X-Plane 12 isn't better in this regard as far as I'm concerned. Just like when flying in MSFS 2024, when using X-Plane I also have that immersive breaking notion I'm looking at a computer generated world. In some cases that notion is much stronger with X-Plane, in other occasions with MSFS...

1 hour ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

I would be able to see the aircraft in your second shot, not just the contrail. It may just be a couple of pixels, but it will be there.

Perhaps we are not all seeing traffic as far out due to settings or PC system?

On the one hand my screenshot above is originally 4K (resolution of my monitor) but resized by the image hoster to a smaller size. However, it might be that the size of the traffic planes in XP depends on the FOV (or other things) in the graphics settings. Have to try this later.

Apart from that, the traffic isn't "only visible", but also generates wake turbulences - which affect your own plane when flying into them.

 

Edited July 9, 2025Jul 9 by uwespeed