2 minutes ago, fogboundturtle said:

if you are frying your GPU, it's all on you. Again. This is hardware physical issue. He said he has been mining with his card when he is not flying. Maybe he forgot to stop his mining while flying. Mining 24/7 on a GPU will take a told on a card. it will also build heat in a PC case.

Oh he was mining on this card ? Yeah. Sounds to me like the cards performance is possibly slightly degraded and when the sim is pushing for that 100% utilization its unable to deliver at the rated boost clocks. Or the card is fine and some aspect of the cooling is not.

15 minutes ago, fogboundturtle said:

if you are frying your GPU, it's all on you. Again. This is hardware physical issue. He said he has been mining with his card when he is not flying. Maybe he forgot to stop his mining while flying. Mining 24/7 on a GPU will take a told on a card. it will also build heat in a PC case.

Max card temp is set to 61 degrees for mining using afterburner, though I cant monitor the video memory tenp on a 3070.  I always stop mining before using MSFS and set the default profile at 100% power and 86 degrees max temp.

It may be a heat buildup from mining or the fan curve.  I can test this later with a shutdown which will allow things to cool down and reset the fan curve.

The fact that there srem to be quite a few others having temp problems since SU3 should not be ignored.  I had no issues until then.

Just now, cianpars said:

Max card temp is set to 61 degrees for mining using afterburner, though I cant monitor the video memory tenp on a 3070.  I always stop mining before using MSFS and set the default profile at 100% power and 86 degrees max temp.

It may be a heat buildup from mining or the fan curve.  I can test this later with a shutdown which will allow things to cool down and reset the fan curve.

The fact that there srem to be quite a few others having temp problems since SU3 should not be ignored.  I had no issues until then.

Correlation doesn't always mean causation. Mining on a card for extended period of time could have negative effects on a GPU and a PC case thermal.  

Mining 24/7 could affect the thermal pads on the long term. 

However the whole story is strange because the performance issues of sim update 3 are due to main thread choking and low GPU utilization virtually everywhere.

This is getting out of hand...

If a system isnt able to handle the load put on it and restarts/overheats as a result, the underlying cause is with the physical hardware, not with the software.

I had overheating problems some time ago (before last update) because of a malware program running.

You would think that malware would be inactive while running programs an use the idle time, that was not the case with me.

 

 

I guess I'm having trouble understanding the people who keep suspecting hardware.  Do they really believe that software cannot cause a CPU or GPU to overheat?  What about the very programs they are suggesting to test the temperatures.  That's what they do.

Once again for those whose minds are still  open:   These temps only occur when running the latest update of MSFS. ---Nothing else--- No other sims or other applications even come close, (at least in my case)

There are some correlations that strongly suggest causation.  It's clinging to an original hypothesis despite the evidence tending to show the answer lies in a different direction that causes the endless looping that we are seeing in this and all the other threads about the heat issue in this latest update.

 

 

Edited March 25, 20215 yr by TASCHMANN

I've had 2 kinds of overheating problems. Hardware (case fans not running) and software (malware)

The first thing you have to do (in my opinion) is monitor the temps and fans (GPU and CPU) in combination with software running

  GPU-Z is an easy to use tool for that.

7 minutes ago, TASCHMANN said:

I guess I'm having trouble understanding the people who keep suspecting hardware.  Do they really believe that software cannot cause a CPU or GPU to overheat?  What about the very programs they are suggesting to test the temperatures.  That's what they do.

Once again for those whose minds are still  open:   These temps only occur when running the latest update of MSFS. ---Nothing else--- No other sims or other applications even come close, (at least in my case)

There are some correlations that strongly suggest causation.  It's clinging to an original hypothesis despite the evidence tending to show the answer lies in a different direction that causes the endless looping that we are seeing in this and all the other threads about the heat issue in this latest update.

 

 

If this was the case, everyone will have this issue. in any cases, it's still a hardware issue. Yes software can create load like Burn-in test that are specifically design to heat up a CPU under heavy load using AVX instruction. Even when running into such a scenario, your system should be able to handle this without reaching TJ max. I monitor my PC when the FPS bug occurs. My temp never rose up because the CPU and GPU usage is way way down. It would have to be the exact opposite to create the situation describe by the op. 

13 minutes ago, TASCHMANN said:

I guess I'm having trouble understanding the people who keep suspecting hardware.  Do they really believe that software cannot cause a CPU or GPU to overheat?  What about the very programs they are suggesting to test the temperatures.  That's what they do.

Once again for those whose minds are still  open:   These temps only occur when running the latest update of MSFS. ---Nothing else--- No other sims or other applications even come close, (at least in my case)

There are some correlations that strongly suggest causation.  It's clinging to an original hypothesis despite the evidence tending to show the answer lies in a different direction that causes the endless looping that we are seeing here.

 

 

Afterburner is a utility designed to manipulate your gpu. Msfs is designed to render frames.

And if a benchmarking program is asking your piece of hardware to perform at its maximum rated specs and it's unable to do so because of some limitation on your hardware then the problem is the hardware.

Sure badly coded software can crash your system (memory leak) but gpu overheat. Won't say it's impossible but it's highly unlikely. 

You have two IT based professionals responding in the thread and it seems like yall don't want to hear it. Ok no prob. I'll leave you all be and just observe.

Mind you I run my pc heavily overclocked on both the gpu and the cpu side and the one time I ever had a gpu timeout I knew exactly why it crashed because I had already known what the cards limits were and I got a little greedy on the oc. Dropped it back 50mhz and all has been fine since. 

So I find it very interesting that the sim is causing your default clocked  cpu (yes I saw your thread on that) to choke and reboot yet I run mine with advanced pbo and over the limit voltage and current settings with nary a peep.

Edited March 25, 20215 yr by Maxis

Is it MSFS or is it the hardware? Why not both?

I also have PC problems after the latest updates and I only have them with MSFS. Still I am 95% certain that the actual problem is the hardware: it's just something that has changed in MSFS with the latest updates that makes that hardware problem apparent. As if something in MSFS now pushes my hardware over a limit that usually wouldn't be a problem but which is a problem because my hardware is getting old and worn out. Or something like that.

You might ask if MSFS isn't pushing PC's too hard... but should Asobo fix this or should we (who have problems) fix this by perhaps replacing some hardware or changing some settings? I don't know but simply stating 'It is MSFS' or 'It is the hardware' might not be the way to go. 😉 In my case I am, as I said, 95% certain that I do have a hardware problem in combination with MSFS (not with any other program) and if this doesn't change within a few updates (if perhaps Asobe changes something) I will take care of it myself by replacing some hardware.

37 minutes ago, tup61 said:

Is it MSFS or is it the hardware? Why not both?

I also have PC problems after the latest updates and I only have them with MSFS. Still I am 95% certain that the actual problem is the hardware: it's just something that has changed in MSFS with the latest updates that makes that hardware problem apparent. As if something in MSFS now pushes my hardware over a limit that usually wouldn't be a problem but which is a problem because my hardware is getting old and worn out. Or something like that.

You might ask if MSFS isn't pushing PC's too hard... but should Asobo fix this or should we (who have problems) fix this by perhaps replacing some hardware or changing some settings? I don't know but simply stating 'It is MSFS' or 'It is the hardware' might not be the way to go. 😉 In my case I am, as I said, 95% certain that I do have a hardware problem in combination with MSFS (not with any other program) and if this doesn't change within a few updates (if perhaps Asobe changes something) I will take care of it myself by replacing some hardware.

You can always buy a new Gaming PC and then let us know if that solved your problem. 

I look forward to the Hotfix - is all I can say , as I too seem to be having issues with heat that may or may not be related to Update 3.

Without getting scientific, I have had a BSOD, the fans on the Graphics card at working at maximum all the time now - and yes, I have done due diligence in troubleshooting. 

My system is AMD Ryzen 7 with an RTX 2080 8GB. and 32 GB 3600 Ram

The MSFS 2020 recommended settings for this card and processor was set to High

I have paired back some of these default high settings

I was going to upgrade the RTX 2080 to a RTX 3080 but stock availability and pricing has become silly and anyway, here  there is no stock is available.

Let me just say that with the release of a hotfix, whether it works or not, I can then,  at least, eliminate that line of troubeshooting as a cause.

I understand that many people are interested in helping others here in the forums and that is greatly appreciated.  There is, however, a certain mindset that tends to avoid any criticism of these developers and looks for any other reason to explain the existence of a problem.  Sometimes it takes the form of acknowledging the issue and sort of apologizing on behalf of Asobo while expressing absolute certainty that all will be well in the future.  At other times it takes the form of outright denial that the problem exists.

Those who express these sentiments are, perhaps, more generous and kind-hearted than I am.  But if the goal is to get Asobo to change direction and start making real progress on this sim, I'm not sure it is being served by them.

It is like the student who gets a grade of 62% on his exam and refuses to discuss anything except the answers he got right.  A "D" is still a "D."

There are clearly issues with each update that affect some but not others.  Is it rational to say that the software just makes the hardware issues more apparent.  Is it a valid response to simply invest in new hardware with each new "update?"

IMHO this sim has never risen above a "D" and when it begins to exact financial costs to those who use it, the grade drops significantly from there.

So far Asobo is being congratulated for the huge undertaking they have attempted or for what they have promised.  I look forward to offering mine when and if we see some real progress.

1 minute ago, TASCHMANN said:

I understand that many people are interested in helping others here in the forums and that is greatly appreciated.  There is, however, a certain mindset that tends to avoid any criticism of these developers and looks for any other reason to explain the existence of a problem.  Sometimes it takes the form of acknowledging the issue and sort of apologizing on behalf of Asobo while expressing absolute certainty that all will be well in the future.  At other times it takes the form of outright denial that the problem exists.

Those who express these sentiments are, perhaps, more generous and kind-hearted than I am.  But if the goal is to get Asobo to change direction and start making real progress on this sim, I'm not sure it is being served by them.

It is like the student who gets a grade of 62% on his exam and refuses to discuss anything except the answers he got right.  A "D" is still a "D."

There are clearly issues with each update that affect some but not others.  Is it rational to say that the software just makes the hardware issues more apparent.  Is it a valid response to simply invest in new hardware with each new "update?"

IMHO this sim has never risen above a "D" and when it begins to exact financial costs to those who use it, the grade drops significantly from there.

So far Asobo is being congratulated for the huge undertaking they have attempted or for what they have promised.  I look forward to offering mine when and if we see some real progress.

It's not that at all. and yes a Flight simulator can expose the weakness of an PC because it can stress a pc for an extended period of time. I am looking for empirical data that can correlate with the claims of the OP. I haven't found any. That's because we understand the relationship between heavy workload and heat. I know not every has the budget to always get the best of class PC but you can make educate choices on how to optimize your $$ to get a system that won't choke under that heavy load. 

 

If you read this forum, you would think MSFS has CTD every single flight. It's far from the truth. I actually never got a CTD in MSFS since the Alpha. It doesn't mean the game doesn't have have bugs. It certainly has a slew of fixes that is required including the famous FPS bugs that I have experienced myself a few times. That's not every single time and it never resulted in my GPU or CPU overheating nor to a CTD. Maybe I am fortunate enough to be able to afford a PC that allows me to do that. It is so easy to point the finger at MSFS and says "that's the bad guy" for everything but it's not always the case. Personally, I am looking at each issue objectively and try to ascertain whether the issue is hardware related or software related. FPS bug = Software, GPU overheating = hardware. It is that simple. Specially when the FPS bug does the exact opposite of heating up your PC as your CPU and GPU utilization goes way down when that happen.