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TexasGary

Aircraft of the year with a different Slant ?

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Guest Peter Sidoli

We all know the Avsim awards and what Avsim determined as "best" in each category.I am interested in what people regard as the best from a slightly different angle.I am not really talking about which has the most complex systems modelled to extreme accuracy although it maybe one of those for you.What I am interested in is which aircraft makes you feel you are really there.Immersion! how well does the aircraft fit? How well are you immersed in the whole experience so that you are drawn into your computer screen and become part of that aircraft and the FS world.This can be how the VC or 2D panel presents. The views from that panel? how much of a periferal view you get so that you can see around as well as dead ahead from your seated position.How easy is it to operate the systems and autopilot without loosing your forward and outside view.I always thought the sign of a good aircraft was one which you could handfly a departure cruise and instrument approach to a landing to IFR tolerances while being able to operate the aircraft systems without bringing up a faceful of popups which blocked your vision ahead.It is strange that we buy loads of addon aircraft and probably end up going back to the same few time after time.We purchase aircraft X with high expectations only to be dissapointed because that aircraft doesnt have the X factor.We are dissapointed because aircraft X advertises its huge level of detail only to find that its impossible to operate.What aircraft makes you really feel you are there? What is your aircraft of the year?Peter

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Well, for me, it is Project Tupolev's freeware Tu-154b2 and Level-D's payware 767-300.David Maltby's and Rick Piper's aircraft come in at a close second.

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You know, I don't know if it came out this year, but that PC-12 over at flight one really gets me in the game.It just feels smooth. Everything is clear on the panel, it is tame and seems to correspond nicely to the expected performance figures at the Pilatus site.

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Interesting topic, Peter! Without much thinking, the BAC 1-11 by David Maltby comes to my mind. I usually don't fly in VC all that much, but the One-Eleven is an exception. I fly it exclusively from the VC and use the mouse to turn and zoom around the pit. I usually set up my own views in VC (Active Camera) which are set up so that I can clearly see the part of the cockpit in question, but not here. David has managed to set up different views in the VC from the Captain's point of view and for some reason I love them. I can access everything I need. No popups, no new views necessary. Incredible! Then there's the deafening sound of the engines which also adds to the immersion factor. I have the volume way up when flying the BAC and talk in my "flying room" is usually impossible when I'm taking off and climbing. :)It is an immensely gratifying feeling when I manage to, let's say, follow a STAR manually in bad weather conditions all the way to the treshold and finish a flight with a good landing. More or less, hehe. I have most of the latest and greatest payware add-on aircraft, but I keep coming back to the One-Eleven. It has that something which makes me feel like I'm really there. One very memorable moment came when I was landing at EDDF (Aerosoft) in the One-Eleven for the first time. I was coming in to 25L in bad weather with lots of crosswind and turbulence. I was totally focused on the instruments, getting ready to land when I caught a glimpse of the highway below me, choked with moving traffic! Magic, pure magic! :) A close second must be RFP B742 which I also fly a lot. Then things get complicated so I'll just mention a few AC that I also love to fly: MAAM DC-3, Milton's Twin Beech, LDS B767, Dreamfleet B727 and PMDG B747 in no particular order. Regards,Jure

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Guest bobsk8

Makes you feel like really being there:Level D 767Carenado C -182G

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Guest Peter Sidoli

JureYou have hit on the very point Im aiming at with the David Maltby One-Eleven :-)That and the AeroWorx KingAir B200 are extremely immersive and two I use a lot.Peter

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Very interesting topic.For me it is the 763 by Level-D. It goes back to the original 767 PIC. That was an amazing aircraft that I flew all over the virtual FS2000 sky. It amazes me how far the sim has come in since then and the 767 has advanced the same. I love that aircraft.

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GA: DreamFleet A36Tube: DreamFleet 727Military Transport: CS C-130WW2 fighter: Realair SpitOne aircraft that I've been using a lot is the old Lago/Cloud9 MB339. One you can just strap on and fly. It takes you where you wanna go, and aerobatics is fun with it :).The last two days I have only been flying the new MB339 from Cloud9, and I love it!Yesterday I placed the tower view by the runway and watched a replay of my own display flight at 1:0 zoom, and for the first time in fs I got the right sense of speed when that PAN came low over the runway with the green smoke :-jumpy.Interresting thread!Eagle

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Guest allcott

Real Air SpitDF A36 BonanzaEaglesoft Cirrus SR20/22and still, after all this timeAerosoft Diamond DA-20 KatanaImmersiveness doesn't necessarily mean system complexity, although it can of course! Allcott

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I'm partial to plexiglass canopy cockpits. The view is better, thanks to the lack of large corner posts, and they're a perfect match for the "wider view" peripheral vision offered by VC's. I give immersion factor number one to the RealAir Marchetti SF260, thanks to it's excellent flight dynamics, excellent VC cockpit for added peripheral vision, and the fluid animation of it's instrumentation, as well as good looking and crisp instrument backlighting for night flights. With this airplane, I use the hand-held GPS "window" and on board two axis auto-pilot for longer cross-country's.As for most interesting flight dynamics and making you feel like you're really there, in a single engine aircraft, I'll go with the RealAir Spitfire. It's the one I always enjoy making landings with. Takes some precison control to avoid the rewarding non-bounce! And the views over the wing for base to final are excellent, as well as subtle airframe/eye movement.L.Adamson

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After getting TrackIR4 a few months ago it has really changed the way I use the sim. It has converted the VC from a novelty to a real learning tool. My faves for immersion are DF's Bonanza and Baron, the Baron getting the higher marks just cause I like twins better, Aerosoft Katana and F1 Skyhawk (both have beautiful VC's) for trainers, Eaglesoft's Cirrus 20/22 are highly immersive and I also just love getting into their Citation II although I did mod the panel quite a bit. As of late F1's PC12 has been getting the most airtime (once again a very well done VC).Peter, if you haven't tried the TrackIR4 I have put it on my "Must Have" list for simming along with yoke and rudder pedals. It will really get you immersed into the experience. My biggest criticism simming is when you have to do something in the sim that you wouldn't in a real aircraft, like pushing numbers to talk to ATC (use VoxATC), or using a hat switch or mouse to look around (use TrackIR).

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I'll add my vote for the BAC 1-11 from David. It's just one of those designs which just feel comfortable. Whether in the 2D cockpit or in the VC, it feels like your there. No confusion as to what you need to do, or where to go to do it.Only one other plane does that as well. That's the Aeroworx Beech King Air. The atmosphere in the cockpit is is right on. How do I know? I have had the opportunity to fly in one a few times. I do not get disoriented while looking around in the cockpit, everything is where it should be.Nothing else, that I can think of at the moment comes close. If I think of any I'll be back.[hr color=#000000][table border=0" width="98%" id="table1" height="4" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="2][td width=500]Jason CYOO - Formerly MYNN[br /]General Aviation Fan[br][/b]P4 3.2Ghz, 1GB Ram, FX5900 128MB, XP SP2.[br /][br /]

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Guest Peter Sidoli

>Immersiveness doesn't necessarily mean system complexity, although it can of course!

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HelloI agree the F1 PC-12 is very well designed and is becoming my favorite payware aircraft.The freeware TBM-700 is also very good.

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If you make me pick just one Peter it would probably have to be the F1 PC12. I just wish more of the systems were modeled, then it really could be used to prep a pilot for Simcom's course. I almost chose the ROTW Socata TBM700 for FlyII since that is still a highly accurate simulation.

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Guest Adverse Yawn

The Flying Club Seneca, simply because as well as being fucntionally a pretty good representation of the real thing, it just feels right. I'm also pretty partial to the ERJ 145 too. Sounds and framerate consistency go a long way to upping the immersion factor.

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Hi Zane,I definitely agree with you regarding the Track IR4. I just received mine and now that I pretty much have it 'tuned' to my satisfaction, I love using the VC.One thing that annoys me in the VC, is the 'tinting' of the windows. Which singles or twins, are you aware of, that do not darken the windows?Now I find myself looking for the 'perfect' VC, with large, smooth readable gauges. Any suggestions?Thanks a lot,Howard

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I've just built a new system, new video card and much uprated processor/memory/motherboard. For the first time ever AFAIK, I am able to be in the VC and pan, etc., look at outsie scenery and get 29 fps (which I'm locked at in FS9), and now have real smooth graphics. And I can tell you that if you ever get to a point where your brain doesn't have to connect the jerky dots, it's really awesome. Simming has taken on a whole new level of immersion for me.That said- and I'm still in the process of re-installing and trying all these add-ons- I would say the LDS B763. There something really three-dimensional about that VC, at least as I 'see" it. Bruce.Edit: On this same subject Peter- and given your flight experience in a range of aircraft- I recall a comment you made regarding the PMDG B744 flight model, and how it best (at that time) resembled some smaller high performance aircraft that you have actually flown (in manual flight). Is that comment still valid? I think that most of us are talking in terms of 'immersion", but comparison to feel of the real thing is a whole different measurement which few of us a qualified to make, and may have a totally different result. Bruce (good thread).

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Guest dpc

Great Topic!1. BAC 1-11 for freeware2. DF GAs - A36 and Barron3. DF 7274. Realair SF2605. Aeroworx B2006. and probably my favorite for that feel thing you talk about is the Carenda C206 Stationair. (awaiting the amphib!!!)All are chosen for VC use because I use TrackIR, which in my opinion, is the ultimate addition for the feel that you speak of.Dave

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Guest Rockcliffe

Excellent question.I used to say the DF Archer, partly because it was the sort of plane that I could imagine myself one day owning (in my dreams!)My vote now is for the Carenado 182RG. Stunning VC, great sounds and so lifelike I can almost smell the fumes.BlairCYOW

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Guest Peter Sidoli

>Edit: On this same subject Peter- and given your flight experience in a range of aircraft- I recall a comment you made regarding the PMDG B744 flight model, and how it best (at that time) resembled some smaller high performance aircraft that you have actually flown (in manual flight). Is that comment still valid? I think that most of us are talking in terms of 'immersion", but comparison to feel of the real thing is a whole different measurement which few of us a qualified to make, and may have a totally different result. Bruce (good thread).

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>If you make me pick just one Peter it would probably have to>be the F1 PC12. I just wish more of the systems were modeled,>then it really could be used to prep a pilot for Simcom's>course. Not for $27.00 I won't be.I think you guys are getting a little too spoiled... :7 Simcom courses are what? a couple of grand and you want us to create something equivlant for $27.00 bucks?Zane, Zane, Zane... What am I gonna do with you? :-lol Best,Jim

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>>Not for $27.00 I won't be.>>>Zane, Zane, Zane... What am I gonna do with you? :-lol >>Best,>JimHow about making a Pro version of the PC-12 and charging another C-note for it? ;) I know I'd buy it, I'll even offer to help.

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