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CaptainGabe

Message To The Passengers Of Air Travel.

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So, after spending the past 40 minutes going through comments on facebook news posts of the recent air crashes, something kept bothering me greatly: All the people saying they wont travel anymore and the world is ending! As someone who loves aviation, it bothers me how three crashes close timed to each other can affect the public so greatly. So, here is what I posted to my personal Facebook.
 

"I'm tired of everyone saying "Oh my all these plane crashes, never flying again" and "All these plane crashes...why is the world ending?!"

First, flying is the safest way to travel. Period. In 2012, the U.S. alone lost about 33,000 people in car crashes...compare that to 360 of flying AROUND THE WORLD.

Now all these recent airplane crashes, that is just all bad timing and bad coincidence...and really, none have any connection to each other other than aircraft models and airline which is also just coincidence.

Also, MH17 was just at the wrong place at the wrong time, God rest all the innocent souls on that flight but no, that is no excuse not to fly.

So, I just wanted to say, flying is still much safer than flying and nobody should be seeing this as a end of time or a warning to not to travel by air."

 

Does anyone agree? I know I'm not the only one seeing these ridiculous comments. Please feel free to leave your opinion. I left some questions to ponder on.

-Is the public over reacting with the safety of air travel?
-Are airlines assuring the public enough it's safe to fly?

-Is air travel still as safe as we think?
-Am I having too many late night philosophical moments? 

 

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-Is the public over reacting with the safety of air travel?

 

Probably. But remember that most people assumed missles couldn't hit targets over 30,000ft up. But now it's known that possible. Also MH370 is a weird mystery. People are drawn to that, and that news gets out more.


-Are airlines assuring the public enough it's safe to fly?

 

They are now. I never thought that it would ever be safe to fly over any kind of conflict, no matter how high. But they assumed civvies were safe. Not anymore (even if that wasn't intended the damage is done) so I'd assume from this point forward any conflicts will be avoided completely, no matter what country or what capabilities the military have.

 

-Is air travel still as safe as we think?

 

Yes. Probably more safe. After getting the aviation bug, I'm going on a tangent about the history. Seems the 777 is a pretty darned safe aircraft compared to older DCs or even the 74s. Disclaimer: I still have a lot to learn, so correct me if I'm wrong.


-Am I having too many late night philosophical moments?

 

Eh...I get them too.

 

Though tonight I'm more occupied about what first tubeliner I want to get. Good grief there is SO MUCH investment in flight simming.

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After the incident where the US Navy shot down the Iran Air A330 (or was it a 340?) a few years ago, there were suggestions that passenger airliners should be kitted out with missile detection and avoidance systems.  I wonder if we will see this again?

 

What I found interesting about that argument at the time was that fighter pilots in extremely agile fighter jets and suitably trained in avoidance techniques found this difficult at the best of times - how was a huge passenger jet full of passengers and pilots who were firstly not trained for this, and secondly flying an aircraft that is not suitable for this sort of flying, going to do this?

 

I was also a little shocked by the fact that airline did not alter it's route to fly further North or South of the conflict area at the time, but hind sight is always 20/20 isn't it?   In fact, I remember saying to family members at the time right after the initial "rumors" were beginning to surface and I heard where the jet went down, that I though that was no coincidence - I suspected military intervention and lo and behold...

 

However, that being said, airline travel is still the safest way to travel.   It reminds me a little of the year 1988 when there were so many losses, airframes and lives, of which one was our national airline's very own Helderberg (ZS-SAS).   There seem to be periods here and there were things just sort seem to happen in clusters, but that does not diminish my trust in air travel.

 

I do however hope that this latest desert crash was the last one for quite some time to come.  

 

Kind regards

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@nathanpinard

 

++1

 

Additionally, CNN did not help the average Joe Public with their way-off beam reportage.

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Air travel is no where as safe as the industry wants the public to believe it is ("fume events" and more).

 

But then again, no transport system is "really" safe.

 

I do think that less flying and more consideration of other means of transport would make sense for a lot of people - especially alternatives for short domestic flights in countries like Germany. (In Germany EVERY domestic flight is "short"! :lol:)

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Right now would be the safest time for air travel because after a series of events the industry becomes extra vigilant.

 

One of my friends today said she was nervous to fly on an upcoming trip and I asked her who she was flying with....she said the Royal New Zealand Air Force 757 and I nearly fell over laughing. Those aircraft are among the safest in the world and yet she is nervous from all the recent Media hype  :rolleyes:

 

I would love the chance to fly on a RNZAF 757

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Ground travel is still more dangerous than air for sure. Accidents kill thousands a year. So usually stupidity or some other issue is what kills people in this case. Or, in some cases overconfidence. Which I'm betting has killed a few single engine pilots.

 

However, airplanes kill people due to mechanical issues mostly (missles aside) . Apply that to your car, and it just stops. (unless it's the brakes or a bad tire pops of course)

 

We don't have drunk pilots (unless you've watched "Flight" lately?) flying airilnes. We have 1000s of people drinking and driving every Friday night.

 

So yeah...air travel is safer.

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After the incident where the US Navy shot down the Iran Air A330

 

It was an A300 and happened 26 years ago.

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Thanks Mike, I saw it on one of the ACI episodes once but cannot recall all the details so clearly :-).

 

regards

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I think you might want to un-friend those who think that 3 plane crashes indicate the end of the world  :lol:

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Royal New Zealand Air Force 757

How did she manage that? VIP entourage? 

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How did she manage that? VIP entourage? 

 

She is in a trade delegation

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Additionally, CNN did not help the average Joe Public with their way-off beam reportage.

 

CNN has many issues that doesn't help with anything in any story lol

 

After the incident where the US Navy shot down the Iran Air A330 (or was it a 340?) a few years ago, there were suggestions that passenger airliners should be kitted out with missile detection and avoidance systems.  I wonder if we will see this again?

 

Well, it is possible...VC25's are the perfect example...take a regular passenger plane, dish up millions of dollars and tada! WIll we see that issue come up? If CNN keeps bragging about possible air strikes towards civil aircraft, one of their "experts" will bring it up.

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Yes. Probably more safe. After getting the aviation bug, I'm going on a tangent about the history. Seems the 777 is a pretty darned safe aircraft compared to older DCs or even the 74s. Disclaimer: I still have a lot to learn, so correct me if I'm wrong.

 

 

About 20 times as safe as a DC-8 and two and a bit times as safe as a 744, according to page 20 of this pdf: http://www.boeing.com/news/techissues/pdf/statsum.pdf. Though it's worth bearing in mind that other things (ATC, training of pilots, crew resource management) have also seen a lot of development between when the DC-8 first flew and when the T7 first flew, so it's not just down to aircraft type. Also these numbers don't include either of the Malaysian crashes.

 

This also has some interesting stats: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr61/nvsr61_06.pdf. 26,000 people died of falls in 2011, 34,677 died in motor vehicle accidents, and 'only' 1,467 in 'Water, air and space, and other  and unspecified transport accidents and their sequelae'

 

The Israeli company Elbit sells a system designed to protect airliners from shoulder launched missiles. I think it's been fitted to El Al planes: https://www.elbitsystems.com/elbitmain/area-in2.asp?parent=399&num=400&num2=400

 

Won't help much against a radar guided missile of course.

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Even though it is unusual for a number of air crashes to occur so close to one another, there is a bit of math underpinning it, randomness (the likes the universe is full of) clusters things together. Remember the old question of why buses always come in threes. Randomness. It's the same principle. People look for, and see patterns where there is only randomness at work.

 

Another thing to bear in mind, academics Wolfgang Gaissmaier and Gerd Gigerenzer, crunched some numbers regarding fatal road accidents in the USA after 9/11. They found that there had been a marked decrease in air miles flown by Americans, something like 12% to 20% fewer passenger air miles travelled, whereas road use increased substantially. By Gassmaier and Gigerenzer's estimate, this extra road use accounted for an additional 1,595 deaths on US roads above what would have been expected statistically. An interesting aspect of their research was the absence of a uniform reduction in air travel across countries hit by terrorist attacks. New York showed a much greater increase in road use, but that is perhaps to be expected, but so also did the US Midwest. In contrast, after the 2004 Madrid train bombing, there was no observable increase in road use and traffic in Spain.

 

Travelling on motorcycle is something like 3000 times more dangerous than traveling by plane. By car, 100 times more dangerous. After airtravel, the safest mode of travel is by train, it's only twice as dangerous as travelling by plane, and if I am not mistaken, the odds of being involved in a fatal air crash is 1 in 3 000 000.

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Yea, in my life, seen 2 motorcycle crashes, and lost my brother in one. Car crashes, Ive seen about 4 my whole life. 

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Not only passengers give airlines the cold shoulder. Aircraft manufacturers do as well. Well they did in the past, not so sure they do now.

If an airline breaks one of their planes, they used to dis own the airline for sometime, and example of that is the Air New Zealand DC10 disaster. ANZ was given the cold shoulder from MDC.  It happened to United as well, but not for very long, as United was a big customer.

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I wanted to add something to this thread. I'm watching something on Netflix now called "Air Disasters". It's a pretty enlightening show that makes you realize all the stuff we see in the VC has a definite purpose, and that airlines didn't always have those. As well as improving baggage policy, crew resource management, and even limiting pilot fear in a disaster.

 

It's one of those discovery like shows with overacted dramatic scenes (but not as bad) and a LOT of information.

 

It covers a number of flights all the way back to the 70s.

 

This show kind of shows the drastic measures taken to find out what happened, and how to prevent future incidents.

 

Also...I didn't know that 747s could carry a 5th engine. Just to carry it. Not use it.

 

I also didn't know they at one point cannibalized parts from wrecks.

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(...), and example of that is the Air New Zealand DC10 disaster. ANZ was given the cold shoulder from MDC.  (...)

 

 

Some shameful cover up on the part of ANZ for their mistakes and policies back in those days, as the aircraft/manufacturer was never to blame.

 

And I'm no Lufthansa/GermanWings/Air Berlin fanboi for sure!   :ph34r:

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Some shameful cover up on the part of ANZ for their mistakes and policies back in those days, as the aircraft/manufacturer was never to blame.

Yes Olli, that is so true, and is still talked about today. Those wounds will linger on for many years yet

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I just watched an episode about the two issues with the cargo door on the DC10. Man...that was horrible on McDonnell Douglas's part.

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A friend of mine has traveled all over the world, in some countries you just don't feel good getting on board of some airlines, safety standards are definitely not equal around the world.  Personally I plan my travels with big names only.  Of course staying clear of war zones that's another story.

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Yes Olli, that is so true, and is still talked about today. Those wounds will linger on for many years yet

 

Read some very informative narration on that crash a long time ago and a N.Z. TV feature from 2012, broadcast in Germany just the other month, was very moving (and disturbing!) as well.

 

(...)

And I'm no Lufthansa/GermanWings/Air Berlin fanboi for sure!   :ph34r:

 

 

Just learned that Lufthansa has picked up flights into Ben Gurion again. German pilots' union ("Pilotenvereinigung Cockpit") is reported to criticize that decision strongly.

 

German article:

http://web.de/magazine/reise/fernweh/19160462-lufthansa-fliegt-mehrtaegiger-pause-tel-aviv.html#.news_spotlight.Lufthansa%20fliegt%20ins%20Krisengebiet.689.632

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