3 hours ago, mSparks said:

https://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/forums/topic/309880-linux-questions-is-xp012-another-version-for-linux/&do=findComment&comment=2733807

Thanks-my question was more about the Linux installation rather than that of X-Plane.

Jay

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

blinding tribalism

A blissfully aloof hobbyist. Good for you for attaining that peace of mind.

 

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

"forces" an aerodynamic baseline

:) was this pun intended?

I've written and tweaked too many CFD research codes and used too many commercial CFD solvers to ever do anything but laugh at asobo's flight model. In private discussions we laugh loudly. 

XP uses real wind tunnel data if desired, to generate the surface forces. It's a simple as that. Ok, ok...the fuselage portion is way too generic but even that is based on actual measurements, and not on fake forces created by infinitely thin flat plate wings. Blending and balancing those 2 disparate models is a nightmare to develop for.

Actually, XP is a nightmare too. It's not as if the Cessnas of the world are handing out free CAD models of their airframes to then be able to run (real) CFD to get lift/drag/moment curves (the primary reason why FSX will always remain under the hood of asobo's model, even with slightly improved fuselage surfaces). The tuning process in XP is at least based on fundamental physics instead of chasing the dragon generated by nonsensical airframe geometry. 

1 hour ago, jkeye said:

Thanks-my question was more about the Linux installation rather than that of X-Plane.

Jay

installing linux is that straight forward.

put the setup onto a usb stick or CD, boot from it, follow the install instructions. 

I'm on fedora core:

https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/quick-docs/creating-and-using-a-live-installation-image/

if the installer sees a windows installation it will add a boot menu when you start up to choose whether to boot to linux or windows - afaik they all do this.

But my recommendation (what we were talking about in that link) is to physically unplug the windows hard drive and do everything on a new blank one, that way you can try multiple different versions of linux and get a feel for what you want without touching your windows install. There is a lot of choice and different design priorities, choosing which linux is a lot like choosing what colour to paint your bedroom walls.

1 hour ago, blingthinger said:

blissfully aloof hobbyist.

A vocabulary misfire. Think again and come back with better stuff.

///

"I've written and tweaked too many CFD research codes and used too many commercial CFD solvers to ever do anything but laugh at asobo's flight model. In private discussions we laugh loudly. "

Perhaps you missed the part where I'm complimenting XPs area engine and stating it's my preference for the very reasons you state.

As far as Asobos implementation of CFD-Lite, we all know what it is and what it's limitations are.

OTOH, it doesn't take a literal supercomputer to run it. And it does it in real time, so of what consumer utility is your version?

And if your company has been as successful as turning an entire industry on its ear almost overnight, we'd all love to hear about it, I'm sure.

Your tribalism isn't blind, but you're obviously blinkered nonetheless.

41 minutes ago, mSparks said:

installing linux is that straight forward.

Yep is so easy now. In fact I had a laptop that died so I put the disk into another one, it booted logged in and works fine. Try doing that with windows. Only laptop i have had issues with is lenovo. I would never recommend them to anyone. I use Linux mint Mate, seems the most reliable of that lot.

Edited July 20, 20241 yr by mjrhealth

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

A vocabulary misfire

Not at all. You're blind to what creates the tribalism. Go back to your sim session. You'll surely feel safer there. Less "blinded", apparently.

 

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

we all know what it is

HA! Obviously not. Marketing efforts quite literally tout it as part of the savior of the simming world and the blind tribe parrots it blindly. The reality is that it's a joke.

 

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

turning an entire industry on its ear

Streaming ortho/photogrammetry is what did that. What's more, I don't see LR frantically clamoring to implement their own CFD out of panic of being 'turned on an ear'. They don't need to and that's the point here. PMDG called asobo's CFD a "buzzword". That's exactly what it is.

 

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

And if your company

Booo. Go back to your sim session. That's not what what I said at all. Real/useful CFD doesn't run real-time. Well, not that can be taken seriously as far as rigid airframes are concerned.

 

2 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Perhaps you missed the part where I'm complimenting XP

Or perhaps I was 100% supporting your current preference du jour.

8 hours ago, blingthinger said:

So it's not a 100% replacement? I know it's not uncommon for high end 3rd parties to override the engines and fuselage. 

I'm not going to pretend I understand what Saso is doing as far as code goes.  The man is a programming mastermind, and he does things I thought were impossible.  Example:  I asked if he could code a camera view inside the cabin of the de-ice truck to make it look like a 1st person view.  Not even thinking it was possible.  Less than 24 hours later, he had it done.  

Anyway, I digress.  Whether he made modifications to already existing parameters, or completely rewrote them, using default parameters as a reference, or completely rewrote them, is above my pay grade.  He did tell me, in laymans terms, he's using the X-Plane world as a container for the CL650.  The CL runs independently within that container.  He did mention X-Plane gets it right, for the most part.  He just feels secure in making the aircraft do what he wants it to do.  He wants to be responsible for its behaviour.  To what extent he did it, I'm not sure.  

Take that for what you will.  I'm definitely not qualified to explain what he did and how he did it.  I just sit back in awe, make what I'm tasked to make, and just watch in awe as he makes it all work.

Edited July 21, 20241 yr by GoranM

3 hours ago, mjrhealth said:

Yep is so easy now. In fact I had a laptop that died so I put the disk into another one, it booted logged in and works fine. Try doing that with windows. Only laptop i have had issues with is lenovo. I would never recommend them to anyone. I use Linux mint Mate, seems the most reliable of that lot.

Interesting. I am running on a Pedator Helios 300 from 2020 right now and am gonna buy a new laptop towards November or so... I was actually considering Lenovo Legion. I'd love to know what your issue with Lenovo is as it will help me make a better decision. 

2 hours ago, BostonJeremy77 said:

Interesting. I am running on a Pedator Helios 300 from 2020 right now and am gonna buy a new laptop towards November or so... I was actually considering Lenovo Legion. I'd love to know what your issue with Lenovo is as it will help me make a better decision. 

It appears some lenovo laptops have issues with linux. Also dont like how you have to sign in to get updates etc never had much luch with them they underperform

13 hours ago, mSparks said:

installing linux is that straight forward.

put the setup onto a usb stick or CD, boot from it, follow the install instructions. 

I'm on fedora core:

https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/quick-docs/creating-and-using-a-live-installation-image/

if the installer sees a windows installation it will add a boot menu when you start up to choose whether to boot to linux or windows - afaik they all do this.

But my recommendation (what we were talking about in that link) is to physically unplug the windows hard drive and do everything on a new blank one, that way you can try multiple different versions of linux and get a feel for what you want without touching your windows install. There is a lot of choice and different design priorities, choosing which linux is a lot like choosing what colour to paint your bedroom walls.

OK thanks for that info!

For me, the choice is clear: I switch to XP12 when I'm in the mood for adventure. MSFS is pleasing, safe, and dependable, while XP12 is unpredictable, risky, and almost psychedelic—just like having an affair.

13 hours ago, mjrhealth said:

Only laptop i have had issues with is lenovo. I would never recommend them to anyone.

Have one at work and find it quite good. The keyboards may not be as indestructible as they were 15-20 years ago, but at least they do not have those disgusting soft touch caps whose prints rub off after a year.

 

10 hours ago, GoranM said:

I'm not going to pretend I understand what Saso is doing as far as code goes.  The man is a programming mastermind, and he does things I thought were impossible.  Example:  I asked if he could code a camera view inside the cabin of the de-ice truck to make it look like a 1st person view.  Not even thinking it was possible.  Less than 24 hours later, he had it done.

Come on, that was literally just leveraging a bog standard XP SDK function: https://developer.x-plane.com/sdk/XPLMCamera/

2 hours ago, Bjoern said:

Have one at work and find it quite good. The keyboards may not be as indestructible as they were 15-20 years ago, but at least they do not have those disgusting soft touch caps whose prints rub off after a year.

 

Come on, that was literally just leveraging a bog standard XP SDK function: https://developer.x-plane.com/sdk/XPLMCamera/

I know of the camera functions. Getting them to work in a de ice truck is something else. I’m not that code savvy. 

15 hours ago, blingthinger said:

Not at all. You're blind to what creates the tribalism. Go back to your sim session. You'll surely feel safer there. Less "blinded", apparently.

 

HA! Obviously not. Marketing efforts quite literally tout it as part of the savior of the simming world and the blind tribe parrots it blindly. The reality is that it's a joke.

 

Streaming ortho/photogrammetry is what did that. What's more, I don't see LR frantically clamoring to implement their own CFD out of panic of being 'turned on an ear'. They don't need to and that's the point here. PMDG called asobo's CFD a "buzzword". That's exactly what it is.

 

Booo. Go back to your sim session. That's not what what I said at all. Real/useful CFD doesn't run real-time. Well, not that can be taken seriously as far as rigid airframes are concerned.

 

Or perhaps I was 100% supporting your current preference du jour.

LoLz - whatever, my salty dude!  🤣

14 hours ago, BostonJeremy77 said:

Interesting. I am running on a Pedator Helios 300 from 2020 right now and am gonna buy a new laptop towards November or so... I was actually considering Lenovo Legion. I'd love to know what your issue with Lenovo is as it will help me make a better decision. 

Lenovo is kinda like Dell. Their business grade stuff is good, their consumer-grade stuff is..."consumer" grade.