I'm done; and I'm out!

[188AHC 2,138]

You know it's real interesting to read this topic. 

We as Moderators make every attempt to keep topics civil. However, regardless of what we do somone gets there butt in spasm if we remove offending posts, warn members that act up, lock topics that are out of control, voice our opinion on a topic, and a whole truckload of other reasons. But we keep showing up to try to keep this the best Flightsim site on the web. 

Do we get aggravated? Sure we do but we are dedicated to helping our members and act as bouncers when needed. 

I suggest you use the ignore function and if a member is really offensive and we don't catch it promptly, report the post. 

If you need a break, take one but don't cash in your chips and give up. 

 

[sightseer 895]

well, in my opinion, neither @anden145 nor @Alan_A  should go anywhere but I certainly understand the need to take a break.

If anyone is bothered by things getting political or name calling, maybe they should open their eyes a bit more.

AVsim rules should apply to everyone equally and not just some members.

[mwilk 1,106]

7 hours ago, MarkW said:

Avsim has an ignore feature?  Been here 20 years and had no idea.

Oh yeah. I've used it on more than one occasion. Some people are going to have the same tone to their posts no matter what.

[busdriver 258]

Sad that something that is essentially a game, can cause such vitriol and rancor. Many of the folks who cause most of the problems are wanna-be's who either lack the skill, determination or desire to actually fly a real airplane. Their anger toward that lack of skill, determination and desire cause them to lash out at the developers, the forum members, and anyone else they see fit.

It's sad really... Flying is such a beautiful thing, and even a sim running on a PC can bring a smile to ones face. Yet so many feel the need to trample on that very thing.....

My airline gave me a VLOA, yet I am making the most of that - flying PPE to smaller airports, and trying to make the most of a difficult time. The world is a mess at the moment, especially here in the United States. The anger toward say PMDG, Lockheed, ORBX, etc is really petty. In 30 years, no one will care which sim platform you owned, or PC hardware you had. Arguing over this is senseless, and such a waste of time. Enjoy the hobby, enjoy your life. Take a walk, play with your children. Stop arguing over make believe airplanes, scenery and clouds on a computer, there is so much more to life than what is essentially a game. 

 

 

Edited May 30, 2020 by busdriver

[overspeed3 410]

Yes, a lot nit-picking has gone on over the last year or there about in this Forum.  And it ramped up  even more so after the very first announcements of the MSFS 2020 project.  Further bickering ensued after we got glimpses of a new flight sim promised land.  You could almost see the concern in the eyes of other non-MSFS users now caught-up in a quandary.  

But where did many of those here learn that type of vitriol, and the lack of civil discourse:  Yes, I too believe it's the fault of the worldwide social media culture to some extent...       

 

 

Edited May 30, 2020 by overspeed3

[HiFlyer 9,359]

Before one virtuously accuses others of being political, perhaps it would be instructive to keep in mind exactly who are those who had to be repeatedly admonished not to go there.......

Edited May 30, 2020 by HiFlyer

[Wobbie 938]

Busdriver's comments are so true. I really enjoy it here at Avsim. Sometimes (mostly actually) I just cannot help myself when I see stupidity has been posted. My fingers get itchy to reply, & those guys leave the door wide open. I really cannot take those know it all's seriously, especially those that hold pity parties due to lack of invitations. 

The moderators need medals! Anyhow, for sanity, I normally move to other forums, that seem to be a lot more mature regarding comments & respect.

Thanks for all the entertainment here.  

[JNS 106]

5 hours ago, busdriver said:

Sad that something that is essentially a game, can cause such vitriol and rancor.

 

 

Oh, no!  Now you've done it....you used the word "game".   Just kidding.  LOL

[anden145 2,285]

Thank you SO much, for all your supportive words and encouragement. Thank you for your kindness and thank you - just thank you!

I guess we all have our pet-peeves. Mine can (probably) be summized down to: 
1. People or users, who state their own personal opinion as fact.
2. Users who simply cannot undertand or comprehend, that other users have different opinions or view of the world. 

I understand your words about, that "That how the forums are!" and "That just how social media works" etc... But to be completely honest, I simply don't think it's alright, to contantly have a feeling of being condescended whenever you post something or expresses an opinion. I absolutely agree, that there should be room for everybody - with all sorts of diverse opinions... But the demeanor and attitude in here (which, quite frankly, sometimes borders on lynch-attitude) just doesn't leave room for that feeling - on the contrary actually. Of course, things will get different, when difference of opinion meet, but that doesn't mean, or excuse, the basic principles of debate and conversation, should be thrown out the door? Com'on - it's really not that hard, to say politely: "I don't think so... because...". There nothing wrong with active politely and civil towards each other. And there's nothing wrong with supporting your reply, with some kind of reason why you disagree (or agree, for that matter); instead of just shouting/ranting "NO. YOU'RE WRONG!"... I don't mind the debate - but I do mind to argue. 

@mp15
I don't want to discuss it! (As I already said in the original thread). The recent episode with the two users (I won't name them) was the famous straw, that broke the camels back! The line of questioning and the way of discussion was borderline childish, if you ask me. It was constantly just a rejection of one's viewpoint, in favor of their own - without any factural evidence - simply just "NO! You're wrong! I'm right!". 
I really don't need to hear all the reasons YOU think, that I'm wrong. I have already heard them - and I still don't think, they apply to this specific topic. In either case, I digress. I'm simply - well to put it a little strongly - fed up with the attitude, which are being used. 
I know, that one should never 'threat' with leaving - one should always 'threat' to stay... but, for me personally, it has come to a point, where it's simply not worth it anymore. The clientel has changed - and the manners, behavior and respect towards one another has gone. Sadly. When you constantly are feeling, that you're annoying someone, rather than contributing and driving the debate - then you come to wonder, whether or not it's really worth continuing... 

I'm sorry to all - but this is a long time coming.

@Alan_A
Thank you, for your words. I can understand, that you're of the same impression that I am - roughly... See you on the other side.

@DaveCT2003
Thanks for the longer post and - of course, thanks a lot for the talks we've had in the past. You (or the people, you mention in your post) is in no way the source of this! There's a lot of extremely friendly and helpful people in here - but there's also some 'bad apples'... but alas - it's the few, who ruin it for the many.

 

Thanks again - and for the supportive comments. 
I'll continue to monitor this topic and reply, if there's anything I think/need to reply to...

Again - thank you.

 

P.s - my avatar, is a Porg from Star Wars. 🙂

[Farlis 2,287]

16 hours ago, MarkW said:

Avsim has an ignore feature?  Been here 20 years and had no idea.

It is not as encompassing as one might wish. If one quotes one of the users you have on the list, you will still see that quote.

1 hour ago, anden145 said:

P.s - my avatar, is a Porg from Star Wars

So many people not recognizing it really shows what the average age of the flightsim community.

Then again it is a creature from the Disney Star Wars. For all I care they don't exist. 😛

Edited May 30, 2020 by Farlis

[jon b 2,047]

I’ve always found this to be a most reasonable and interesting place to hang out.

As a “real world” professional pilot, and I have to say I’m not a fan of that term “real world” on these forums as I think it’s a little condescending and implies everyone else is pretend or something  , but I suppose we do need something to differentiate the two worlds. But anyway as a professional pilot , and even one who I suppose now is at a stage of life and career that I can claim to be quite senior in that function there’s no way I’d ever go near the professional pilots rumour network. If you really want to see an arrogant bunch of A-holes that’s the place to go!

And here my personal opinion differs slightly from that of my “real world” colleague Busdriver. (Though please note this is not a reply to or criticism of his post) I think piloting is piloting wether you do that on a multi million dollar heavy jet as I do (or did) during my working week  , or if you’re flying a military jet low level down a Scottish valley at 420kts in VR while sat at your sim , as I do on my days off.

People here, simmers ,have a deep passion and craving for flying and aviation, there’s no physical rewards for simulation other than satisfying that inner craving to fly. They’re not in it for the (supposedly ) big salary, to get drunk and chase cabin crew in exotic overnight locations, to buy a big watch and brag to people down the pub or anyone else who will listen that they’re the best of the best. These seem to be common motivations now amongst a new wave of people joining the profession who my mate in training describes as “can’t fly but can quote a manual and type 80 words a minute”. No one seems to have any humility anymore.

No, the pilots on these forums are here because of their love of aviation and piloting that’s it. And so I find simulation a much more pure and unpolluted form of aviation than its “ real world” counterpart. And likewise these forums.

For many who have this deep craving to fly and through no fault of their own are unable to do so, simulation is the only , and yet very satisfying outlet for their passion.

Having been born with this unexplained craving to fly and passion for all things flying myself, I remember as a teenager  from an ordinary background with no conceivable way of ever getting near a real aircraft the outlet my Commodore 64 and Amiga used to provide ,flying over the magical worlds of Chicago and San Francisco , no this was so much more than just a “game”

Those of us lucky enough to also to fly the real aircraft should always remember we are only ever a tiny errant blip on an ECG away from having it all taken away from us , and then for us too ,once again, simulation will become our aviation reality.

Edited May 30, 2020 by jon b

[scianoir 610]

19 hours ago, anden145 said:

lately... well - I think, that 'rules of engagement' with each other, has become more direct - and more hostile. It saddens me, to be honest. Where did the decency go? It feels like it's just more of the same rant, shouting of how bad/terrible/wrong something looks in some preview. Or some poor developer who has or hasn't released an update. Bereting other users, for having an opinion, which differs from the 'mainstream'. 😞

I must agree with Anders and, although most people on here are decent, friendly, pleasant and behave in a polite and considerate way, there are a very small minority who are not. Constructive criticism and discussion is fine and can be very helpful but I get particularly disgusted for example when I see someone harshly berating some freeware addon which someone has taken the trouble to develop and share with the community.

I can remember many years ago in the early FS9 days, when I had relatively limited flightsim experience and knowledge, I innocently and with the best of intentions gave some incorrect advice to someone who had posted about an issue. What followed was a very abusive post from another member criticising the advice I had given and criticising me in a very personal way. The wording of the post was such that even the member who had originally posted about the problem felt he ought to comment on the post from the third party. That event soured me towards participating in forums for a long time.

But, as been alluded to in other posts on this thread, this just reflects the spread of personality types across the population as a whole and you will always 'get a few bad eggs'! In the days before the internet these bad eggs would only affect you if you came directly into contact with them, but in this computerised social media age they have many new outlets for their venom, spite and vindictiveness. Indeed the presence of a handful of such people amongst my so-called 'friends' on Facebook (and the general propaganda that was increasingly being posted on there) led me to decide to try a month without going on Facebook about a year ago. I have never returned to Facebook - one of my best decisions of recent years!

Bill

[Chock 17,769]

2 minutes ago, scianoir said:

Indeed the presence of a handful of such people amongst my so-called 'friends' on Facebook (and the general propaganda that was increasingly being posted on there) led me to decide to try a month without going on Facebook about a year ago. I have never returned to Facebook - one of my best decisions of recent years!

Bill

Yup. That's a realm which will suck you into a world of tedium. My Facebook status is: 'I'm not interested in what you've just had for lunch, and no, your baby is not cute, it looks exactly like every other baby'. 🤣

[Mikenor 13]

14 hours ago, DaveCT2003 said:

If you will join the work force someday, are already in the work place and might apply for a promotion, change departments, fields or employers someday, then you need to be aware that the company or government you will one day apply to is going to pay about $25 to $150 dollars to have one of now many companies screen you online and through AI and many other tools they will find and read most of your posts. This is already saving companies a lot of money and some pretty big headaches.  Moreover, it doesn't matter if someone gets concerned about what they've posted and asks for their account to be removed because of a little thing called Data Centers which constantly index and save all social media posts around the world. Guess where the companies who profile you pull their data?  Yep, you guessed it. Not only existing social media sites, but data centers.  Starting to get the picture? Hey, do NOT shoot the messenger, and argue this all you want as it will fall on deaf ears.  It make take a few years, and the person may never know why they didn't get a job or promotion, but there you are.  Someone can argue, kick, scream and throw a fit, but it won't change this.  Oh, and I LOVE the "my country has laws to prevent this".  Well..... do those laws apply to where every data center in the world is located?  Of course not.

Dave, thanks for posting - I’ve forwarded it to my 2 sons. Good thing to know.

Edited May 30, 2020 by Mikenor

[threexgreen 3,139]

11 hours ago, anden145 said:

There's a lot of extremely friendly and helpful people in here - but there's also some 'bad apples'... but alas - it's the few, who ruin it for the many.

If I were your mom I would raise my index finger and tell you to stay right here. Seriously though, if you went there would be one sane person less in here and that can't be a good thing. Those few can only ruin it if the others let it happen. So stay and help keep the sanity in here.

But if you want to take a break or go, fair enough. Just know that a piece of quality will be lost in this forum (hopefully that last bit wasn't too much cringe 😉).

Edited May 30, 2020 by threegreen