I've been flight simming for a while, not really "to the max", like some people are (I'm still working on learning navigation, etc). Normally I just like to fly around but I want a plane that provides some good simulation and doesn't really require me to read a five-hundred page manual to enjoy the aircraft. While manuals are good, I'd much prefer just having a tutorial and being able to fly. The incredibly detailed manual thing just isn't for me.. yet.

 

That said, I've been looking at the J41 because it looks a bit easier to learn and operate than say the NGX, but still having a good level of simulation in it. Would it be a good aircraft to learn how to really get into the game, and is it easy to learn and use?

 

 

Thanks in advance.

I have both.  It's easier but it's got challenges of it's own.  You really have to respect the condition levers, overspeed and heat.  Also, start locks can be a pill, it climbs slowish up high on hot days when its heavy but never wants to give up airspeed.  All great fun to manage.  On the positive side, the FMS/MCP is simpler to manage and checklists are shorter.  Both fly well by hand.  If you don't have any experience with turbines and want to get a great 'step up' airplane, get the RealAir Turbine Duke and learn to manage speed and turbines in it.  It's cheap but an amazingly well done airplane.

I own both, and I would say the JS41 is more difficult.

No auto throttle, no managed descents, a very different FMC then you're probably used to, lots of things must be done manually.

 

They both have challenges as was previously said but I think the Jetstream needs more attention and awareness to keep it operating efficiently.

The NGX is a little more automated.

I have both.  It's easier but it's got challenges of it's own.  You really have to respect the condition levers, overspeed and heat.  Also, start locks can be a pill, it climbs slowish up high on hot days when its heavy but never wants to give up airspeed.  All great fun to manage.  On the positive side, the FMS/MCP is simpler to manage and checklists are shorter.  Both fly well by hand.  If you don't have any experience with turbines and want to get a great 'step up' airplane, get the RealAir Turbine Duke and learn to manage speed and turbines in it.  It's cheap but an amazingly well done airplane.

 

I actually own both the Dukes. Great aircraft. I think I'll take your advice and learn some more from it before considering moving up.

 

 

I own both, and I would say the JS41 is more difficult. No auto throttle, no managed descents, a very different FMC then you're probably used to, lots of things must be done manually. They both have challenges as was previously said but I think the Jetstream needs more attention and awareness to keep it operating efficiently. The NGX is a little more automated.

 

 

The less automation is actually a positive for me. I'd much rather be flying than letting the autopilot have all the fun. How different is the FMC?

If you want to learn, turboprops are the hardest path walk through. As said above, the J41 is much less automated than the NGX and requires much more attention and awareness. The engines have very strict limitations and it's quite easy to set them on fire. The NGX is much more forgiving and easy to fly than the J41.

 

As Gregg pointed out, if you're really interested in turboprops, the RealAir Turbine Duke is an excellent airplane. Great to learn the turbos.

 

 

The less automation is actually a positive for me. I'd much rather be flying than letting the autopilot have all the fun. How different is the FMC?

 

The workload is pretty high, speacially since you're flying alone. You eventually learn how to manage everything after a few flights. The FMS in the J41 is quite simplistic (or less sophisticated) if compared to the NGX's, but it takes some getting used to. It doesn't follow a very logical sequence like the in the jets, where in the first page you have POS INIT, then a direct link to you flight plan, then your weights and finally takeoff data. On the J41 there's no such link to other pages and you have to learn how to navigate through it to get preflight done.

The J41 requires specific techniques you must learn and follow or it will be incredibly frustrating. The workload is high initially but as you get used to operating the J41 it becomes much less of a burden. It then becomes very rewarding. The NGX has two excellent tutorials which mean you don't have to study the manuals in detail. The NGX really isn't hard to get into. It's actually quite a simple aircraft for a modern airliner. The FMC is more logical in the NGX than the J41.

Get the MD-11, more automated than the NGX, and it is up there with NGX and J41 in terms of quality.

As an aircraft mechanic who's had a run/taxi certification on the JS 41, I can say that PMDG's comes very close to the look and feel of the real thing. The examples I worked on had no FMS installed so its not needed unless you want to utilize it. If you're still learning navigation, I would get down to the fundamentals of navigation, like tuning and flying from VOR to VOR .

Get the MD-11, more automated than the NGX, and it is up there with NGX and J41 in terms of quality.

The MD-11 is quite a handfull for a simmer not wanting to get too involved with manuals and is IMHO quite a bit more challenging than even the NGX. All of PMDG's offerings are top notch though.

True, so with that in mind I would advice OP to fly the default planes. I have a good number of hours in NGX, J41 and the MD, I actually find the MD the easiest

True, so with that in mind I would advice OP to fly the default planes. I have a good number of hours in NGX, J41 and the MD, I actually find the MD the easiest

Sounds like he's fairly new to simming based on his original post. Just think its important to have some basic navigation techniques down before embarking on FMS programing in a long haul aircraft. Can't go wrong with any PMDG product though.

If you do decide to get the JS41 or NGX some people find it easier to learn with the help of FS2Crew. Having a copilot helping you can lessen the workload.

 

Also I agree with the others to a degree about learning something else first, but on the other hand you've got to jump in at some point. When I was in FS9 I taught myself how to fly the LDS 767, my first complex aircraft,I started understanding the systems more and more in depth instead of just blindly pushing the buttons I was told too. The thing about the Boeings is once you know one they're basically all the same (the 737, 47, 57/67 and 777 anyways). After I learned the intricacies of the 67 no other plane really gave me problems,because Airbus, Boeing, Embraer,MD doesn't matter commercial jets are all fundamentally the same once you get used to it. Sure there's lots of differences in philosophies and cockpit technologies but on the basic jet aircraft level they are the same. The avionics is what you'll have to relearn every time but that too gets waaay easier with practice.

 

The JS41 is different though, turboprops are. But you'll be able to fly other turboprops well too

 

My point being, if you already fly the turbo duke well why not give the JS41 a try, there will be lots to learn but there won't be many planes you can't fly after it. And have a look at FS2Crew it's really recommended.

 

 

Lee

 

The workload is pretty high, speacially since you're flying alone.

 

If you get FS2Crew for the j41, the workload isn't that bad, and I find it easy to fly when not having to do all the checklist by myself. Im not a very advanced simmer but having FS2Crew helped me alot to get this bird up in the sky. To the OP, just get it, not that hard to learn how to fly just remember to remove the start locks before takeoff(the start locks had me puzzled for a while).

If you get FS2Crew for the j41, the workload isn't that bad, and I find it easy to fly when not having to do all the checklist by myself. Im not a very advanced simmer but having FS2Crew helped me alot to get this bird up in the sky. To the OP, just get it, not that hard to learn how to fly just remember to remove the start locks before takeoff(the start locks had me puzzled for a while).

Absolutely agree. JS41+FS2Crew (Voice) is the way to go. Also recently FS2Crew got a major update to v2.1

After more than 1,5y break from the JS41 I started recently flying again with this bird and love every second of it.

Go ahead...

One thing I wish FS2Crew had put into this latest release (since PMDG has indicated that it won't do anything further) is have the copilot warn 3-4 knots before overspeed instead of right at overspeed. 

The J41 is without a doubt a lot harder than the NGX, for two reasons:
1) Much less automation and higher workload

2) Almost everything is different to what sim pilots have used previously (the engines, the FMS, the air conditioning etc) and it's not very forgiving.

 

Having said that, I prefer the J41 and find the NGX somewhat boring because it does so much for you! The J41 has just enough automation to let one man fly the aircraft, so you're always busy and it's very rewarding to fly. To be frank, I get a smug sense of superiority from flying it, knowing that most sim pilots can't fly it!

 

Some folks here have recommended FS2Crew voice, and whilst it is an excellent and labour saving product, I would recommend you learn to fly the aircraft on your own first. The J41 has an excellent tutorial included and flying it will really assist you in understanding the systems.

 

As regards the FMS being difficult, I will have to disagree with my peers here; the Honeywell GNS-XLS is one of the most logical and intuitive I have used. I think the perceived difficulty comes from it working differently to the Airbus/Boeing norm. Having said that, it also does a lot less than those fully fledged units, e.g. you get a basic advisory VNAV that calculates a simple ToD and a required VS, and it doesn't push that information through to the EFIS.