Hi guys,

 

I recently bought the 737NGX and am simply thrilled by the reality level. I will start a B738 TR in real life this summer and use the PMDG 737 to prepare. 

 

There's one thing though that puzzles me: when I trim, the trimwheels make about 2 full revolutions before any trim sound is heard. (in other words the trim sound has a delay of about 2 seconds) This is annoying when you make small trim adjustments and you don't know whether the plane is trimming or not.

 

I hope this is not a "feature", at least I couldn't find anything related by searching this forum / Google.

I checked the following:

- Sound card is set in the CDU Options menu ( I hear all other PMDG sounds OK)

- Sound file is OK, no gap at the beginning

 

Can anyone shed light on this issue ?

 

Cheers,

Bob

 

Same here, and i agree, its offputting when trying to trim..

I find the same thing.  Until you get used to it you can overtrim.  I go by the feel of the yoke and whether it feels neutral.

 

Rob

Agreed, it makes it more difficult. If I hear the noise I have usually overtrimmed.

I find the same thing here.  No answer? Nobody?

If I'm not mistaken this question has been answered some time ago by Ryan, who stated that the sound cue delay is an inherent shortcoming in FSX that cannot be resolved by PMDG.

I searched the forum for this post, the only thing I found from Ryan is that fact the the trim wheels are rotating much slower than in real life is apparently an FSX issue ... not the sound.

Weird though that I'm the first one (?) to "complain" about this, I rely on hearing the trim in real life as well as in the sim.

First of all, congratulations on your news that you'll be starting a type rating. 

 

To the issue, if you fly in the VC with a wide viewpoint, or with a TrackIR, (Such as myself)  you can see the trim wheels moving before sounds are heard. That's how I get around this issue. 

The trim wheels move a hell of alot faster in the real thing. Must just be an FSX limitation. Quite off putting at first but you get used to it after a while.

For a system that's meant to neutralize control pressures, why are you relying on sound feedback for trim?

 

Press button.  Feel change in pressure (or see that your joystick pressure is not as required).  Decide if it is good enough.  If not, repeat.

 

I don't recall listening for trim in any aircraft I've flown.

Have to say i always rely on the "feel" of the controls lightening or heavying to get an idea for the trim, not the sound. You can also get an idea from looking out the front windshield for nose up/down movement.

For a system that's meant to neutralize control pressures, why are you relying on sound feedback for trim?

 

Press button. Feel change in pressure (or see that your joystick pressure is not as required). Decide if it is good enough. If not, repeat.

 

I don't recall listening for trim in any aircraft I've flown.

 

exactly!!!!! The problem is that people get so caught up on what "should" happen that they forget to fly the airplane in the manner it was meant to be flown in. It's interesting how many bad habits are developed by playing flightsim.

 

To the fellow who is going for his type, you should know this better than anyone, you trim for airspeed and to relieve control pressures. Not for sound. In the erj-145. If you would keep trimming until you heard a sound, you would overtrim every time and then get a TRIM TRIM TRIM warning.

 

 

For a system that's meant to neutralize control pressures, why are you relying on sound feedback for trim?

I can tell you why I don't know about FFB sticks, but with a normal controller there is no way to sense a change in control pressure with trim, one has to coordinate the relaxing of pressure (as opposed to being able to sense) with the change in trim which I still find a bit tricky with NGX as we are sometimes talking of a couple of mms of stick travel and the trim is unrealistically over sensitive most of the time. The Saitek yoke for me for example has no feel at all and I often wonder if any trim was applied at all!

 

Also the sound is handy to know that the sim has actually recognized the button press. Subjectively I find this useful in the real aircraft too, especially on initial climb during flap retraction as the trim speed changes (reduces with flaps up) and this is defiantly an input to deciding how long to hold the trim.

 

FWIW, I used to have a Cirrus Saab Yoke years ago in the days of gameport controllers (called something different back then). That was an awesome controller and such things were much easier.

I agree.  Without force feedback controls trimming isn't that easy, you have to wait for the sim to respond visually.  An aural cue that the trim is moving is therefore helpful, a delayed noise quite off-putting.  The NGX's manual trim sound isn't that realistic either.  Come to think of it I've not heard any FSX sim that catches that sound right.

 

 

with a normal controller there is no way to sense a change in control pressure with trim, one has to coordinate the relaxing of pressure (as opposed to being able to sense)

 

Exactly ! Although I cannot fully explain it, hearing the trim has been helpful to counteract the lack of real feel of the yoke.

 

 

Let's put it this way: 

When I fly a C152 and have to give a certain input to the elevator, I "know" by experience roughly how many times I have to turn the trim wheel by hand, if it's several times when extending the flaps or just a slight amount when correcting for speed changes for example.

If you fly a real B737 (or a full flight sim in my case), you will notice that the trim wheels don't make an even zzzzzzz sound but have a certain "rhythm" which you can translate into wheel revolutions by listening. 

Holding the trim switches for 2.453 seconds doesn't give you the same feedback as hearing the wheels go around x times.

 

I don't claim this is the only good way to trim, but if it works well and fast for me (and other people apparently as well), it's definitely not wrong  ^_^