:( Just noticed on the front page of Avsim a press release blurb for the 787 Dreamliner from Abacus. Just a word of warning, not it isn't!!It might look like a 787 on the outside (if you have bad eyesight) but on the inside is where the horrors really begin. The devs haven't even tried to simulate the 787 systems. What you get are super enlarged 737 panels, 3d modeling worthy of a small child and a sound set that is more than a little baffling. When it takes off it sounds like a hairdryer with a bad motor.I'm assuming this package will be suitably mauled to death by whichever Avsim reviewer has the misfortune to get it.We often baulk at paying good money for really good add-ons (the Duke, Piper Cheyenne, Mustang, PDMG, Pilatus, Level-D, UTX2, Rex, Fex, GEX) but those packages show where the real skill is because the Abacus 787 is nothing short of a lie wrapped in a $30 price tag.Hard to believe that it took 7 people to make something this bad.

:( Just noticed on the front page of Avsim a press release blurb for the 787 Dreamliner from Abacus. Just a word of warning, not it isn't!!It might look like a 787 on the outside (if you have bad eyesight) but on the inside is where the horrors really begin. The devs haven't even tried to simulate the 787 systems. What you get are super enlarged 737 panels, 3d modeling worthy of a small child and a sound set that is more than a little baffling. When it takes off it sounds like a hairdryer with a bad motor.I'm assuming this package will be suitably mauled to death by whichever Avsim reviewer has the misfortune to get it.We often baulk at paying good money for really good add-ons (the Duke, Piper Cheyenne, Mustang, PDMG, Pilatus, Level-D, UTX2, Rex, Fex, GEX) but those packages show where the real skill is because the Abacus 787 is nothing short of a lie wrapped in a $30 price tag.Hard to believe that it took 7 people to make something this bad.

I still don't understand how Abacus continues we these projects they have been in flightsim for many many years I wish they would start making some good quality stuff it doesn't have to be perfect but at least try too.

I still don't understand how Abacus continues we these projects they have been in flightsim for many many years I wish they would start making some good quality stuff it doesn't have to be perfect but at least try too.

reminds me of the A380 debacle!

I'm still waiting for the FD 5 patch that Abucus support stated in an email on 7/18/2008 was nearly ready. I for one will never give them another penny. There are way too many quality develpers to support :( Brad

When I saw the screenshot of the VC I thought it must have been April Fools.

Does this model feature fully flexed wings while on the ground and not moving like the last one? That cracked me up the first time I saw it. It's like the modellers took the CGI images from Boeing without any knowledge of what wings do in flight. Especially wings that are designed to flex to a greater degree than non-composite wings. Just looking at shots of the model on the ground was embarassing. Camil Valiquette's exterior model is much, much better and more accurate to the real thing.

NOW....here's the real value of the AVSIM Forum. Thanks everyone, you again saved me money. "ABACUS...get the message, FIRE your aircraft designers, and produce some good quality, and MAYBE I'll buy something from you."Stan

Ever buy something from the dollar store? Ever wonder how a dollar store stays in business? Obviously, the dollar store plays a role in the economy and so does Abacus. Having said that, Abacus products vary in quality and some of the tools are quite good (FS Repaint 2, FSDS, etc.). I can't imagine anyone, other than the uninitiated, seeing any Abacus aircraft release and not being savvy to what is involved. It reminds me of guitars really; there are cheap guitars and very expensive guitars and a market for each. I mean, it does take flight and bear a passing resemblance to a 787 right? For some, that is enough. At least half of the airliners add-ons out there get by on looks alone and some products don't even have that going for them.

Well, it may not be the best add-on ever, I don't know because I don't own it, but you do at least have to give Abacus some leeway, since even Boeing don't actually know how the 787 is finally going to turn out, given that it is currently undergoing some redesign. So a product such as the Abacus 787 is bound to be a bit inaccurate in some respects.It's quite de rigueur to slam Abacus for many, but they don't pretend to make 100 percent accurate stuff much of the time, instead their products offer what might be described as 'a taste of things'. Notwithstanding that, some of their stuff is very worthy, especially FSDS and their products along those lines. And even if their add-on aircraft products don't appeal to one's hard core sensibilities, it's as well to remember that not everyone wants that hard core experience; if it were true that every person who has bought FS wanted something that operated like a full on simulation, FS would have died out years ago as a niche product for the few, and thus not have been even remotely economically viable. So the hard core types have companies such as Abacus to thank for catering to those wider markets, for if it wasn't for those kind of products that make it into the game stores, we'd probably have been still stuck with FS98.Al

HelloIf it wasn't for FSDS I doubt we would have got this far.

Well, it may not be the best add-on ever, I don't know because I don't own it, but you do at least have to give Abacus some leeway, since even Boeing don't actually know how the 787 is finally going to turn out, given that it is currently undergoing some redesign. So a product such as the Abacus 787 is bound to be a bit inaccurate in some respects.

i think that's the rub. why are they simulating an unfinished aircraft? if the people who make the actual plane don't know the full story how can these, so-called, designers? I disagree that the FS community owes the devs of bad products anything. Bad products are bad products and this 787 thing is just a bad product. It's a blatant lie, it's chopped up pieces of other peoples work wrapped in a ropey model with an air file that doesn't even exist yet.there are plenty of great add on products available for almost the same price. let's not pretend that the devs behind this are doing the FS community a favour just because!

Ever buy something from the dollar store? Ever wonder how a dollar store stays in business? Obviously, the dollar store plays a role in the economy and so does Abacus. Having said that, Abacus products vary in quality and some of the tools are quite good (FS Repaint 2, FSDS, etc.). I can't imagine anyone, other than the uninitiated, seeing any Abacus aircraft release and not being savvy to what is involved. It reminds me of guitars really; there are cheap guitars and very expensive guitars and a market for each. I mean, it does take flight and bear a passing resemblance to a 787 right? For some, that is enough. At least half of the airliners add-ons out there get by on looks alone and some products don't even have that going for them.

No better analogy to be had than this one Ahuimanu!Anyone remember your entry level guitar? Entry level car? Entry level ski's or golf clubs?Abacus makes no bones about the fact that they build entry level FS products. Expectations of more sophistication from them will not be met unless Arnie and others decide to go the "full boat route." :(

Bad products are bad products and this 787 thing is just a bad product. It's a blatant lie, it's chopped up pieces of other peoples work wrapped in a ropey model with an air file that doesn't even exist yet.

Do you mean the real 787 or the Abacus version ? You pretty much describe the real 787, when the bean counters are in charge of designing an airplane you end up with the mess that is the real 787. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/busi...9_boeing14.html

I'm not sure why there's so much hate on here - my feeling is that you have some constructive criticism about a product, then bring it on. But, most of the comments here seem to be leveled against Abacus as a company. It sort of reminds me about the mindless tirades against Captainsim. I liked the "dollar store" analogy. Abacus is one of the oldest FS add-on retailers, and in many ways they seem to be stuck 10 years in the past. Obviously, they might not have much to offer to most of the posters in this topic, but I'm sure that there are people out there who want simpler FS add-ons.And that's what the 787 seems to be to me - a basic aircraft model design designed according to the FSX SDK. It doesn't emulate the advanced systems that you will find in PMDGs offerings, but not everyone is into reading tech manuals before flying - some people just want to get in and fly. I imagine this is why the 787 is less than half the price than PMDGs 747/MD-11. Now, for what it's worth, I do fly PMDGs 747, but I understand that there are people who want a simpler aircraft.And yeah, before we had all this payware to choose from, it was an Abacus product (FSDS) that allowed the add-on community to exist.- Martin

I don't quite understand this, though. Abacus had a 787 for a few months now, maybe even more. So either they released a new version, or a seperate new product, which I can hardly imagine. To me it looks like the previous one they had. Heck, go to the FSPilotShop and you'll find the Abacus 787 there with the text: "This product was added to our catalog on Saturday 02 December, 2006."! I'm not sure what is going on here, and I speak not as a reviewer but as a regular member, but might the news staff here at AVSIM put something on the news page which didn't actually happen?Concerning Abacus products, I disagree in part about the quality of their products. i reviewed their international fighters package, which gives 11 aircraft for 30 dollars. Given the price and amount of stuff you get for it, the price matches the quality. I still wouldn't buy it myself, because I'm quite opposed to this sort of package. I'm of the opinion that they should have taken out the best planes of the package, improve them by given them a better VC and clearing up some FDE related stuff, and ell that. So, you'll get 5 or 6 good enough planes, instead of 30 planes that are about the level of the default aircraft. Still, I can't argue that the price didn't match the qaulity, because we are talking about less than 3 dollars a model here...