22 minutes ago, w6kd said:

It's sort of like driving that notional Ferrari through a series of synchronized traffic lights at the 55 mph speed limit and hitting a green light at every intersection, rather than flooring it at each light and then having to stop and accelerate again at each successive light. 

This is the best illustration I've ever heard describing the difference between capping and not capping FPS. It clearly and beautifully makes the point.

I find the OP's CPU current-limit throttling during testing to be a bit suspicious--I would recommend checking the CPU clock speed with a utility like CPU-Z while running the sim if you see what seems to be aberrant low frame rates.  Relieving the stock current limits is a pretty standard part of overclocking intel CPUs, and if the Lenovo OEM BIOS does not allow those limits to be raised, it is possible you're running into the throttling issue when running the sim.  That said, I don't personally like Intel's tuning utility as a stress test--I think it's overly aggressive and not a good approximation of real-world workloads.  Maybe try RealBench and see if you still see throttling.

As mentioned above, some fluctuation is normal, especially on the ground in complex scenery areas.

 

24 minutes ago, David Mills said:

You run the sim in 4K and set render scaling to 130? Are you using an 8K monitor or something?

I just like the look it makes thing sharper. At 100RS I can get a steady 45 FPS, At 80RS its in the 50s. I use a Lg 48" OLED

1 hour ago, Phantoms said:

Did you turn on the scenery precache (or whatever it's called) that was added with the last update? Makes a big difference in the stutters when looking around.

Yup, turned on Ultra. Tried it on each setting. Made no difference to fps. 

37 minutes ago, w6kd said:

I find the OP's CPU current-limit throttling during testing to be a bit suspicious--I would recommend checking the CPU clock speed with a utility like CPU-Z while running the sim if you see what seems to be aberrant low frame rates.  Relieving the stock current limits is a pretty standard part of overclocking intel CPUs, and if the Lenovo OEM BIOS does not allow those limits to be raised, it is possible you're running into the throttling issue when running the sim.  That said, I don't personally like Intel's tuning utility as a stress test--I think it's overly aggressive and not a good approximation of real-world workloads.  Maybe try RealBench and see if you still see throttling.

As mentioned above, some fluctuation is normal, especially on the ground in complex scenery areas.

Not sure why my test was a bit suspicious as you put it. Intel's test declocked me to 3.4ghz and said it was due to current limit throttling. I agree though their test is perhapa overly aggressive.

That's why I ran the 3D Mark Time Spy test (scores in my previous post) and it says my machine is in the bottom 8% compared with other 10700k's and 3080s. Is that normal?  It doesn't seem so.

41 minutes ago, steve310002 said:

Not sure why my test was a bit suspicious as you put it. Intel's test declocked me to 3.4ghz and said it was due to current limit throttling. I agree though their test is perhapa overly aggressive.

That's why I ran the 3D Mark Time Spy test (scores in my previous post) and it says my machine is in the bottom 8% compared with other 10700k's and 3080s. Is that normal?  It doesn't seem so.

Suspicious, as in I "suspect" that throttling could be a potential cause of (or be related to) your performance problem, and shouldn't be dismissed without further investigation.

That 3DMark test does appear to be telling you something.

This sort of thing is why I am not a fan of OEM systems.  Locked BIOS options can really get in the way.

As hard as the components are to come by these days, I might even consider keeping the system and replacing the motherboard with something better-suited to using the other hardware to its full capabilities.

Get a g-sync monitor to do your 3 series card justice. And then cap the frames at 50/60. Turn off the fps monitor. And enjoy the smoothness. 

I agree with Ian ^

If you get a real G-Sync monitor (Not AMD Freesync Compatible), the card will synchronize the frames with the refresh rate on the monitor continuously. You'll get a much smoother experience even when the frame rate dips, everything from 30 and up will seem very smooth. 

I have a 4 year old G-sync monitor that's running at only 90 Hz, but it gives me a very nice and fluid experience even when FPS dips. Except for some stutters at very busy airports. No need to cap frames, at least not for me. 

With regards to the low CPU score, it might be cooling, or memory speed or a combination. What kind of CPU cooler was it shipped with? And what type of power supply does it have?

The most important thing is that you find a solution that is satisfactory and to enjoy the simulator. There's no "perfect" in the flight sim world. You just have to find compromise that you're happy with. 

Edited September 28, 20214 yr by Republic3D

1 hour ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

Get a g-sync monitor to do your 3 series card justice. And then cap the frames at 50/60. Turn off the fps monitor. And enjoy the smoothness. 

Agree with this .. Just need to fix that CPU issue first. I would start with finding out what the temp limits are for that cpu and checking to see if its hitting it on a regular basis and forcing throttling. Hopefully its something simple as needing better cooling and not something that is hard coded like a limited Bios since this is not a fully custom pc.

Thats why i love building and benchmarking the word not allowed out of my builds.. Find every and all weaknesses and work through them to make sure you know exactly what to expect from your pc and what to look for when something goes wrong.

The guy who the mods admonished appears pretty knowledgeable as well. I don't have anything against someone choosing to cap frames (I personally don't) and controlling resources. but that needs to be a decision made AFTER you address all issues. Not to be used as a possible solution while leaving other potential issues untested and undiagnosed.

Good luck to the OP.

And just one more thing I will add, the SU5, hotfixes and WU6 update really lifted the low to medium end of the hardware capability in MSFS. The higher end (such as your setup) also got a lift, but not as large. The difference between an RTX 3070 and RTX 3090 used to be significant, but in today's sim is only around 10 FPS. At least according to what I've been able to figure out. I'm seriously considering to sell my 3090 and find a 3070. The problem is that they're all overpriced, no matter what segment you look at these days.

Edited September 28, 20214 yr by Republic3D

26 minutes ago, Republic3D said:

And just one more thing I will add, the SU5, hotfixes and WU6 update really lifted the low to medium end of the hardware capability in MSFS. The higher end (such as your setup) also got a lift, but not as large. The difference between an RTX 3070 and RTX 3090 used to be significant, but in today's sim is only around 10 FPS. At least according to what I've been able to figure out. I'm seriously considering to sell my 3090 and find a 3070. The problem is that they're all overpriced, no matter what segment you look at these days.

Sim isn't fully developed yet.. I would only consider selling the 3090 if the lesser card can handle landing at a custom designed third party airport on the same level as KORD/KATL/KJFG/EGLL with 100% full addon AI traffic and all settings on ultra  above 30frames with no hiccups.

I know right now its mainly a CPU constraint but you never know when you will need the extra GPU grunt.

But that's just me.. Sorry to derail the topic.

 

Edited September 28, 20214 yr by Maxis

3 hours ago, David Mills said:

Cap your FPS at 30 (vsync ON) and change your Render Scale from 100 to 80. Be reasonable about setting every single option to Ultra. But the main setting for performance by far is the Render Scaling. I can't see any degradation in visual quality until the Render Scaling is below 70 -- and I use a 75" 4K TV as a monitor and I sit extremely close to it for immersion.

 

on a Rig like the OP's - no chance 

 

1 hour ago, Maxis said:

Sim isn't fully developed yet.. I would only consider selling the 3090 if the lesser card can handle landing at a custom designed third party airport on the same level as KORD/KATL/KJFG/EGLL with 100% full addon AI traffic and all settings on ultra  above 30frames with no hiccups.

I know right now its mainly a CPU constraint but you never know when you will need the extra GPU grunt.

But that's just me.. Sorry to derail the topic.

 

Yes, I see your point. But a complex payware international airport gives me relatively reduced FPS and some stutters even today. And it's not because of the GPU. Like you mention it's a CPU constraint. But maybe I should keep the 3090 until the rest of the system catches up, as well as the optimizations of the sim. For example at Orbx KVNY I can see in GPU-Z that I'm using more than 12 GB VRAM, so I guess the card is doing it's job. 

6 hours ago, swiesma said:

there is a saying in Germany: "Traue niemals einer Statisitik die du nicht selbst gefälscht hast"

And do you know who coined that phrase? Goebbels.

He falsely claimed that it was Churchill who said this, to make him look bad. But it was entirely a fabrication from the Reichspropagandaministerium.

 

1 hour ago, Republic3D said:

Yes, I see your point. But a complex payware international airport gives me relatively reduced FPS and some stutters even today. And it's not because of the GPU. Like you mention it's a CPU constraint.

It's definitely the CPU holding me back. It's hard to say how much my very low CPU score on 3D Mark Time Spy (low for a 10700k) is holding me back in MSFS in real world usage but I am certain it is impacting my fps significantly making things less smooth especially on or near the ground where I am CPU limited.

I have low temps so it's not temperature throttling. I have seen that it's current throttling limiting my CPU when at full load when stressed in a benchmark. The strange thing is that MSFS underutilizes my CPU so it's not even close to being at full load. Logic would indicate then it shouldn't really be current limit throttling (I would guess) so that doesn't exactly make sense either. 

However my low 3D Mark score and my general feeling that fps are too low on the ground for my hardware makes me think there must be a connection with the current limit throttling. Maybe when the CPU peaks at 5ghz it throttles back faster than it should or something due to not enough power. Who knows. 

In any case I am quite annoyed at my pre-build for the price I paid especially as we all know money doesn't grown on trees. These days more than ever.

It is clear from other posts I have read in recent days that the manufacturer appears to limit the power the CPU uses which is causing the throttling when it's pushed. As I said earlier the bios is locked down so this can't be changed and the overclocking tool they provide via an app in Windows appears to do absolutely nothing. XMP profiles cannot be changed either. Their marketing sells it like it's a gamers dream with great overclocking capabilities and future proof. Not sure how it can be in the bottom 8% of 3D Mark for that spec then if those things are true. 

Edited September 28, 20214 yr by steve310002