So this is a serious question that really irks me and I am intentionally posting it in the FSX forum as you are the users I want to hear from first hand...Why is it that every time a conversation about FS9 comes up a lot (and I am not saying all or making generalizations here) but a lot of FSX users jump in and bash FS9 like it is some inferior good for nothing sim and everyone associated it with it is poor or good for nothing just like the sim? Do FSX simmers forget that the engine FSX is built around is FS9? Do users forget all the YEARS of enjoyment FS9 brought us? Do simmers realize that had it not been for FS9 there would probably be no FSX? Do FSX users forget the level of realism AC like the PMDG 737/747/MD11 the RFP 747-200 and SO many others brought us? It reminds me of the Harley Davidson rider who thumbs his nose at a guy riding any other bike. It is sad and disheartening to see the blatant superiority complex SOME FSX users feel over their FS9 counterparts.AND BY NO MEANS am I dismissing FS9 users from this equation at all. For the most part a lot of FS9 users (myself included at times) have not helped our cause by some of the FSX criticisms by FS9 users. No one is without blame here.But and this is a big BUT, why is their such a negative disposition to FS9? What did it ever do wrong? Was it so worthless for all those years that you weren't really enjoying it? Or does a lot of this come from FSX users who never even simmed with FS9 and do not appreciate how much it has brought to our hobby and how critical it was for the development of FSX? And to the bigger point, why is anyone who still chooses to use FS9 deemed to be immediately inferior or from a lower economic standing than an FSX user? Trust me, people don't want to start comparing W-2's here but I am just so disheartened by the constant insulting of FS9 users and FS9 in itself I wanted to try and understand where it comes from and what if anything can be done to remedy this situation and allow us to just share our love of FS regardless of our choice of sim... And for all the FS9 users myself included that does mean coming to terms that the development hayday of FS9 has long past and if you are going to stay with it you should for the most part be happy with what we have and NOT expect developers to churn out FS9 releases the same way they did in the past. We do not always do ourselves favors by assuming every release is going to be FS9 compatible although we are CERTAINLY grateful when it is!!! There is a certain level of reality that has to be faced if choosing to remain with FS9. So I do not hold FS9 users in a white light with a halo around their head either, I see both sides but again, I do not understand the animosity, the lack of appreciation for FS9 and what it is and was; and the insults strewn at FS9 and its users...That is my .02 for the day, As Mr. Rogers once said, would you be mine, could you be mine, won't you be my neighbor...I think it is time we put this conversation on the table once and for all and we should all address the 800 pound gorilla in the room and possibly by talking through some of this we can come to a middle ground with a respect and appreciation for all sims and all simmers.Sincerely,Paul Solk

Hi,I still use both, I am spending more and more time with FSX and I believe once PMDG and Level-D puts out their new aircraft I will be leaving FS9 behind. I am fortunate enough to have a great system and the ability financially to continue to purchase hardware as it becomes available. FS2004/FS9 with all the third party addons available to the flight sim community is a great sim and will be for years to come!!!. I also believe its in the same league as FSX, I believe someone coined the phrase FS9.75, and I agree. However, I spend most of my time (99+%) in Boeing aircraft, the Level-D 767 as great as it is, is dated. The advancements that FSX brings to third party developers will allow Level-D's new 757 and PMDG's 737 to achieve new hights in realism that I believe are unobtainable in FS2004/FS9.All-in-All, both sims with third party addons are - "G R E A T"Just my 2 cents

Hi,I still use both, I am spending more and more time with FSX and I believe once PMDG and Level-D puts out their new aircraft I will be leaving FS9 behind. I am fortunate enough to have a great system and the ability financially to continue to purchase hardware as it becomes available. FS2004/FS9 with all the third party addons available to the flight sim community is a great sim and will be for years to come!!!. I also believe its in the same league as FSX, I believe someone coined the phrase FS9.75, and I agree. However, I spend most of my time (99+%) in Boeing aircraft, the Level-D 767 as great as it is, is dated. The advancements that FSX brings to third party developers will allow Level-D's new 757 and PMDG's 737 to achieve new hights in realism that I believe are unobtainable in FS2004/FS9.All-in-All, both sims with third party addons are - "G R E A T"Just my 2cents

Thanks Mike, I whole-heartedly agree with everything you said and appreciate the input,-Paul

A good thread Paul. How are you these days, do you still use 'LFS'?Okay, this is my four penneth, for what it's worth.My answer to your question is, some (and I am only talking about a minority here) think that because they have entered flight sim via FSX that it's the only one. When they found that FSX was nothing more than a 'slide-show' they badgered daddy to upgrade their hardware.Daddy not wanting his little runt to be upset complied with the request and now little johnny can boast that he has the latest 'all singing and dancing' hardware by not telling daddy that he pulled the wool over his eyes in a big way.As you will find in other forums the subject of your question is usually caused by the under 15's. It's a sad fact though that, some of our more mature associates never really progressed any further than the previous mentioned younger users.

A good thread Paul. How are you these days, do you still use 'LFS'?Okay, this is my four penneth, for what it's worth.My answer to your question is, some (and I am only talking about a minority here) think that because they have entered flight sim via FSX that it's the only one. When they found that FSX was nothing more than a 'slide-show' they badgered daddy to upgrade their hardware.Daddy not wanting his little runt to be upset complied with the request and now little johnny can boast that he has the latest 'all singing and dancing' hardware by not telling daddy that he pulled the wool over his eyes in a big way.As you will find in other forums the subject of your question is usually caused by the under 15's. It's a sad fact though that, some of our more mature associates never really progressed any further than the previous mentioned younger users.

Hi Dave,Interestingly enough, I just took the G25 wheel out for the first time in ages last night... I happen to have gotten hooked on DIRT2 and the rally racing, nothing like throwing that tail out around a tight 180 :)As for your response, I think it brings up a valid point...Users never knowing or understanding FS9 but ALSO:Perhaps as it is the minority of FS9 users who are always insisting that all releases they want should be in FS9 and bashing FSX are ruining the opinion of FS9 users as a whole by FSX users it is the vocal minority of FS9 bashers who are reciprocally ruining FS9 users opinion of FSX users... But why the hate of the sim? What did FS9 ever do to anyone expect provide years of enjoyment, realism and the foundation to FSX...Appreciate all of the input, hopefully we can keep this an amicable respectful conversation instead of a demeaning and insulting testosterone fest ;)Paul

Sincerely,Paul Solk

Well Paul I have always the feeling it's the opposite, if you say you like FSX the FS9 only users will tell you how wrong you are even yelling :(I actually don't care which version you use it's all about the immersion factor enjoyment you get out of our/you're passion for aviation...I had a tremendous time in FS9 and a great program for it's time but for me personal I moved ahead and have only FSX installed anymore...I never understood the emotions of telling other people what to use lol, it's per simmer different and all about your own aviation immersion experience and that is per simmer different. @G7USL It certainly has nothing to do with ages and the post with the bold screaming letters is just an impolite insult to other fellow simmers of different ages.Have fun guys in whatever simulator you will enjoy aviation :-)Cheers,

Hi Andre!Hope you are well, you know I ALWAYS appreciate your input... And I totally agree and could have posted the complete inverse on the FS9 forum and probably should! As I mentioned no one is without blame and I think you summed it up best here:

I actually don't care which version you use it's all about the immersion factor enjoyment you get out of our/you're passion for aviation...I had a tremendous time in FS9 and a great program for it's time but for me personal I moved ahead and have only FSX installed anymore...I never understood the emotions of telling other people what to use lol, it's per simmer different and all about your own aviation immersion experience and that is per simmer different.

Cheers Andre, all the best always, hope the boys are well!!!-PaulJust to show I am not taking sides here this is what I posted in the FS9 forums:Thanks Joe,And as Andre posted out in the FSX thread, this could be completely reversed and posted to the FS9 user who feels they need to shove FS9 down everyone's throat and constantly bash FSX and its users... No one is without blame and we all need to look at ourselves in the mirror and evaluate our own behavior if we are going to overcome the FS9/FSX animosity and divide in the forums...It should be about our love of aviation, our common love of simming and your immersion in whatever you choose to fly...Paul

It really comes down to personal preferences.I've run, enjoyed, and developed for both for a good while and happen to think both are great sims.Best advice is to ignore the critics of both and enjoy yourself. It is after all, YOUR sim experience and your money. :( :(

It really comes down to personal preferences.I've run, enjoyed, and developed for both for a good while and happen to think both are great sims.Best advice is to ignore the critics of both and enjoy yourself. It is after all, YOUR sim experience and your money. :( :(

Again, very well said!

I think the answer very simple, the human ego...a desire to be associated with the best, a desire to be proven correct. It's the cause of 99% of all of our arguements and problems, and not just in flight-sim. It always boggles my mind how some people get so heated over pretend-flying in a pretend world.

I think the answer very simple, the human ego...a desire to be associated with the best, a desire to be proven correct. It's the cause of 99% of all of our arguements and problems, and not just in flight-sim. It always boggles my mind how some people get so heated over pretend-flying in a pretend world.

First of all, very nice systems! Agree with the ego statement but PRETEND? Pretend Flying in a Pretend World!! How dare you!!! That is like saying there is no Easter bunny or tooth fairy! :( Obviously kidding, but sometimes sarcasm is not depicted well in the written world...Very true though.-Paul

I've got a moderate rig and a bath that needs redecorating. Guess what comes first? :(I like FSX much better. Looks prettier most of the time (although I do miss FZ Portland), and has better addons (although I do miss the PMDG 737).I'm sort of glad FSX seems to be the last FS version for quite some time. Gives us time to settle down. I wish FS9ers the best of luck, but I hope they're convinced over to the FSX camp at some point, so that addon developers can start some more efficient single platform products. I worry that FS9ers slow down the process.

I've been using FSX since it came out, prior to that FS9 and before that 2002, and then 2000, and FS 98 too!I think FS9 is a great product with many excellent addons. However we constantly hear from the FS9 "crowd" how developers should still produce FS9 products. What are the reasons they give? Mostly that they have too many dollars invested in FS9 addons and that they cannot afford to upgrade to FSX capable hardware and repurchase addons for FSX.Many developers have stated that the FS9 download market is very small (and non existent for boxed FS9 products because no shop is willing to give shelf space to addons for a superseded sim). Developers will not see the same ROI for FS9 products as they will for FSX products.Why do so many FS9 users continue to plead for these developers to produce products for FS9? Do these users think developers are a charity for the benefit of such a small FS9 community?Sure its painful but the FS9 community must accept that FS9 addons are no more. The future is for FSX addons only. Developers have realised this and moved on and now the remaining FS9 users must accept this fact too and stop begging for new FS9 addons. By all means keep flying your FS9 but stop badgering developers and the FSX community (especially in a FSX forum :( )Of course all IMHO!

I've got a moderate rig and a bath that needs redecorating. Guess what comes first? :( I like FSX much better. Looks prettier most of the time (although I do miss FZ Portland), and has better addons (although I do miss the PMDG 737).I'm sort of glad FSX seems to be the last FS version for quite some time. Gives us time to settle down. I wish FS9ers the best of luck, but I hope they're convinced over to the FSX camp at some point, so that addon developers can start some more efficient single platform products. I worry that FS9ers slow down the process.

Unfortunately it is true that FS9 users are hardly the supporters of commercial devs that they used to be.For this reason you see commercial devs tending towards the single platform that FSX represents. :(

Well Paul I have always the feeling it's the opposite, if you say you like FSX the FS9 only users will tell you how wrong you are even yelling :(

I have the exact same feeling: to me it seems FS9 users always used (!) to say FSX was (!) crap etc. I honestly think the disposition to FSX by FS9 users far outweighted the disposition to FS9 from FSX users! FSX user knew where they were coming from, while FS9 didn't really know where they were going. :( I can even say the topic title really surprised me...!I loved FS9, just as I loved all previous version of FS, going back to the beginning of the nineties here. It's just that to ME each new version simply was better than the previous one. So personally I never had a negative disposition to FS9 (or any previous version): I always simply had a positive disposition to the newer version. :(