28 minutes ago, Cognita said:

Let them build additional content or introduced paid features but leave the base sim for a while.

I’m of the opinion that a LOT of the changes made to v2024 were exactly that - laying a more scalable foundation for future versions.

If you really look into the driving factors for each one (from a developers viewpoint), it’s fairly clear IMHO.

Now, how much will that pay off for mitigating pain in 2028 remains to be seen.

Further, I’d also wager a lot of the pain in re addon performance and delays is really about how well each developer hews to Asobo “Best Practices” vs sticking to their own or just winging it as they go.

E.g., IMHO quite a bit of the reason the 777 was a free upgrade vs the 737 paid is an exemplar.

Edited July 4Jul 4 by UrgentSiesta

It will be done alphabetically.

In the past: No, Virginia, there will not be a separate MSFS 2024 forum.

Next: No, Washington, there will not be a separate MSFS 2028 forum.

And then: No, West Virginia, there will not be a separate MSFS 2032 forum.

39 minutes ago, Cognita said:

That may be so in which case and it can then join a long list of products that were technical better than other available options but failed in the market: Betamax, Laserdisc, NeXTStep, Nokia N8 (over early Google Android), and many more.

Markets do not generally reward technical superiority because that is not what they value most, They consistently value convenience and price much more than technical ability; they value alignment and ecosystem over technical specifications; compatibility over innovation; simplicity over engineering sophistication; demonstrated corporate commitment over product quality. This I think is all well known and there are solid, reasonable reasons for each of these.

I am not sure that x-plane wants to be popular, but if it did it has certainly taken the wrong approach to getting there. I tried it a long time ago and encountered a very confusing user interface that seemed to be designed for an engineer. After a few days I just uninstalled it -- the market values simplicity and ease of use over engineering sophistication. I am sure x-plane has come a long way since then is likely no much more user friendly, but at that time that is why it lost my interest. But its language and tone do not seem aimed at mass audience; its ecosystem is still relatively small, even if all the products for it are excellent, it's corporate presence is small compared to Microsoft and these things make a difference. To be clear I am not saying Laminar wants to be popular and large nor do I think they should want to; I agree they are doing excellent work and have in many areas a technically stronger product and in the end that will benefit us all.

Extremely well said.

My (somewhat) contrasting view is that nothings changed vis a vis MSFS and XP in the last 20 years.

Folks still say XP has one foot in the grave, and LR keeps proving them wrong.

Meanwhile, MS has been extremely fickle for much of that time (tho I do believe their long term commitment to the current bloodline is far stronger than ever).

As an avid user of both sims, I find XP’s base UI to be more intuitive. OTOH, there’s significantly less being presented, too (e.g., no MP, no flight planning, no native EFB/charts, etc).

And to be clear, I don’t even find MSFS’ UI objectionable, even if obviously optimized for Console.

XP is a great sim, even if one only uses it as a backup.

I'm just happy Microsoft finally got off their butts and reclaimed the Flight Sim throne from those annoying nickle and dime license per whole version number Lockheed Martin/P3D developers. MSFS2020 has been the biggest technical evolution in Flight Sim history and 2024 shall continue to carry the torch! What a great time to be alive in this hobby!

1 minute ago, blueshark747 said:

I'm just happy Microsoft finally got off their butts and reclaimed the Flight Sim throne from those annoying nickle and dime license per whole version number Lockheed Martin/P3D developers. MSFS2020 has been the biggest technical evolution in Flight Sim history and 2024 shall continue to carry the torch! What a great time to be alive in this hobby!

Um, WUT…?

Charging us for a new major version every few years is exactly what MS are doing today.

Same thing with XP.

Um I think expecting a 2030 release is not realistic. We have to remember that 2024 has effectively been frozen in time for over a year, where major feature implementation is concerned. SU6 is the first update they've presented where main objective is new features, instead of bug fixes. They have a lot of ground to cover to continue to make the sim appealing and take up revenue from the marketplace. We also have to keep in mind that Jorg said that the next release would first go through open beta testing for at least a year first. I don't see that happening in 2027.

7 minutes ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Extremely well said.

My (somewhat) contrasting view is that nothings changed vis a vis MSFS and XP in the last 20 years.

Folks still say XP has one foot in the grave, and LR keeps proving them wrong.

Meanwhile, MS has been extremely fickle for much of that time (tho I do believe their long term commitment to the current bloodline is far stronger than ever).

As an avid user of both sims, I find XP’s base UI to be more intuitive. OTOH, there’s significantly less being presented, too (e.g., no MP, no flight planning, no native EFB/charts, etc).

And to be clear, I don’t even find MSFS’ UI objectionable, even if obviously optimized for Console.

XP is a great sim, even if one only uses it as a backup.

Fickle only means that it is hard to do things right within (important) the time alloted. 😩

dd

1 minute ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Um, WUT…?

Charging us for a new major version every few years is exactly what MS are doing today.

Same thing with XP.

Come on now, we've received MSFS2020 v2.0 four years later, with tons of improvements.

No one forced you to buy 2024, and 2020 still receives updates and support till this day.

Not even the same in comparison!

Edited July 4Jul 4 by blueshark747

3 minutes ago, Sky_Pilot071 said:

Fickle only means that it is hard to do things right within (important) the time alloted. 😩

dd

If joking, okay.

But if not, no: MS have been definitively fickle.

3 minutes ago, blueshark747 said:

Come on now, we've received MSFS2020 v2.0 four years later, with tons of improvements.

Ha ha - well said. 😁

In truth, slapping a year number on a product release is psychologically effective.

Just like the (somewhat maddening) practice of pricing things at $x.99

And if you think about it, Windows itself is much the same under the covers.🤙

Edited July 4Jul 4 by UrgentSiesta

35 minutes ago, UrgentSiesta said:

If joking, okay.

But if not, no: MS have been definitively fickle.

Something we said in the 80's

dd

I'd be shocked if anything comes out in 2028 or anything close to that. Hardware prices are exploding and seem to be going nowhere but up. Nobody is going to be able to upgrade to need a new sim anytime soon. Next gen consoles are very likely going to be delayed at least a couple of years.

It just wouldn't make sense commercially. It took years for 2024 to replace 2020, and that's before hardware prices went crazy. I'm afraid to see what a new PC in 2028 would cost. I can run 2024 nearly maxed out, and there's zero reason to move off that anytime soon.

Unless something drastically changes with the hardware market, I just don't see it. I'm guessing next gen consoles get delayed for many years too.

Even if they do push something? So what? 2020 is still supported and no end of life date announced. Even if there's a 2028, it won't impact me one bit.

Thank you everyone for your votes!

Obviously the vast majority think FS2024 will start to die in 2028 when the next sim is released.

A good proportion of you give it a 2 years's delay until 2034.

And 5% (including me) think (or hope) it will stay until 2034 and beyond.

MSFS AI will be the next one 😉

I feel like the main question here is, what will the next one look like? What technology changes will allows for the next level of experience? Today its the AI-everywhere trend, I've played some games this year that have incorporated it well (RPG games using AI Chatbots for NPCs) and some not so well (AI-generated translations that lack native context). I suspect the next iteration of MSFS will draw on AI for career mode, mission generation, air-traffic. We already see it with the AI-driven ATC mods.

I also fully expect the next MSFS to have a monthly subscription. I wont enjoy that, but I do expect it.

I'm reminded of the jump from Half-Life to Half-Life 2 on the source engine back in the day, and how monumental that technological leap was - physics based engines, HDR lighting for the first time really blew everything before that out of the water. Source engine became the new standard. What will the new standard be for Flight Sim? I would have guessed VR if you had asked me that question back when I tried the Quest 3 for the first time after having put up with the cables and base towers on the Oculus Rift for many years prior. I was blown away by passthrough and hand tracking.

So where do we go from here?