Some clarification of the "level of difficulty" for the aircraft I'm looking for...

I'm thinking of something where I have a chance of memorizing some of the standard procedures rather than having to consult the manual every time. I don't need the Ctrl-E option, but I also don't want to spend more time on the ground than I do in the air trying to turn the damn thing on! 🙂

That's pretty vague, but hopefully it helps a bit.

Alistair

Well am sure the iFly has the same option but in the PMDG you can have it ready to taxi as your default state, so all you have to do is program your FMC.

5 mins and your taxing. 

Edited August 3, 20187 yr by Nyxx

Hello all,

I am another very, very happy owner/operator of the iFly 737. Further, I am an aged owner of a slightly feeble mind but I  really had few difficuties learning the procedures involved with this aircraft.  I have to admit my method was to actually write down an abreviated version of the manual and follow that each and every time until I got it down pat.  This method does not teach you the "why" you are doing the the things involved in all aspects of operation but, over a relatively short period of time you learn them in a "parrot" fashion. The aircraft is also wonderful to hand fly which I find a handy bonus.

The main thing that I found confusing was the fact, that after I actually learnt the procedures etc for flying this aircraft following the iFly manual, I started watching youtubers doing "cold and dark starts" etc and I could not really follow what they were doing precisely because they did NOT follow the iFly manual procedures. Now I fully realize that all airlines have their own code of practices, procedures and policies, but some of these youtubers were just jumping all over the place, and some  actually admitted that they were learners (to a point) as well .The point I am making here is that this just adds to the confusion, and depending on your level of committment to this (and other aircraft too, of course) and I would advocate that you pick one method of learning until you are thoroughly familiar with what you are doing. I know it would be great to also understand the "why" of what you are doing during each and every part of the procedures, but in my view, that is not the" be all and end all" of flight simming. 

As previously stated, iFly is a great starting point and I found that repetition was the key for me and a fairly short process. There is also a huge amount of repaints available on the Flight1 site.

Good luck with your choice.

Regards

Tony

7 hours ago, djbully said:

I don't have these ones, but apparently they are supposed to be decent. I don't know if anyone else who has used it can comment? 

 

http://www.flight1.com/products.asp?search=true&txtsearch=ifly744

http://www.flight1.com/products.asp?product=ifly737

I'm still trying to decide myself whether to get PMDG or this ones! 

 

No both iFly products have just as much system depth as PMDG aircraft. Just less bells and whistles.

For some reason PMDG are sticking with their nav coding. I am not sure about the PMDG 747 but all the other PMDG tubeliners cannot fly an RNAV RNP approach properly because they do not have an RF (radius to fix) leg type coding. This is a common place approach (and departure) these days.  The iFly737 flies them well.
Both products are very good but on balance I prefer the iFly mainly because there are 9 variants, it flies well, Better performance on my PC and flight 1 is still supporting and upgrading it.
A very good tutorial as well to get you going.

However you wont be disappointed with either choice.

 

I’m actually curious, and sorry if this is slightly hijacking the original topic. However, with mention of iFly I was wondering if anybody knows what’s up with a cargo version of the iFly 747? I’d be interested in buying it, but would only do so if there was a cargo version of it. It appears the PMDG is the more popular of the bunch but it is very expensive...

which, mind you, is something else to consider. I do own only the PMDG 737 and the 600/700 extension and love it - fly it very often. But, it cost me over 100$ which is a lot of money. The iFly is definitely cheaper!

10 minutes ago, Benjamin J said:

I’m actually curious, and sorry if this is slightly hijacking the original topic. However, with mention of iFly I was wondering if anybody knows what’s up with a cargo version of the iFly 747? I’d be interested in buying it, but would only do so if there was a cargo version of it. It appears the PMDG is the more popular of the bunch but it is very expensive...

which, mind you, is something else to consider. I do own only the PMDG 737 and the 600/700 extension and love it - fly it very often. But, it cost me over 100$ which is a lot of money. The iFly is definitely cheaper!

The iFly 747-400F will not happen.  As I understand it a commerical entity has been paying for further development of the 737 and all the manpower is into that. Eventually the 747-8 will be released.

9 hours ago, Nyxx said:

I think it was Pete aka frugal that came up with “ study level”

Absolutely not.  This term was bandied around in the 90s when Jane's simulations were prevalent.

20 hours ago, GHarrall said:

First off the 'study level' thing really gets on my nerves to be quite honest. Whoever came up with that phrase should be taken out back and dealt with......:))

If it has to be a Boeing......

QW 787?

TfDi 717?

Ifly737?

To be honest I don't have any of them so I can't comment on performance. QW used to be focused on 'normal procedures' ops so I don't know how they are on the new QW787. I heard its a big step up product wise for them.

 

 

 

 

Why does the mention of study level gets on your nerves? To me, it just means that some of us like to experience in some detail what the consequences are of manipulating a FMC and all the onboard systems. That is what simulating can be about. How would you describe Pmdg, Flslabs, leonardo maddog, Majestic dash8 en others? Highly detailed? that's ok with me. 

The poster is looking for an aircraft with no so many system details. What is so ennerving about that? To each its own.

Best regards,

Jos

Been flying the PMDG 737 for years, with no issues at all, on a i5 3.2 Ghz CPU. To me it is still the gold standard of Boeing sim aircraft, and my cost per flight has to be  infinitesimal. You can make it as easy to fly as you want, or fly it like the real thing. Add in FS 2 Crew, some of the NGX  immersion add ons  and you step it up another few notches. The Q400 and NGX are all that I fly now, and I have hangars full of aircraft that I don't even touch anymore. 

10 hours ago, Benjamin J said:

I’m actually curious, and sorry if this is slightly hijacking the original topic. However, with mention of iFly I was wondering if anybody knows what’s up with a cargo version of the iFly 747? I’d be interested in buying it, but would only do so if there was a cargo version of it. It appears the PMDG is the more popular of the bunch but it is very expensive...

which, mind you, is something else to consider. I do own only the PMDG 737 and the 600/700 extension and love it - fly it very often. But, it cost me over 100$ which is a lot of money. The iFly is definitely cheaper!

A question for you then. Take the cost of the iFly, and how much more to get the PMDG. Now take the difference and guess how many flights you would fly the PMDG in a couple of years, and what would be the cost difference per flight between the two? To me the fractions of a penny difference to get the better aircraft, is a no brainer. 

1 hour ago, beep747 said:

Why does the mention of study level gets on your nerves? To me, it just means that some of us like to experience in some detail what the consequences are of manipulating a FMC and all the onboard systems. That is what simulating can be about. How would you describe Pmdg, Flslabs, leonardo maddog, Majestic dash8 en others? Highly detailed? that's ok with me. 

The poster is looking for an aircraft with no so many system details. What is so ennerving about that? To each its own.

Best regards,

Jos

Reading comprehension not your strong point I take it?

if you read what I said, nowhere did I criticize the op for wanting a lighter systems aircraft. 

 

 

Edited August 4, 20187 yr by GHarrall

No, reading comprehension isn't my strongest point. You are right. 😊 The Op used the term study level and that is what made you so nervous. 

Best regards,

Jos

I said the term “study level” gets on my nerves, not makes me “nervous”. As in it’s an annoying way of putting any work down that doesn’t meet certain standards, 

you said, and I quote:

“The poster is looking for an aircraft with no so many system details. What is so ennerving about that? To each its own.“

What the poster said regarding wanting a light aircraft did not make me “nervous” at all. 

Im going to end this conversation as you clearly don’t follow your own statements very well. 

 

19 hours ago, Alistair Logie said:

Some clarification of the "level of difficulty" for the aircraft I'm looking for...

I'm thinking of something where I have a chance of memorizing some of the standard procedures rather than having to consult the manual every time. I don't need the Ctrl-E option, but I also don't want to spend more time on the ground than I do in the air trying to turn the damn thing on! 🙂

That's pretty vague, but hopefully it helps a bit.

Alistair

Prior to me purchasing the PMDG NGX, I almost exclusively flew the QW757. I relied on the default ATC for directions and I created my flightplans with the default planner. The QW757 had the option of having the default GPS fly the aircraft - just like the default FSX 737. I had purchased complex aircraft in the past and I never ended up using them. I didn't have the time or patience to learn them. I flew different aircraft all the time, so I would have to relearn them. I had periods where I would spend more time tweaking or not have time to sim at all. Someone then bought me a large Amazon gift certificate (not the Simmarket one I asked for), and I discovered that the NGX and the 777 boxed versions were available on Amazon. Since it was a gift, I'd figured I would give the NGX a try. 

I had to rethink things a little bit. Default ATC had to go and there was no way I was going to enter flight plans line by line. I needed a new ATC program and flightplanner - ProATCx took care of both.

When I got it installed, I flew a couple of the tutorials to get the lay of the land and the order of things. After a short period of time, I was able to get the NGX pushed back, with engines running from cold and dark in just a few minutes (~5). I can't comment about the IFly version, but the PMDG NGX is really fantastic. I wish I'd bought it much earlier. I probably don't use 1/2 the features, but it doesn't matter. PMDG simplified certain things (weight and balance, for example), making the aircraft a joy to fly. I haven't touched the manual in years - just needed it for a few days to get myself situated.

I had the 777 for FSX, but I didn't rebuy it for P3Dv4. I don't do a lot long haul to justify the cost. I did buy the QW787. I like it, but the systems simplification isn't as elegant as the NGX. Weight and balance seems complicated and a few other things seem like a chore. Still, with the 777 or the 787, once you get the 737 down, you can usually get the other Boeings going without too much confusion.

So, in short, if you have a little time to run a couple tutorials and the desire to get a flightplanner that exports directly to PMDG products, you would probably be better of just getting the PMDG NGX. After the initial learning curve, you won't have to touch the manual. This is what people told me for years on these forums, but I resisted. I was wrong. I should have just listened from the beginning.

Edited August 4, 20187 yr by duckbilled