9 minutes ago, Mir // Flightbeam said:

It's a massive update, provided for free ... I literally do not understand how a customer can already have doubts or possible discontents about a free update. Alas, this is the current market.

I'm not going to say anything else here after this.

My only original point was that I took mild exception to phrases like "catering to the great unwashed" from Carl (which may well have been written with a grin, for all I know), and then you apparently supporting that view with talk of "ridiculous coffee shops" and "waste of interior modelling" for stuff that can't be seen from the cockpit. For me, as a big time scenery buyer, the more detail the better. If you put actual flushing toilets in the restrooms in the terminals I'd even take the drone cam in there to check them out (and I promise to wash my hands afterwards <grin>)

I've already said that I think the FB products are great, in fact I remember actually upgrading my then PC at the time just so that I could run your KSFO HD for P3D a bit more smoothly because I was so knocked out when I saw the demo for it. It was streets ahead of anything I'd seen at that point. I have no doubts or possible discontents about the KDEN update, and I look forward to getting hold of it. And yes, thank you for doing this update as a free update, and I appreciate that as much as anyone else.

 

6 hours ago, micstatic said:

Something as simple as the quality of the tarmac can make or break an airport for me in terms of perceived quality.  

And Dave, the key phrase there is "for me". It may be true for you but it isn't for me, and flight simulation is certainly important (in that it's a major hobby and probably where I spend most of my spare time) and enjoyable to me. All this stuff is just personal opinion, mine, yours and everbody elses too. We're obviously different in our approaches - I can pretty much guarantee that I'll spend more time with the drone or external cam than in the cockpit on any flight I'll ever do.

1 hour ago, andy1252 said:

And Dave, the key phrase there is "for me". It may be true for you but it isn't for me, and flight simulation is certainly important (in that it's a major hobby and probably where I spend most of my spare time) and enjoyable to me. All this stuff is just personal opinion, mine, yours and everbody elses too. We're obviously different in our approaches - I can pretty much guarantee that I'll spend more time with the drone or external cam than in the cockpit on any flight I'll ever do.

I agree with you.  I was merely pointing out upthread you said you suspected that the serious pilot types were not the ones keeping the addon suppliers in business.  I would say your part of the hobby is a smaller sample size than the hardcore pilot type.  Atleast in terms of airline airport addons that's all.  Though I'm sure Mir knows the exact answer to that question even if he prefers to keep it to himself.  Cheers

 

In my humble opinion  I do not like airports that have no interior details in 2022....why ? cause after a long flight and taxing to the gate I want to see some detail behind that glass in the terminal and some people ...just like in real life flat textures are lifeless and boring and its nice to explore the airport especially one that you have never been to before.... and nostalgia  for those airports that  you visited in the past.. developers are artists not robots.... and designing the inside is part of whole experience we are trying to create real life...mir and a some other talented developers know how to handle frame rates with experience and techniques so thanks to mir  for the amazing update coming up should be amazing loving that art!

2 hours ago, micstatic said:

Though I'm sure Mir knows the exact answer to that question even if he prefers to keep it to himself.  Cheers

No doubt. I've often wondered just how many copies these sorts of products actually sell. I've no real idea of the size of the market for such stuff. I used to hang out on the Orbx forum pretty much all the time (until the culture there changed when JV stepped back) and that was a place where there was much more emphasis on scenery, for fairly obvious reasons. Almost no debate about game/sim, serious/non-serious etc, but lots of discussion on the various merits of different bits of scenery. But even there, numbers were never discussed or revealed. Definitely more "hardcore pilot" types over here, and it feels like less emphasis on scenery here, and that may be why we have different perceptions about who buys how much etc. Not that it matters. But I have to say I'm curious about volumes of sales of this stuff generally. I've no real idea how popular or otherwise the whole flightsim environment is. I hope it is popular enough to continue and prosper, as it feels to me like it's finally getting in to its stride these days, and I'd hate to have done my usual thing and just gotten deep into something as it heads towards the cliff edge. Might seem like a strange thing to say somewhere like this, as avsim feels like a busy and lively forum, but then most places like this are kept busy by a relatively small number of participants so for all I know MSFS may be some sort of last gasp. Doesn't feel like it though. Either way, I'll be buying scenery and waving my credit card right up to the moment the boat goes down.

But boy, I do remember being absolutely gob-smacked when I first saw FB's KSFO HD. I really hadn't imagined anything like it was even possible at that time. And in spite of Mir's comments about unnecessary details the images I saw in the link at the start of this thread looked pretty detailed to me, and I shall look forward to seeing the new version.

cheers,

Andy

(and now that really is it for me on this matter. Promise!)

2 minutes ago, andy1252 said:

No doubt. I've often wondered just how many copies these sorts of products actually sell. I've no real idea of the size of the market for such stuff. I used to hang out on the Orbx forum pretty much all the time (until the culture there changed when JV stepped back) and that was a place where there was much more emphasis on scenery, for fairly obvious reasons. Almost no debate about game/sim, serious/non-serious etc, but lots of discussion on the various merits of different bits of scenery. But even there, numbers were never discussed or revealed. Definitely more "hardcore pilot" types over here, and it feels like less emphasis on scenery here, and that may be why we have different perceptions about who buys how much etc. Not that it matters. But I have to say I'm curious about volumes of sales of this stuff generally. I've no real idea how popular or otherwise the whole flightsim environment is. I hope it is popular enough to continue and prosper, as it feels to me like it's finally getting in to its stride these days, and I'd hate to have done my usual thing and just gotten deep into something as it heads towards the cliff edge. Might seem like a strange thing to say somewhere like this, as avsim feels like a busy and lively forum, but then most places like this are kept busy by a relatively small number of participants so for all I know MSFS may be some sort of last gasp. Doesn't feel like it though. Either way, I'll be buying scenery and waving my credit card right up to the moment the boat goes down.

But boy, I do remember being absolutely gob-smacked when I first saw FB's KSFO HD. I really hadn't imagined anything like it was even possible at that time. And in spite of Mir's comments about unnecessary details the images I saw in the link at the start of this thread looked pretty detailed to me, and I shall look forward to seeing the new version.

cheers,

Andy

(and now that really is it for me on this matter. Promise!)

I think you are misinterpreting what he said entirely...  He did not say all interior modeling and details are unnecessary.  He said details like coffee shops that couldn't be seen "from the cockpit" were unnecessary.  Essentially if it couldn't be seen from the outside in then it was unnecessary.  Not that interior detailing was unnecessary.  So if you can see it from the apron or from the flightdeck looking in it should be modeled.  If it is an interior coffee shop on a sub floor of the airport that can't be seen from anywhere but inside the terminal it is unnecessary.  

This is classic mountain out of a molehill... 

Update on the update!

https://www.flightbeam.net/post/kden--msfs-an-update-on-the-update?postId=11b91f8d-3bdd-46e1-b672-3fa9d57ea51a&utm_campaign=ae356a22-fd88-4721-85b8-b2c46b784ee1&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&utm_content=d4a6cf5e-a628-4b48-8014-926ecb828fd8&cid=8437d831-04bd-4e68-abe6-ca2661d10972

It's nice to see the updates.  However I would much rather see them do SFO/PHX/MSP first.  

46 minutes ago, Drumcode said:

Update on the update!

https://www.flightbeam.net/post/kden--msfs-an-update-on-the-update?postId=11b91f8d-3bdd-46e1-b672-3fa9d57ea51a&utm_campaign=ae356a22-fd88-4721-85b8-b2c46b784ee1&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&utm_content=d4a6cf5e-a628-4b48-8014-926ecb828fd8&cid=8437d831-04bd-4e68-abe6-ca2661d10972

Looking forward to this. 

43 minutes ago, micstatic said:

It's nice to see the updates.  However I would much rather see them do SFO/PHX/MSP first.  

Agreed!

1 hour ago, micstatic said:

It's nice to see the updates.  However I would much rather see them do SFO/PHX/MSP first.  

MSP and PHX are in the simultaneous pipes and are planned to be released in the Spring.

Edited February 3, 20233 yr by Drumcode

As I travel out of KDEN in real life very often, it will be nice to see these updates for the airport in MSFS. Maybe, just maybe, FlightBeam can finish thier updates before the actual real airport is done being worked on. At the rate of the real work, FlightBeam has at least 5 years to get it done 😁 I have seen the line for security going on as far as the eye can see, almost out the building! One whole side is shut down while the upgrades are being worked on. And I am not exaggerating. At least we don't have to deal with that in the sim 😎

Edited February 3, 20233 yr by sniper31

2 hours ago, Drumcode said:

MSP and PHX are in the simultaneous pipes and are planned to be released in the Spring.

Where did they say spring?  That would be great but I don't think I heard them announce anything and I was under the impression that SFO was coming before those.

What ever flightbeam is working on, its always Top of the Line!!!!

1 hour ago, Zimmerbz said:

Where did they say spring?  That would be great but I don't think I heard them announce anything and I was under the impression that SFO was coming before those.

On their forum, one of the comments from Mir in the same thread I posted the link to. I don’t spread fake news, breh. 😉

Edited February 3, 20233 yr by Drumcode

22 minutes ago, Drumcode said:

On their forum, one of the comments from Mir in the same thread I posted the link to. I don’t spread fake news, breh. 😉

Nice... I didn't see that link.  Thanks!