When this thread started and strong, differing opinions were beginning to be stated, the moderators were notified that it was, or might become, a problem, Chase and I looked at the potential and decided to let our members express what they feel, and yes, even to let the huge pink elephant in the room (guns) be addressed. We each stated alternative ways from differing perspectives to look at some issues surrounding the tragedy.

 

Please notice, this is not just a Connecticut, or even an American event. Like 911, and other traumatic catastrophes, this load is being borne on all our backs, as evidenced by the pain being felt worldwide as so eloquently expressed in this thread. So, not everyone sees a gut wrenching introspective dissection about all aspects of the surrounding society as political partisanship but a normal, and healthy part of trying to adjust to a most emotionally painful reality.

 

Freely expressing our shock, horror and internal philosophical conflicts it induces is good, to a point, but great care should be taken to not deliberately push emotionally charged buttons that will predictably cause others to act defensively. This is no time to settle scores between nations or to make stump speeches about the shortcomings of the United States, a nation which is deeply wounded enough as it is. Instead let's try to process this in such a way as it will be beneficial to the ultimate outcome to the societies we live together in.

 

My feelings and thoughts are summed up in this sentence: I am sorry for the terrible loss that the victim families are going through, and I hope that the death of their loved ones will help us all to better safeguard our loved ones as best we are able.

 

Kind regards,

When this thread started and strong, differing opinions were beginning to be stated, the moderators were notified that it was, or might become, a problem, Chase and I looked at the potential and decided to let our members express what they feel, and yes, even to let the huge pink elephant in the room (guns) be addressed. We each stated alternative ways from differing perspectives to look at some issues surrounding the tragedy.

 

 

Thank you Chase and Stephen for leaving this thread open a little longer. :drinks: It feels good to discuss this tragedy with fellow simmers from around the world.

I don't have an agenda. Ill answers people's silliness. The fact that people want to inject politics into tragedy boggles my mind and I think it's disgusting. There plenty of time for that now isn't it. But hey whatever floats your boat.

 

 

Hi Randy,

 

A few remarks if I may :

 

1- Terrible tragedy. Unbelievably sad.

 

2- For some people (probably including the NRA in this case), it seems that it is never the right time to discuss a problem. That is the best way I know to make sure problems are not addressed and never solved.

 

3- Regarding the US constitution and its amendments : most citizens are proud of their constitution. For example, we in France never tire of telling the whole world how good we are in the field of democracy (and many others, of course...)

 

.... but many forget that one of the leading - and oldest - democracies in the world - the UK - has NO CONSTITUTION AT ALL and manage very well, thank you.

 

Food for thought?

 

Best regards,

 

Bruno

A different and interesting point of view on the matter:

 

"If you don't want to propagate more mass murders, don't start the story with sirens blaring, don't have photographs of the killer, don't make this 24/7 coverage. Do everything you can, not to make the body count to lead the story, not to make the killer some kind of "anti-hero". Do localise the story to the affected community and make it as boring as possible in every other "market". Because every time we have intense saturation coverage of a mass murder, we expect to see one or two more within a week." [Dr. Park Dietz, forensic Psychiatrist]

 

The above picture are the children that went to heaven this week, new Christmas Angels watching over us Rest and Play in Peace!

This thread was started as a mark of sympath to the victims of yesterdays incident. It's not the best environment to discuss the wider issue but perhaps the fact that many in Europe have had to defend themselves and as a result today do not support gun ownership as some of you do in the States is worthy of some deliberation over there? It's a debate for you as Americans. Perhaps you need to ask why when people here have faced real threats they've shunned gun ownership? There will be plenty of support for the right to bear arms over there but you must understand that the idea is not going to get support this side of the pond. That's pretty well demonstrated in the posts here. Further more I'd point out that we're aware that not all Americans think differently to ourselves.

 

Geoff

 

Geoff, The problem is not the tool used. There is less per-capita gun crime in the UK than the US, but then there's a knife attack every four minutes in your country--more than 130,000 a year--and five fatal knifings a week in England and Wales alone. We had a meth addict recently sentenced to death for killing five people and destroying more than 1,000 homes in California. His weapon of choice--a single road flare. 22 young children were slashed by a single knife-wielding attacker in China just last week. Six were knifed to death on Britain's Jersey Island in a mass knife slaying. 10 were slashed and 7 killed in a mass knife slaying in Japan's Akihabara district. 168 were killed in Oklahoma City by a bomb made of common farm chemicals. In Norway, where there are supposedly "tough" firearms regulations, one man killed 77 and injured 320 people using the same sort of fuel & fertilizer bomb as used in Oklahoma City and one of those "well regulated" firearms. Over 3,000 were killed in New York on 9/11 because nobody on any of those planes had anything to trump...a box cutter.

 

A psychotic person can commit mass murder with a can of gas, a propane bottle, farm chemicals, knives, poisons, and even a little-league baseball bat. Focus on the weapon used misses the real problem completely. We have a reprehensibly violent culture, one that I attribute to the widespread decline of common decency and morality and the resultant collapse of the family here. If I could wish that away I would not need to be armed. But I can't wish it away, and I will not lay down my arms and surrender to it.

 

But one thing I know for certain...the idea that anyone can be protected from a violent attack in a violent society by a police officer that is not physically present when the attack actually occurs is an illusion...no, a lie. I have to take responsibility for the safety of me and mine wherever we are, for I know that when seconds count, the police are usually minutes away. I wish that there had been armed, responsible people at or very near that school. What happpened in Newtown and in Chenpeng sickens me just as Andrea Yates taking her five children one-by-one into the bathtub to drown them sickens me. The Newtown gun, the Chenpeng knife, and Andrea Yate's hands are not the evil that we face.

The Newtown gun, the Chenpeng knife, and Andrea Yate's hands are not the evil that we face.

 

Excellent post Bob, summed up in a very succinct and poignant way.

Was thinking this morning how long will it be before we in the US have to resort to the same security measures they use in Israel to prevent their enemies from carrying out such horrible attacks to prevent our own carrying out the same horrible attacks...

 

Metal detectors and ARMED security TRAINED to use their weapons to prevent things like this at every building entrance... Their training also came in very handy at LAX if I remember correctly. I am used to it at a lot of buildings around lower Manhattan, doesn't phase me to see a guy standing there in full gear with a semi-automatic...

Excellent post Bob, summed up in a very succinct and poignant way.

 

+1

 

I agree, Excellent post.

 

We have a reprehensibly violent culture, one that I attribute to the widespread decline of common decency and morality and the resultant collapse of the family here.

 

I feel this way as well. It used to be it took a village to raise a kid, not just the parents.

 

Edit: I didn't realize Hillary Clinton wrote a book about that (I just googled it) but that way of life still does exist, particularly in the South Pacific. I have neighbours that are Samoan and Maori and they still practice that approach very much.

I feel this way as well. It used to be it took a village to raise a kid, not just the parents.

Excellent point, I see it with the kids I work with, much less sense of duty to their communities and to those around them then we had back in my day... I mean even with my own kids which I would have thought I raised (still raising) pretty well, I would have expected a bit more from them for the likes of volunteering and helping out others. They seem to be able to create plenty of time to play playstation, flightsim or on their iPods, but when the time comes to go clean the street outside, or to visit elderly neighbours etc, they seem to have every reason that they can't.

 

Wonder what we can do to change this...

 

Regards,

Ró.

This was not just an American family tragedy:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20745431

That man is living every father's worst nightmare...

I note that some news stations have taken to showing the pictures and names of the victims. Of course it makes me sad, especially now for the families and the unbelievable pain they must be undergoing.

 

What annoys me is that the media also feels the need to play sad music along with the images and names. It's a media thing, and it feels manipulative This is not a movie, and real life doesn't require a soundtrack to give us cues on how to feel.

 

Does tragedy really need a choreographer?