1 hour ago, salasnet said:

No mods. Completely vanilla.

The most frustrating thing, however, is that because everything is locked down, streamed and encrypted, I can't even get to the files to tweak the airplane to correct some of these things. I really hope that us being able to have access to default aircraft offline like in 2020 gets taken care of sooner rather than later.

In that case, copy the 2020 Caravan over to the new 2024 "Official 2020" folder.  It should load instead of the streamed 2024 version.

1 hour ago, Bert Pieke said:

In that case, copy the 2020 Caravan over to the new 2024 "Official 2020" folder.  It should load instead of the streamed 2024 version.

Yup. Going to the 2020 version is where I think I am going to end up in the end.

I was hoping that the 2024 Caravan would be a "go to" airplane, especially with its Amphibian version, and the new 2024 model and texturing is fantastic, but it is simply not pleasant to fly. Its almost the same as the situation with the DA-40. Both of these planes were BETTER in 2020 than in 2024.

I am fully committed to 2024, as I think it is immeasurably better than 2020 in every way, but it is disheartening to have these planes that I was looking forward to using having to be hangared and needing to revert to versions from 2020.

1 hour ago, Bert Pieke said:

In that case, copy the 2020 Caravan over to the new 2024 "Official 2020" folder.  It should load instead of the streamed 2024 version.

Good tip, I wonder if that'd fix the VR COCKPIT FOCUS issues 🤔 guess that might be part of the cameras.cfg file, I'll keep it in mind for when I reinstall MSFS24 (whenever that'll be!)

2 hours ago, Rimshot said:

What is there to correct when others have stated not to have any issues like yours?

While I do not discount the fact that others may not have my exact experience, I think it is a bit too broad of a stroke to say that because a couple of folks have not encountered the same issues as I have, that there is nothing to fix. Perhaps they are more tolerant of these inaccuracies, or perhaps there is something about their setup that they have done to lessen the issues.

In any case, there are plenty of reports of AP problems and general problems with the Caravan in the official forums (I did not even test the AP yet, I just did a hand-flown pattern at the airport I always use for testing aircraft performance and feel). For example, here is somebody remarking on the exact issue that I mentioned in my original post (bolding is mine to show this was the exact thing I encountered):

 

Quote

Still, after over 9 weeks, the left aileron is deflected unevenly with the right aileron. This happens upon loading in cold and dark with no peripheral input whatsoever. I have a feeling just this would explain the constant roll to the right and severe instability in autopilot. Aileron trim helps very little. But as you can see in the picture it’s not the trim tab that is unevenly deflected. It’s the aileron itself. Dissapointing seeing this fix being pushed to SU2 which at this point is likely months away.

Source: https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/msfs2024-cessna-208-b-grand-caravan-ex/664503/264?u=salasnet

 

1 hour ago, Bert Pieke said:

In that case, copy the 2020 Caravan over to the new 2024 "Official 2020" folder.  It should load instead of the streamed 2024 version.

Did this and currently flying towards KLKP on autopilot. No wing waving and the takeoff was spot on. Yep, this is more like it, thanks Bert!  

 

1 hour ago, salasnet said:

Perhaps they are more tolerant of these inaccuracies

Some of the "inaccuracies" you mentioned are how the real plane works. You mentioned it starts moving with idle throttle... from what I've read, many turboprops will happily taxi at idle throttle, and pilots in the real-world switch between beta and idle to keep the taxi speed in check.

A caravan absolutely flies like a 172.  It's simple, it's slow, it's stable, it's designed to be "my first commercial airplane" for low-time, inexperienced pilots.  It could not be easier to operate. 

I've never liked any version of the caravan that I've tried in any sim, because they all seem to try to make the airplane something it isn't.  It's not a massively great performing aircraft (when carrying an average load), it's not fast, it's not challenging to operate.  It is, in fact, really boring.  That's exactly what it was intended to be.  

If it's work to fly in the sim, then it's all wrong.  Which I guess isn't surprising for a default plane.  Didn't Black Square do one for 2020?  I feel like I've heard good things about that one; I haven't tried it.

11 minutes ago, Stearmandriver said:

A caravan absolutely flies like a 172.  It's simple, it's slow, it's stable, it's designed to be "my first commercial airplane" for low-time, inexperienced pilots.  It could not be easier to operate. 

Exactly. This is what I have always heard about Caravans. I was hoping that the 2024 Caravan would be comparable to the 2024 default 172 (which I have no complaints about... perhaps the best default plane).

17 minutes ago, Stearmandriver said:

A caravan absolutely flies like a 172.  It's simple, it's slow, it's stable, it's designed to be "my first commercial airplane" for low-time, inexperienced pilots.  It could not be easier to operate

The biggest challenge for low time pilots is not to cook the engine at start up!

Right... As I read the original post, I saw all the symptoms that my 208B was showing. Not going into the frustration factor here, but let me try and give you some information that I had to acquire bit by bit, before getting the plane somewhat flyable in calm weather. I absolutely do not fly 208B in bad weather. I'm probably not using the rudder and ailerons right during cross wind landings, but i'm not a real pilot either, and I am not at that level yet. So there's not much I can say there.

First and foremost. This is a constant speed turbo prop airplane. VERY different from 172 if that's what you learned on. Watch some 10-20 minute propeller theory YouTube videos if you want to get deep into it, but for now, it's about the BLUE lever, next to your BLACK throttle. At take off - set to max. I keep it at max during climb. In cruise I bring is back to 1700-1750 PROP RPM. Look at your MFD (right display), top left corner, third acrh from the top. You will see the prop rpm indicated right under it.

Now after I said all that, remember that when REDUCING, throttle (black lever) goes down first, and then you can reduce prop rpm. I don't know if that really matters in the game. Maybe affects engine wear if done improperly, but I doubt it. Unlike 172, the engine indicator here is torque or TRQ. That would be the top arch on the MFD. I don't remember the exact climb numbers because I don't max it out 100% to avoid torque and ITT going in the red. All your arches must be green.

Anyway, that's a crash course on the constant speed. If you do want to stick with a 208, YouTube is your friend.

Next is the red lever. Yet again, unlike in 172, this is not MIXTURE. I think it's called engine condition. There is LOW IDLE (middle position), HIGH IDLE (top position), and CUTOFF (lower position). It should be obvious that you should avoid cutoff in flight. I can't explain the theory or need for it, but know this. The only time you set it to low idle is for ground operations. Putting it in high idle will result in what was describe - plane wants to go baby. So as you're taxiing and don't want to keep pushing the breaks, set it to low. Don't forget to change it to high before takeoff, although it will still do it at low. 

I got into all that because the plane kept running out of fuel when I just started. Didn't seem right. So now I fly it at 1400 trq and about 1700 prop rpm and that hasn't failed yet. In fact, I started calculating my fuel and not filling up the tank completely. Your indicated speed (i think) should be 127-130kt. 

That's all i got so far for engine operation.

 

Flaps. Those things generate massive lift, so yes, expect to push on the stick as you extend them. The upside to this, is that you can practically drop the plane to the runway. Full flaps, idle throttle about 70kt and you can go down at as much as 1000fps. Watch the speed though. I like to touch down at 65-ish, so don't expect it to land smoothly at 1000fps :). So if you're flying in Indonesia and want to avoid mountains, it's pretty handy. Have you seen the size of those things? They are 2/3 of the wing and are almost as deep. So I am not sure if that's actually a "bug". 

Trim is the only thing that is different for me. I don't see huge response, quite the opposite.

Breaking and turning is indeed a nightmare, but you can make it better.

Turns are less of a problem - just be patient and don't speed. I have tipped the plane over and failed missions, so I just submitted to it.

 

As far as breaking goes there is what's called a BETA mode on your throttle. It is like a propeller "reverse thrust". Do not engage it in flight, only to break and... back the plane up, if necessary. Yea, that blew my mind. So, after you touch down, do not hit the breaks, engage beta and just steer the plane to a full stop if you want. You really don't have to push the breaks even on not so long runways. I only do when taxiing and parking, not on the runway.

 

So beta. how do we get to it? Go to the settings, controls, select your throttle device, power management, throttle. Then look for THROTTLE 1 DECREASE. If your throttle has a detent at the bottom of the throttle axis, then you're golden - bind the setting to that control and enjoy better breaking. In my case it's the Warthog, so I have to lift the throttle lever and pull it farther back. This is nice, because it prevents me from going to beta accidentally.

 

Now, I don't know how other devices operate. So if you don't have a detent on your throttle, then bind INCREASE to one button (keyboard?) and DECREASE to the other. I am only guessing here, but seems to make sense.

 

So there's my 5 cents. I probably would have lost patience, but because of how limited career mode is, because cargo missions are currently most lucrative, and because I didn't fall in love with PC12, I had to learn this plane. It's far from perfect still, but at least I don't want to break my screen anymore. Now I'm bouncing from A to S rep, so doing ok. Hopefully this will help a little. 

On 2/3/2025 at 6:40 PM, Bert Pieke said:

In that case, copy the 2020 Caravan over to the new 2024 "Official 2020" folder.  It should load instead of the streamed 2024 version.

Would someone kindly care to elaborate on how to ‘import’ the msfs2020 Caravan in to msfs2024 please…?

7 hours ago, cptBadinoff said:

Right... As I read the original post, I saw all the symptoms that my 208B was showing. Not going into the frustration factor here, but let me try and give you some information that I had to acquire bit by bit, before getting the plane somewhat flyable in calm weather. I absolutely do not fly 208B in bad weather. I'm probably not using the rudder and ailerons right during cross wind landings, but i'm not a real pilot either, and I am not at that level yet. So there's not much I can say there.

First and foremost. This is a constant speed turbo prop airplane. VERY different from 172 if that's what you learned on. Watch some 10-20 minute propeller theory YouTube videos if you want to get deep into it, but for now, it's about the BLUE lever, next to your BLACK throttle. At take off - set to max. I keep it at max during climb. In cruise I bring is back to 1700-1750 PROP RPM. Look at your MFD (right display), top left corner, third acrh from the top. You will see the prop rpm indicated right under it.

Now after I said all that, remember that when REDUCING, throttle (black lever) goes down first, and then you can reduce prop rpm. I don't know if that really matters in the game. Maybe affects engine wear if done improperly, but I doubt it. Unlike 172, the engine indicator here is torque or TRQ. That would be the top arch on the MFD. I don't remember the exact climb numbers because I don't max it out 100% to avoid torque and ITT going in the red. All your arches must be green.

Anyway, that's a crash course on the constant speed. If you do want to stick with a 208, YouTube is your friend.

Next is the red lever. Yet again, unlike in 172, this is not MIXTURE. I think it's called engine condition. There is LOW IDLE (middle position), HIGH IDLE (top position), and CUTOFF (lower position). It should be obvious that you should avoid cutoff in flight. I can't explain the theory or need for it, but know this. The only time you set it to low idle is for ground operations. Putting it in high idle will result in what was describe - plane wants to go baby. So as you're taxiing and don't want to keep pushing the breaks, set it to low. Don't forget to change it to high before takeoff, although it will still do it at low. 

I got into all that because the plane kept running out of fuel when I just started. Didn't seem right. So now I fly it at 1400 trq and about 1700 prop rpm and that hasn't failed yet. In fact, I started calculating my fuel and not filling up the tank completely. Your indicated speed (i think) should be 127-130kt. 

That's all i got so far for engine operation.

 

Flaps. Those things generate massive lift, so yes, expect to push on the stick as you extend them. The upside to this, is that you can practically drop the plane to the runway. Full flaps, idle throttle about 70kt and you can go down at as much as 1000fps. Watch the speed though. I like to touch down at 65-ish, so don't expect it to land smoothly at 1000fps :). So if you're flying in Indonesia and want to avoid mountains, it's pretty handy. Have you seen the size of those things? They are 2/3 of the wing and are almost as deep. So I am not sure if that's actually a "bug". 

Trim is the only thing that is different for me. I don't see huge response, quite the opposite.

Breaking and turning is indeed a nightmare, but you can make it better.

Turns are less of a problem - just be patient and don't speed. I have tipped the plane over and failed missions, so I just submitted to it.

 

As far as breaking goes there is what's called a BETA mode on your throttle. It is like a propeller "reverse thrust". Do not engage it in flight, only to break and... back the plane up, if necessary. Yea, that blew my mind. So, after you touch down, do not hit the breaks, engage beta and just steer the plane to a full stop if you want. You really don't have to push the breaks even on not so long runways. I only do when taxiing and parking, not on the runway.

 

So beta. how do we get to it? Go to the settings, controls, select your throttle device, power management, throttle. Then look for THROTTLE 1 DECREASE. If your throttle has a detent at the bottom of the throttle axis, then you're golden - bind the setting to that control and enjoy better breaking. In my case it's the Warthog, so I have to lift the throttle lever and pull it farther back. This is nice, because it prevents me from going to beta accidentally.

 

Now, I don't know how other devices operate. So if you don't have a detent on your throttle, then bind INCREASE to one button (keyboard?) and DECREASE to the other. I am only guessing here, but seems to make sense.

 

So there's my 5 cents. I probably would have lost patience, but because of how limited career mode is, because cargo missions are currently most lucrative, and because I didn't fall in love with PC12, I had to learn this plane. It's far from perfect still, but at least I don't want to break my screen anymore. Now I'm bouncing from A to S rep, so doing ok. Hopefully this will help a little. 

Amazing comment! Thanks for taking the time to write this down. MUCH appreciated. 

15 minutes ago, Rusty10 said:

Would someone kindly care to elaborate on how to ‘import’ the msfs2020 Caravan in to msfs2024 please…?

If you still have 2020 installed, find the Caravan folder in the Official/OneStore folder of the sim.

Copy it to the 2024 "Official2020/OneStore" folder.

Many thanks Bert.

 

Struggling to find the 2024 "Official2020/OneStore" folder (using Steam)?

DO you know if the clockwork MOD by JusFlight works with the FS 2024 Caravan?