2 hours ago, SayAgain said:

So how do you execute/compile WASM DLL without a WASM runtime?  I’ll disagree with you here.

Thanks for the correction that MSFS executable doesn’t run on top of WASM, so apologize for the confusion.  

Do ALL the aircraft that come with various versions of MSFS not use WASM modules?  My understanding is that some do require WASM modules and hence will not work without MSFS internal WASM runtime.

It is not a “WASM” DLL. AFAIK, it is a standard C++ DLL (once it is created), that runs using MSVC “runtimes” that are a native part of Windows itself, not part of MSFS.

The MSFS executable contains a built-in compiler that translates WASM byte code to native C++ DLL format the first time an aircraft containing WASM code is loaded.

The WASM compiler built into MSFS is probably derived from MS Visual Studio, which is the standard programming environment used to create almost all Windows software 

In older sims like FSX or Prepar3D that are not “sandboxed”, developers would create C++ DLLs themselves using Microsoft Visual Studio, and distribute them with their released product.

In MSFS 2020/2024 developers are not allowed to include precompiled DLLs. They use MS Visual Studio to create the WASM byte code, and MSFS itself does the final DLL compilation step.

Once those DLLs are created, the WASM compiler is not required on subsequent loads of the aircraft, unless the aircraft itself is updated by the developer, or the MSFS executable is updated by Asobo. All existing WASM aircraft will have their DLLs recompiled whenever a new SU version is released.

As Matt said, MSFS itself does not run under WASM. It is a native C++ application like almost all Windows software.

Most of the default MSFS aircraft do not use WASM at all. They are coded in JavaScript/HTML. JS/ HTML is an interpreted language that is compiled to native code “on the fly” each and every time it is run.

Edited September 26, 2025Sep 26 by JRBarrett

20 minutes ago, JRBarrett said:

As Matt said, MSFS itself does not run under WASM.

As I indicate earlier, my mistake in wording/construct.  But the WASM compiler or whatever MSFS want to call the final step to DLL create is integrated into MSFS.

But you bring up a very good point counter to my understanding.  This implementation is not fully sandboxed.  

However, the more relevant issue you’ve both brought to my attention is there will be 3 distinct code branches for each platform … so unlikely to be 95% code re-use.  This is both interesting and a bit concerning from a cost/maintenance perspective. 

Edited September 26, 2025Sep 26 by SayAgain

1 hour ago, usernamerequired said:

Great news but lets get the sim working properly on Xbox and PC before jumping to another console. 

Just think how much there is to learn.

dd

21 hours ago, SayAgain said:

So how do you execute/compile WASM DLL without a WASM runtime?  I’ll disagree with you here.

A runtime is something that "runs in time", i.e. something that interprets the WASM intermediate language instructions directly and executes those in sequence in real-time. That is not at all what happens in the sim. It ships with an AOT WASM to native DLL compiler, not a runtime.

WASM runtimes are like what are present in your web browser; they don't compile the code (well, it's slightly more subtle than that as they may do little bits of compilation called JIT at runtime, but they don't do full ahead-of-time, or AOT compilation), they interpret the WASM IL in real-time, like the .Net runtime or like the Node V8 JS runtime.

18 hours ago, SayAgain said:

However, the more relevant issue you’ve both brought to my attention is there will be 3 distinct code branches for each platform … so unlikely to be 95% code re-use.

No, there are not three distinct code branches. As has been confirmed on a few dev Q&As, the codebase is the same for everything. There are compiler flags that switch between the small amount of platform specific code to produce a platform specific build.

54 minutes ago, MattNischan said:

No, there are not three distinct code branches. As has been confirmed on a few dev Q&As, the codebase is the same for everything. There are compiler flags that switch between the small amount of platform specific code to produce a platform specific build.

@MattNischan thanks for the insights.. Given the sim codebase is C++, assuming for the PS5 a platform specific example would be to use Sony's API (AGC?) for interacting with the graphics hardware while using DirectX for PC and XBox? Do you know (or able to divulge) if the current SU4 (or SU3) sim codebase is also being used for the PS5?
 

Edited September 27, 2025Sep 27 by lwt1971

17 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

Do you know (or able to divulge) if the current SU4 (or SU3) sim codebase is also being used for the PS5?

Sorry, I can't really comment on anything PS5 specific.

2 hours ago, MattNischan said:

No, there are not three distinct code branches. As has been confirmed on a few dev Q&As, the codebase is the same for everything. There are compiler flags that switch between the small amount of platform specific code to produce a platform specific build.

Thanks for verifying this! I had thought it's the same codebase too, for the XBox and PC versions of MSFS.

1 hour ago, lwt1971 said:

@MattNischan thanks for the insights.. Given the sim codebase is C++, assuming for the PS5 a platform specific example would be to use Sony's API (AGC?) for interacting with the graphics hardware while using DirectX for PC and XBox? Do you know (or able to divulge) if the current SU4 (or SU3) sim codebase is also being used for the PS5?
 

Since Matt Nischan can't comment on the details of PS5, I'm going to guess that the code base is probably mostly the same, except for the graphics rendering and the functions dedicated to multi-threading.  I'm sure what the MSFS team does for PS5 is similar to what they do for XBox, in that they have specific routines focusing on optimizing for the XBox architecture and hardware (XBox VRAM and RAM are shared) , and specific routines focusing on optimizing for PC architecture and hardware.  So the MSFS team probably has specific routines focusing on optimizing for PS5 architecture and hardware.  I would guess there is a whole layer dedicated to this.  And then above this layer, there is probably a layer that is common to PC, XBox, and PS5, and the rest of the MSFS code is shared between all platforms.  That would be my best guess.

I am also going to guess that PS5 has some menu settings locked or unavailable, just like the XBox version of MSFS. The PC version of MSFS is the one that has access to all the menu settings.

Edited September 27, 2025Sep 27 by abrams_tank

13 hours ago, MattNischan said:

the codebase is the same for everything

Excellent, thanks Matt.

I'm looking forward to the PS5 version, if nothing else but for the VR possibility. VR on the PS5 is actually usable, unlike my experience with the PC which has been an uneven mess with Meta and HP VR headsets. I even tried the PS5 VR2 headset on my PC and it wasn't much better. VR will never be mainstream until someone can sell a high performance, high resolution, light weight, wireless headset for under $200 US. Sadly, flat panel screens are here to stay for now.

8 hours ago, jabloomf1230 said:

VR will never be mainstream until someone can sell a high performance, high resolution, light weight, wireless headset for under $200 US.

To put in perspective, a high performance GPU ranges from £800-£2000 and yet PC gaming is still considered mainstream. You're asking for *A LOT* at an unreasonable price. The Quest 3 barely makes a profit even with the economies of scales that facebook/meta can take advantage of. Price isn't really the problem, there's bigger issues like motion sickness, isolationism (I can't use multiple screens and have things like discord/navigraph etc open) and lack of AAA titles to make it mainstream.

VR gaming is simply a different style of gaming, it doesn't replace flat panel gaming and in order for it to be mainstream, we need more developers taking an interest in it. A lot of credit can be given to Meta for put loads of money into making AAA titles for VR. Steam really put VR on the map with HL: Alyx

11 hours ago, jabloomf1230 said:

VR will never be mainstream until someone can sell a high performance, high resolution, light weight, wireless headset for under $200 US. 

...and it doesn't look like you're wearing Scuba diving gear either...

11 hours ago, jabloomf1230 said:

VR will never be mainstream until someone can sell a high performance, high resolution, light weight, wireless headset for under $200 US

There's nothing realistic about this expectation in 2025....🤪

3 hours ago, blueshark747 said:

There's nothing realistic about this expectation in 2025....🤪

Or probably ever. That why it won't be mainstream.

3 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

...and it doesn't look like you're wearing Scuba diving gear either...

I actually do snorkel and scuba dive. My masks weigh very little in the water.