LOL, Ken is a good guy but we all can only deal with so much crapola (mine included hehe). I suppose if we keep it civil and leave the personal BS at the door and deal with facts this thread might prove to be very helpful to those desiring to purchace either Araine of PMDG's Ng ;-), and I know what is CHEAPER...Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4][h3]P M D G's 747-400[/h3][h4]coming to a runway near you[/h4][/font color]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)AMD 64 3200+ | ASUS KV8 DELUXE | GFORCE 5700 ULTRA @535/1000 | Maxtor 6Y080M0 SATA 80 GIG | 512 DDR 400 | Windows Xp Pro | Windows Xp Pro 64 |

I started the thread on Icing and used one of my real world shots to add atmosphere and make a point.That point wasnt to have a visually iced screen but to emphasis the need to model icing and its effects on the airframe and the flying characteristics of an aircraft.I also added the picture to show the lack of fear/apprehension missing in our sims which plays such a big part real world.An iced screen could be brought up as an IFR trainer aid in the 1998 piper Seneca Five By Graham Waterfield but it was purely show ;-)http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/83316.jpg

>Their slogan-ish webpage is more>designed for selling overweight diet pills than an aircraft>for FS2004 if you ask me.:-lol :-hah :-hah :-lolMichael J.

I love how they make comparisons of their polygon count to PMDGs count :-lol Really shows how they are not at all a part of the FS community, IMO.

90 USD!!!! The crack must be expensive over there.

^ Oh, and at 18500, how high quality can a model AND VC be? I mean, honestly. Unless they're miracle makers, there must be some serious issues with the aircraft or the VC. I wonder, did they get their comparison numbers from the VC and Cabin version, or the actual VC one? I've come ot expect anything. How do you see the poly count of a model anyways? Wouldn't you have to decompile it?Daniel P.http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/ng_driver.jpgMember of SJU Photography. [A HREF=http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=9004]Click Here[/A] to view my aircraft photos at JetPhotos.Net!The official psychotic AA painter. :)

Randy:While you are not a "REAL pilot." I was. I flew for Continental Airlines for 6 years, employee number 67364 (in case you want to check it out)...got furloughed, then left. Based at IAH, then EWR then GSO (during peanuts fares) then back to EWR. I started out 727-200 second officer and then 737-300 first officer. No I've never flown the NG, however. Oh, and by the way, I am a CW2 (inactive reserves) in the US Army and flew UH-1 and UH-60's.And just in case that ain't good enough, my father was the FIRST black pilot for British Caledonian and then went on to British Airways and flew 707's then 747's.Randy, I know you are a staunch PMDG supporter, but don't take it too far, you don't know me. So let's leave it like that. I don't PLAY pilot on TV, I was one.Best regards,Mike T.

Randy:BTW, if you are referring to ME as a "newbie" you'd better Google my name. I reviewed for Avsim and that Avsim logo I designed when I was reviewing for them. I also have contributed countless freeware repaints AND the first 757-PIC mergeI've been in Iraq for a year...but if you really want to know who I am, ask Tom A. Don't believe just because a person doesn't post that there is some conspiracy. You've been wrong about quite a few things today.Best regards,Mike T.

Mats:In a word, the FMC in the PMDG is "better". I believe they are coming out with a more advanced version but feature for feature, I must tip my hat to PMDG.Regards,Mike T.

Mike T, ROFL...it sounds like you've just had a flashback on his person. Another Army Alumnist...hoooraaah. I could tell by the tone of your post. Hope to have you home soon :-)

Well Mike thanks for clearing that up. I want state a few things here sir, it was you who stated that the Araine was "better" in some areas of the Flight modelling and which you just stated you never have flown a NG ,so how would you know over what I would or any other sim flyer? I am not a mind reader and know who you are. Fact is that you would not know about the NG flight model unless if you have flown a 737, then I could respect what you stated. So I feel justified in asking what airline you flew for, no desrepect intended, I changed my Tag for this very reason as you noticed. I have not made COMMENT upon Araine's flight model and when I talk about the PMDG's NG flight modelling, it's now based in part on NG pilots that I know personally and what they have stated. Another thing that interested me in your post was the total lack of AFDS related items? Certainly as a RW pilot you would assume us users would be interested in such features? Upon these items I certainly claim knowledge and can comment upon. Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4][h3]P M D G's 747-400[/h3][h4]coming to a runway near you[/h4][/font color]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)AMD 64 3200+ | ASUS KV8 DELUXE | GFORCE 5700 ULTRA @535/1000 | Maxtor 6Y080M0 SATA 80 GIG | 512 DDR 400 | Windows Xp Pro | Windows Xp Pro 64 |

Randy:I respectfully disagree with your comment: "Yeah it would have been really nice to have but only the uninformed armchair sim pilot who never set foot on the real NG flight deck would claim that it is so important as YOU imply." That statement is WOEFULLY uninformed!Without the IRS there IS NO NAVIGATION on the NG! The IRS alignment is vital to all systems on the MFDs and for automated flight. On a real NG, turn off the IRS and watch the MFDs go blank. On a real NG, turn off the IRS and try to input a flight plan in the FMC. On a real NG, turn off the IRS in flight and try to use the VNAV or LNAV or navigate using the MFDs. Whoops no mo' magenta lines, no more flight director, no more much of anything except for the back up gauges.From a cold / dark cockpit, one of the first things one does after "battery switch on" is spin up the IRS before you can even go on to inputting your flight plan!!! :-rollYes, PMDG worked around that but to discount the IRS slaved systems as unimportant indeed is the statement of an "unimformed armchair pilot" :-)Best regards,Mike T.

I'll chime in and say this; with a package like the one offered from PMDG which gives you the 737-600/700/800/900 with all the bells and whistles in one package, Ariane is crazy to charge $90+ dollars for one incomplete model. Randy Smith made a good point on this earlier. It would be foolish to buy Ariane

Mr. T doesn't have ANY fake accounts. My email address is [email protected] my name is MICHAEL TOUSSAINT. Email me if you need blood type, social security number, mother's maiden name, etc. :-)Further questions, direct them to Tom Allensworth or do a search on Google for my Avsim reviews.Jeeze, a man drops of the scene for two years and all of a sudden I'm Peter Tishma! :-lol Come on guys, this is supposed to be FUN, but don't jump on a guy that you are not familiar with, because I've EARNED my stripes in the flight sim community...Regards, Mike T.

Mike:But do you actually manually enter the coordinates on an NG? As far as I know (kind of NG-challenged, sorry), the INS on the NG is aligned through the FMC. And if that is the case, it renders a fully functional IRS kind of useless unless you want to go old school.EDIT: Wow, you're Mike Toussaint? I remember you alright! You were doing an AA 757 at the same time I was doing mine (my first paint)! :-p And that was a loooooong time ago on the EFG 757 model.Daniel P.http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/ng_driver.jpgMember of SJU Photography. [A HREF=http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=9004]Click Here[/A] to view my aircraft photos at JetPhotos.Net!The official psychotic AA painter. :)