I think all serious simmers would get something from ACI. Seeing one small error, or a series of small errors multiply into a chain of events that leads to disaster and great loss of life, should be ingrained in the minds of all pilots who are tempted to breeze through a checklist.

...I had let the plane drift too far to the right of the runway because I got badly behind in my inputs, ...

So why didn't you go around?

 

So why didn't you go around?

 

Not disciplined enough yet to get over the pride that I had enough moxy to recover the situation, rather than making the embarassing, though prudent choice to abort the landing :(

 

Actually, to be more specific about the situation, I was only slightly off center right at 500 and was in the process of what I thought was an easy correction, but I had followed a KLM 747 on approach and it had rolled off the runway only a few seconds before Things got squirrely before I touched wheels on runway... It seemed at that time that I got a few strange roll "jolts" that I thought were some anomaly with my CH Products control setup, but now I "think" they might have been wake turbulents modelled by AS2012? I'd never felt wake turbulence modelling in AS2012 before (haven't been using it that long) so I'm not positive...

 

The thing is the situation became iffy much faster and more violently then I was used to on a flight (KLAX to KSFO) that I was very used to going a certain way... My first instinct was to get the plane down and settled, rather than safely back into the air, so I guess the simple answer to your question is "pride" :( It's why I felt that "twinge" of something when after the landing, as I was listening to the passengers simulated deplaning, I heard the little boys voice. It was a twinge of guilt that that bit of sim forced me to realize it wasn't right to push that bad situation as far as I did.

 

I think with more hours I'll be able to unlearn that. It's still pretty overwhelming a lot of times at this point in my learning curve...

Smithsonian Channel has taken over 'Air Disasters', the new series started last night. MD80 crash on takeoff, no flaps set and breaker for takeoff config warning pulled.... even pros screw up :-(

The thing is the situation became iffy much faster and more violently then I was used to on a flight (KLAX to KSFO) that I was very used to going a certain way... My first instinct was to get the plane down and settled, rather than safely back into the air, so I guess the simple answer to your question is "pride" :( It's why I felt that "twinge" of something when after the landing, as I was listening to the passengers simulated deplaning, I heard the little boys voice. It was a twinge of guilt that that bit of sim forced me to realize it wasn't right to push that bad situation as far as I did.

 

I wish more people would admit this and cudos to you for having the guts to say it. :good:

 

I think there's a fair amount of pride in pilots, even simulator pilots and leads them to sometimes not share information. I have been humbled by aircraft and situations many times...I find flying itself to be a humbling experience...you learn your limits. Sometimes, it's being sufficiently distracted by seemingly small things that cascades into getting behind. Other times, lack of knowledge bites you. For myself, I'd rather be humbled by people than by an airplane. I wish their was more sharing of the 'art' and I hope we can help each other with understanding...remembering that it's possible to be immensely skilled without learning something basic and that an airplane is always capable of biting even the most skilled pilot.

Not disciplined enough yet...

Good answer!

A very sad and disturbing disaster.

 

However, I am left wondering a few things:-.

 

The Cabin Attendant was a Commercial Pilot.

He had access to portbale oxygen.

He saw, after 12 minutes, passengers passing out, and plane still climbing.

He had the code to enter the cockpit.

Why did he wait so long to enter the Cabin, after determining that the cabin Crew were unresponsive.

As a Commercial Pilot, he must have been aware of the effects of lack of oxygen at high altitudes.

 

So why did he not enter the cabin and decend the plane himself.

Why was he incapable of changing Radio, even to 121.50 ?

 

Also, why did the cockpit crew not recognize the effect of lack of oxygen, and put on their Cockpit masks. ?

 

While missing the setiing of the Presurization switch may have caused the start of the issues, it is regretable, that with so many possible solutions, (especially the flight crew being a commercial pilot), that there was not a better outcome.

Good answer!

 

Because you're such an expert?

 

Pfft.

 

Ashley Frew.

While missing the setiing of the Presurization switch may have caused the start of the issues, it is regretable, that with so many possible solutions, (especially the flight crew being a commercial pilot), that there was not a better outcome.

 

I thought about that too. To me, the the reason we ask that is because they crashed. I wonder how many times this has happened where someone did respond in a timely way. We don't hear about all those incidents because they were worked out. That's a bit disturbing as well.

Good answer!

 

While not outwardly appearing like the most inspirational interjection, I'm going to assume it was meant to be encouraging, and just appeared to be denegrating because of the weakness inherent in internet conversations regarding body language and expression :)

While not outwardly appearing like the most inspirational interjection, I'm going to assume it was meant to be encouraging, and just appeared to be denegrating because of the weakness inherent in internet conversations regarding body language and expression :)

So thats where the negativity was coming from... I had not considered my reply could be taken that way. Sorry!

 

I was complimenting the use of the word 'yet' in his answer, indicating that not only had he the courage to admit that 'pride' got in the way (which Gregg complimented him on) he also had the self awareness to do something about it.

Wow: I had the same alarm in my NGX becasue I never set the cabin press alt or left the packs OFF. oth would give the same alarm. As Isaw the video,I kept saying "descend" . The crew should have sought 10,000 ft with this type of warning. I just re-created this scenaro and got the same results. Scary how our NGX is so real and how much you could learn

For all those 'why didn't they' questions,

I recommend reading 'The Naked Pilot' by David Beaty.

 

Takeoff config can kill too.

http://en.wikipedia....APA_flight_3142

 

And Northwest 255 (just saw an Air Disaster or Air Crash Investigations episode on this)

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines_Flight_255

Not disciplined enough yet to get over the pride that I had enough moxy to recover the situation, rather than making the embarassing, though prudent choice to abort the landing

 

Most RW pilots never find go arounds embarrassing and those who do may pose a safety hazard to the public, plus many GA's occur for reasons that are not the pilot's fault.