34 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

Well, gotta be quite frank here, who's forcing anyone to read PMDG's updates? And then get annoyed by them? 🙂

I don't think that was pointed at me.  All I was saying was why the accolades when so little of the plane was shown?  That's all.  PMDG is free to do whatever they wish of course.

1 hour ago, lwt1971 said:

Well, gotta be quite frank here, who's forcing anyone to read PMDG's updates? And then get annoyed by them? 🙂 ... A lot of us, including me, like some information compared to nothing, and I actually like to hear RSR's details and insights into PMDG's inner workings and how things are going. It's rather interesting actually, to me.

Yes what actually was shown in this first preview are some exterior shots.. we also learned that the beta testing is going better/faster than expected, that the performance of the 777 in its initial builds are equivalent to the released 737, that they aim to do a full C*U simulation with all control laws, that around half of the 200 defects reported by the beta testers in the first week of beta got resolved, etc. That's.. sort of what one expects to hear in a development update.

Some folks seem to have a history with PMDG, RSR, and/or PMDG's forum that then renders them somewhat bitter and weirdly and easily worked up over anything that's PMDG and/or RSR related. I mean, as always it's quite easy to save oneself this irritation by not wading into a PMDG thread ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

Well, gotta be quite frank here, who's forcing anyone to read PMDG's updates?

Obviously no one is forcing me to read the updates but as everyone else who is interested in the actual product we will be inclined to read it HOPING that there is something worth reading.

It's rather interesting actually, to me.....

Im glad there was something of worth in there for you. For me there was nothing of substance .. (all subjective obviously)

 

Yes what actually was shown in this first preview are some exterior shots.. we also learned that the beta testing is going better/faster than expected, that the performance of the 777 in its initial builds are equivalent to the released 737, that they aim to do a full C*U simulation with all control laws, that around half of the 200 defects reported by the beta testers in the first week of beta got resolved, etc. That's.. sort of what one expects to hear in a development update.

Time frame to exit beta ? Time frame to sale? and if you don't have that fine im not going to be unreasonable and demand that.. Actual full substantive preview pictures so we get a more full idea as to what the product looks like ? Is all that matters to me at this point. They had the time to do that so whats the point of being deliberately stingy with the preview? Especially if you're going to promote having some sort of "event" on Christmas Day. If not and the only thing you've got are three pics of the front and back so the end viewer has no idea as to the full product they could have not wasted anyone's time and posted it then and there instead of having an announcement.

I'm not here to argue with you or anyone .. Im just agreeing with someone else on the forums that FOR ME .. An announcement for an event to show us three pictures and tell us what everyone else knows (they are working on it duh!) is a waste of my time and a missed opportunity. 

Dont agree? .. thats fine too.

 

Some folks seem to have a history with PMDG, RSR, and/or PMDG's forum that then renders them somewhat bitter and weirdly and easily worked up over anything that's PMDG and/or RSR related. I mean, as always it's quite easy to save oneself this irritation by not wading into a PMDG thread ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Check my post history i have never fallen into that category. On the other hand im not going to hold comment when they can do better. For me this is one case where all that announcement of of an event could have been done without fanfare.

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by Maxis

1 hour ago, Vitold69 said:

PMDG doesn't want to hear anything about weather radar and block posts about this on their forums

This is very unfair. You’ve left out the part where everyone has to close their eyes, put their fingers in their ears and shout “IT’S JUST A BITMAP”.

…..then they lock the thread🤨

 

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by DD_Arthur

12 minutes ago, Maxis said:

Especially if you're going to promote having some sort of "event" on Christmas Day. If not and the only thing you've got are three pics of the front and back so the end viewer has no idea as to the full product they could have not wasted anyone's time and posted it then and there instead of having an announcement.

I'm not here to argue with you or anyone .. Im just agreeing with someone else on the forums that FOR ME .. An announcement for an event to show us three pictures and tell us what everyone else knows (they are working on it duh!) is a waste of my time and a missed opportunity. 

Dont agree? .. thats fine too.

Fair enough we can agree to disagree.. but when/where did RSR promote/announce an "event" on Christmas Day? On his previous update all he said is that some previews will be shown around XMas time. We got those, and a summary of how beta is going and an indication of how it performs in the sim compared to the 737 (and usually they've always shown exterior previews as the first preview of an aircraft once in beta).
 

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by lwt1971

10 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

Fair enough we can agree to disagree.. but when/where did RSR promote/announce an "event" on Christmas Day? On his previous update all he said is that some previews will be shown around XMas time. We got those, and a summary of how beta is going and an indication of how it performs in the sim compared to the 737 (and usually they've always shown exterior previews as the first preview of an aircraft once in beta).
 

 

Randazzo Quote

Other Stuff!:
While we have had you distracted with progress and rapid updates on the tablet and the 737NG series airplane- there are a few other projects that are rolling up on critical stages of their development and release cycles. Previews are being prepared- and I'm looking forward to welcoming you into the hangar with a glass of egg-nog in hand.

Thank you as always for your enthusiasm for our work- we hope you are having a great December thus far!
 

Take note of the item bolded and underlined.

This was at the end of his update on Dec 8th. I'm getting older but im not senile yet.  If the plan was to release three cut ups and call that a preview well i guess im the one out of touch.

But as you and i are looking for different things from them at this juncture agreeing to disagree is the best recourse.

 

Have a good one.

 

25 minutes ago, Maxis said:

Previews are being prepared- and I'm looking forward to welcoming you into the hangar with a glass of egg-nog in hand.

This was at the end of his update on Dec 8th. I'm getting older but im not senile yet.  If the plan was to release three cut ups and call that a preview well i guess im the one out of touch.

Ah ok, guess we interpreted his sentence very differently 🙂 I was definitely only expecting screenshots and was in fact glad he delved more into beta progress and indicated about the bird's performance in the sim, etc. I read the same update when he posted it and didn't interpret that as any special event per se.

Like they did with the 737 release on MSFS, I expect more detailed previews of the aircraft (i.e. systems, specific features, etc) only closer to end of beta and before release.

Have a good one.

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by lwt1971

3 minutes ago, Maxis said:

Randazzo Quote

Other Stuff!:
While we have had you distracted with progress and rapid updates on the tablet and the 737NG series airplane- there are a few other projects that are rolling up on critical stages of their development and release cycles. Previews are being prepared- and I'm looking forward to welcoming you into the hangar with a glass of egg-nog in hand.

I'm confused, were those pictures not considered previews? I don't recall PMDG historically giving release dates, until maybe more recently, but we all saw that hurt them when it came to the efb, so I wouldn't be surprised if they don't do that again, just like Fenix. In terms of substance, yea that's subjective, many like to know the level of detail they are aiming for when it comes to the external model. Many simmers, especially since MSFS came out, have higher expectations in terms of details in appearance.

Does anyone remember the PMDG DC-6 Release Previews and Buildup?  That’s what they need to return back to if they want to earn their cred back with general public. 

Just my opinion of course. Just because “I say” does not make it a fact.  Many more folks here at Avsim would do well to remember just because you say it does not make it true.

Sorry, and that’s a fact you can take to the bank.

-B

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by btacon

33 minutes ago, Kevin_28 said:

I'm confused, were those pictures not considered previews?

No need for the confusion. I'm sure you are very happy with them technically satisfying what they set out to achieve. I'm also sure they could have showed two individual pictures of the 777  left and right landing gear brake pins and satisfied the plural requirement as advertised too.

 

 

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by Maxis

I think PMDG are doing what they have learned to do to build interest and anticipation for a release, that in this case is still likely some months away. I have no idea what the thinking is behind their communication strategy, but they are smart people and have been at this for a long time and they must think based on evidence over the years that this approach to marketing and maintaining a community works well. And probably it does as their products seem to sell very well and, while they appear to be somewhat polarizing, they have a good-sized audience. I really think they are a team of sincere, good people who work hard to produce simulation products people will enjoy, so I don't really grasp the polarization. 

However, what I will say is that I am an order of magnitude more excited and eager for the iniBuilds 300 this week than I am for a future PMDG 777 release, for which, I am honestly not excited at all, and barely interested because they have done nothing to suggest it will have any meaningful depth and features beyond the 777 I flew in P3D for years. And what they have shown in terms of texturing does not look to be any better than other aircraft out there in MSFS. 

Expecting PMDG to provide a release date for the 777 when it is only entering the beta test stage is rather naive. Robert Randazzo stated that around two hundred issues were detected on the first test run, and a hundred of them were fixed very quickly. However, they will have no idea if those hundred fixes cause further issues themselves down the line (never mind the other hundred). Everything could work perfectly after fixing these issues, but they would have to be the luckiest developers on the planet for that to happen.

Simply put, providing a release date at this stage is not an option if you want to be honest with your customers.

This thread is perfectly timed with the release of Navigraph's survey.  There is SOOO much PMDG hate here about everything, including a well worded update about the status of the 777.  But guess what out of the people who pay for Nav data updates *aka hardcore simmers* The top airplane from last year was the PMDG 737 and the most anticipated airplane is the 777.  Everyone needs to calm down, they make great products, they are wordy on their updates sure but end product is top of the line.   Find something else to complain about.... Wasn't Fenix supposed to release block 2 in Oct? What happened to that?

3 minutes ago, nrunning24 said:

Wasn't Fenix supposed to release block 2 in Oct? What happened to that?

They put their hands up. Said they missed the mark and then shut up and put their heads down getting to work.

That i can appreciate.

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by Maxis

duplicate post.. please delete

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by Maxis

1 minute ago, Maxis said:

They put their hands up. Said they missed the mark and then shut up and put their heads down getting to work.

That i can appreciate.

Sure I respect them, they should take their time.  But if PMDG did the same we would be having complaints on end.  The reality is Fenix came out with a forward plan with dates (near term too, and pretty solid) and has COMPLETLY missed them.  PMDG had vague forward dates on the EFB on release and got killed for not meeting them.  Lots of double standards.