11 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

MSFS, on the other hand, brought flight-simming back to mainstream and this should be celebrated by all of us, irrespective of their platform of choice. 

Couldn't agree more. The flood of new flight simulation hardware on the market is due to the popularity of MSFS and the flight simming community as a whole has benefited from that.

 

50 minutes ago, twojastara said:

If you take a look at the breakdowns and which is used for 'most of the time' (aka 'primary sim') the differences between sims are closer to expected outcomes - MSFS: 55%, XP11: 9%, XP12: 5%, DCS: 3%, P3D v5: 3%.

I'm also thinking primary SIM is where customers tend to spend most of their money. I'm sure developers are looking at this.

I saw that Nvidia has 80% of the market share in the survey. Yet some are so against xplane ever supporting the native features of this card. Then there is surprise when there are complaints about performance.

11 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

When was the last time that a flight simulator was announced on major gaming events or been showcased by popular internet influencers due to its usage of the latest tech such as DLSS3? Which other civilian Flight Simulator is available on consoles, Game Pass or on the cloud?

When the mega corporation decided to toss a few pennies to the marketing departments and influencers. Remember those steam stats? Hardly mainstream. It's not like those mainstreamers are showing it because they actually use it. 

Using it as a demo of DLSS3 actually makes perfect sense. It's incredibly sedate in terms of change per rendered frame. Very predictable.

In other words, it's boring enough that it won't generate the garbage in the fake frames that many other games were seeing. Perfect for an essentially beta release of a new technology.

4 minutes ago, brinx said:

The flood of new flight simulation hardware on the market is due to the popularity of MSFS and the flight simming community as a whole has benefited from that.

 

I saw that Nvidia has 80% of the market share in the survey. Yet some are so against xplane ever supporting the native features of this card. Then there is surprise when there are complaints about performance.

Hardware availability is a good point. Agreed there.

 

Specifically because it's native only. That also hurts the MacOS crowd, not just AMD. 

FSR2 has shown to be on par with or sometimes better than DLSS2. LR has alluded to the former coming at some point. It's possible the latter would be a byproduct. But yeah, as an AMD owner, no thanks! Nor am I at all surprised about the complaints 🙂

To me the most interesting thing about this survey.  Reading the reactions from the specific "special interest" groups.  IE, reading the responses in the MSFS vs XP vs P3D forums.  It's actually fascinating the different takes people can have from the same data.  

I do find it interesting how data can quickly be spun into this sim vs that sim or the demise of a certain sim. It seems that some will dive down into the weeds with the bug smashers while I visit the weeds occasionally and then return to the 45,000 feet level where I belong🤣. I guess I call that maintaining a "big picture" perspective. I am an avid aviator and a simmer at heart. I believe it's great that we have all of these different sims to meet our needs and interest. I believe it's a fault to limit yourself to one specific sim and type of flying. I prefer to have them all! When I want to fly around with some great eye candy, I will fire up MSFS or XP12. If I want to fly a great 727, A350, MD11 or G550, I fire up XP. When I need a great 747, 777, 787 or scare bus I'm over in P3D. When I feel like flying a DC6, MD80, 737 or A320, back into MSFS. If I feel the need for speed and want to blow things up, DCS! If I want that great VR experience, DCS and aerofly FS 4 fits the bill.

There are so many options and experiences to be had when you have and use them all! Anytime any sim makes great progress, it's great for us all. I remember being one of those guys that yelled PS was better than xbox. I then switched sides and went to xbox. Now, I own them both and fire them up depending on what game or console specific thing I want to play. When you just get them all, life is good.🤣.

Rick

Me likes uninstalling it all in a sequence 😜

So Me going to suggest Navigraph a new chart - what sim do you uninstall the most ?  And... - what is more important to you in uninstalling a sim ?

Edited December 22, 20223 yr by cagarini

35 minutes ago, micstatic said:

To me the most interesting thing about this survey.  Reading the reactions from the specific "special interest" groups.  IE, reading the responses in the MSFS vs XP vs P3D forums.  It's actually fascinating the different takes people can have from the same data.  

You mean how someone can see this data as :

Quote

Its looking increasingly to me like the fall of msfs

LOL... 

24 minutes ago, cagarini said:

Me likes uninstalling it all in a sequence 😜

So Me going to suggest Navigraph a new chart - what sim do you uninstall the most ?  And... - what is more important to you in uninstalling a sim ?

I think my next candidate will be DCS if somebody doesn't come up with something to do in that otherwise very interesting open source A-4E.

Well, ease of uninstalling is generally a big advantage. X-Plane does well with just two folders that need to be deleted, while anything using Steam isn't too bad either, taking two or three clicks as long as there aren't gigabytes of add-ons hidden deep within "C:\Users".  I think the worst offenders are older sims from the turn of the century that use classical autoinstallers which tend to break and rot away in the "programs and features" list.

42 minutes ago, psolk said:

LOL... 

You say that now.

I said exactly the same for P3D as I do for MSFS 2 years ago..... Sure some will try and spin that into another example of me being wrong about everything huh...

Personally I'm looking forward to how the new G1000 in MSFS stacks up against all the fun stuff that will be in XP12.20+ in the next survey 😛

Edited December 22, 20223 yr by mSparks

3 hours ago, mSparks said:

I said exactly the same for P3D as I do for MSFS 2 years ago..... Sure some will try and spin that into another example of me being wrong about everything huh...

I'm with you. MSFS will be basically dead in about 2 years. I'll enjoy it while I have it, but these numbers really don't lie about the dark future ahead for MS/Asobo. 

1 hour ago, Dermot McClusky said:

I'm with you. MSFS will be basically dead in about 2 years. I'll enjoy it while I have it, but these numbers really don't lie about the dark future ahead for MS/Asobo. 

actually not what I said at all.

For sure people will still be using msfs in 20 years, just like FSX, windows 7 or Internet Explorer 6 more than outlived their use by dates. A significant portion of those using their PCs for msfs most of the time will only ever eat what microsoft feeds them. 

Assuming they keep the servers running that is.....

If they do, and they keep up the current trend, they'll just have to settle for second place- for the first time in flight sim history mind you.

Edited December 22, 20223 yr by mSparks

1 minute ago, mSparks said:

.If they do, and they keep up the current trend, they'll just have to settle for second place- for the first time in flight sim history mind you.

I was probably being overly dramatic w/ my wording, but I guess "the fall of" MSFS equates in my mind to "basically dead," i.e. still being used but falling/fallen behind. Like I say, the numbers here just don't lie. The current trend is clear. It's a shame, too, because the resources of MS, well-deployed, could really create something special.

That said, XP12's development is really something to look forward to, and it'll be interesting to watch its trajectory just take off. As Buzz Lightyear says, "To infinity: and beyond!"

27 minutes ago, Dermot McClusky said:

watch its trajectory just take off.

If they deliver what they promised (of which they have a great track record) and sort whats left of the stability issues (not such a great track record tbh, but definately improved on early XP11 days) it should. 

Wouldn't put it past MS to pull every trick in the book to try and stop it though, they dont do second place well.

27 minutes ago, Dermot McClusky said:

being overly dramatic w/ my wording

maybe, but also from zero to a 20% of flight simmers "bought" into XP12 over the space of a few months/weeks is also among the most dramatic things Ive seen in these surveys, reasonably comparable to the rise of MSFS at launch

https://navigraph.com/blog/flightsim-community-2020-survey-results

but with none of the marketing...

Edited December 23, 20223 yr by mSparks

31 minutes ago, mSparks said:

maybe, but also from zero to a 20% of flight simmers "bought" into XP12 over the space of a few months/weeks is also among the most dramatic things Ive seen in these surveys, reasonably comparable to the rise of MSFS at launch

Hmmm.  So MSFS sold 1,000,000 copies in the first 14 days on PC only, no marketing no XBox.. 

You SOMEHOW deduce from that survey that XP12 had a reasonably comparable launch?  I'm pretty sure Austin would be ecstatic if XP12 sold close to 1M copies in the first 2 weeks  to be "reasonably comparable" to MSFS.  If it is 20% of the entire market as you imply that would be 200,000 copies since the pre-release sales were availabel compared to 1M in 2 weeks.  How are those comparable? 

But sure, it's the demise of MSFS and XP had a reasonably comparable launch is what I got from the survey too...   #facepalm  

 

Edited December 23, 20223 yr by psolk

I'm honestly not sure how to reconcile what I'm reading here in this topic compared to the survey data.  Especially also looking at the behavior we've seen from third party developers the last year.  My takeaway is a lot different than some of you guys.   MSFS is still out climbing the competition.  However I think xplane has clearly shown a respectable trend in the survey.  Just my honest takeaway