Sometimes I should just flip a coin about whether I agree with you on certain things or not, Dillon.  You've gone from the world's biggest critic of FSX to the world's biggest advocate of P3D.  I think the salient point is that P3Dv2 is a continuation of the FSX legacy, and there are still some legacy issues, plus some new issues that people want to see addressed before moving over to the dark side.  Personally, I am REALLY tired of FSX, so I'm totally in your camp there, but on the other hand, P3Dv2 does not appear this no-tweaking, maintanence free, stable paradise that you make it sound, and the people that are staying put for the time being seem to have some pretty valid points.  There is a middle ground you know to say "I'm definitely upgrading, but just not today."

 

 

I actually agree with you here.  I see a huge future with P3D is LM stays the course.  What turned me to this new direction is the embracing LM has for this community and the impressive fixes they have done with code we all thought was a lost cause.  Another thing I hear is some of the Aces members are now at LM.  

 

By all means wait and watch, that's wise.  My points are to the people dismissing it as rehashed trash if favor of trash (no reference to FS9 intended   B) ).

Ed like we told you before with products over the years, you have to try it before you slam it. 

 

I don't slam anything. I just have a different approach to you.

 

I choose what aircraft I like to fly and THEN the best sim to fly it in. Flight simulation is the name of the game.

 

I have noticed more and more are concerned with what is out of the cockpit window. Not me….you have been in a LEVEL D sim before so you know that even FS9 has better graphics! lol

 

That is not to say I am poo-pooing those who are more concerned with what is out of the window …each to there own. Each and every one of us has different requirements. So it is plainly stupid for anyone to say one sim is better than t'other.

 

I'm flying an IL-96 right now and along with my IL-76, L-10, DC-10, B742, F-27, AN12 I could go on ….there are no better simulations of these aircraft on any other sim. :Peace:

 

My view on VFR flight (GA) is I would like a sim that enables me to fly google maps. :Nerd:

Dillon;

 

I dont dismiss it as trash, just wait and see. On the other hand, just look at the screens and vids.

All rambling about shadows, but nothing more. Where is the groundbreaking stuff ? Some already tune it down, because in the core its still FSX, and performance is bad. Especially for a P3D2 what came out in 2013. Imagine the new pilots, seeing this with them average computers ? They drop it like a brick. Same as for FSX. Sure, it runs smooth in a Cessna, but we are above that level.

 

Anyhow, we just like what we have. Whatever you advocate, as been with FSX, or now P3D.

Oh, I am not a student, just an amateur 'dreamer'. One who likes to pretend he is a pilot of a 747. Nothing more, nothing less.

So its out of the question for me.

Dillon;

 

I dont dismiss it as trash, just wait and see. On the other hand, just look at the screens and vids.

All rambling about shadows, but nothing more. Where is the groundbreaking stuff ? Some already tune it down, because in the core its still FSX, and performance is bad. Especially for a P3D2 what came out in 2013. Imagine the new pilots, seeing this with them average computers ? They drop it like a brick. Same as for FSX. Sure, it runs smooth in a Cessna, but we are above that level.

 

Anyhow, we just like what we have. Whatever you advocate, as been with FSX, or now P3D.

Oh, I am not a student, just an amateur 'dreamer'. One who likes to pretend he is a pilot of a 747. Nothing more, nothing less.

So its out of the question for me.

 

 

Great post.  I'm currently upgrading my CPU for my FS9 system (which was new 5 years after FSX's release that will not run FSX as well as FS9 not matter what I do):

 

Dell Duo Core 2.66 (upgrading to 3.33) 1333FSB - Windows 7 Pro 64Bit 4Gigs Ram

 

With a new video card with 4gigs of ram.  After this upgrade we'll see if write-off FSX hack.  I'm pretty certain it's not but we'll see (I will report back)...

I don't slam anything. I just have a different approach to you.

 

I choose what aircraft I like to fly and THEN the best sim to fly it in. Flight simulation is the name of the game.

 

I have noticed more and more are concerned with what is out of the cockpit window. Not me….you have been in a LEVEL D sim before so you know that even FS9 has better graphics! lol

 

That is not to say I am poo-pooing those who are more concerned with what is out of the window …each to there own. Each and every one of us has different requirements. So it is plainly stupid for anyone to say one sim is better than t'other.

 

I'm flying an IL-96 right now and along with my IL-76, L-10, DC-10, B742, F-27, AN12 I could go on ….there are no better simulations of these aircraft on any other sim. :Peace:

 

My view on VFR flight (GA) is I would like a sim that enables me to fly google maps. :Nerd:

 

 

Ed once I get this sim running on my system I will report back to you specifically.  I'm excited about LM because (now that you mention it) the goal is to market this as a real world training solution meaning software for major Level-D sims need apply.  This sim is meant to be used for training so it will have an updated FDE at it's core, it has to.  With what I can see with Flight, Aerofly FS, and X-Plane, P3D has to do better than that in the long run.  To me v2 is major code cleanup.  Having the FS community involved adds a level they can't get on their own but rest assured gamers are not the market for P3D like FS9/FSX was.  That's what's exciting.  I believe in another year you will see this.  As far as how you sim it may never be your thing as you are a 2D guy but outside that I could see you very much into it.  People are mentioning graphic updates now because that's in one's face right out the box, heck it's only been a week.  Here's what I expect later on seeing as LM has control over the code just like Aces did and it's a serious simulation effort:

 

 

1. Better ATC - I could see the default ATC engine getting overhauled with the likes of Radar Contact being apart of this effort

 

2. SID/STAR/Holding Patterns - If this is going to be marketed professionally they'll have to update this in a way Microsoft would have never done.  Again our add-on market could help here.

 

3. The weather engine receiving constant attention - With the likes of ActiveSky involved

 

4.  Major FDE attention - There is no way this sim is going to be taken serious by any training organization or Level-D simulation if this isn't updated over FS9/FSX.  

 

5.  LM openness has evolved - from not embracing what our add-on developers can do to getting as many developers involved as they can.  This shows a bright future for our hobby as well as making organizations like PMDG and Aerosoft more serious major players on the real world aviation training stage.  Lockheed Martin is a major real world contractor, aircraft builder, and military solution option in many areas.  They wouldn't have taken this on only to have their product function like an updated FSX hack.  People are looking at this effort like LM is the same team as the guys who developed FLY.

 

So Ed, you may be a convert in the next year.  My experience in Level-D simulators (and you are right many are currently behind FS9 let alone P3D) let's me know LM really has to knock this out the park if they want to corner the software market for real world trainers... 

People find a few glitches in new software that's been out for little under a week (which happens with every software rollout and you slam it) in favor a sim that took 5 years to get off the ground, amazing....

I'd love P3Dv2 to be The Answer...

But I am a very satisfied FS9.5'er.

Moving to P3D would require a solid hardware investment, not to mention a substantial further investment in addon software.

For 4 or 5 Grand, what would I be getting?

And what does the development future look like?

 

We've had 64-bit capability for some time, and this surely is the long-term basis for any new software.

Any 32-bit solution is a stopgap in my view: P3Dv2 still looks to me like yet another warmed-over patch for what originally was a buggy bunch of coding known as FSX. 

 

 

 

Interesting comments. Are you using fs9 or fsx?

 

FS9.5 answers all of my flightsimming needs.

What I am looking for is a truly revolutionary step, into the next generation of computing.

I'm not sure P3Dv2 is that step.

 

Like many, I'll watch from the sidelines for some considerable time.

It's a compounding tragedy, actually: As flightsimming was fractured by the release of FSX, so now the FS9 diehards will be joined by the FSX diehards.

 

I'm hoping an excellent 64-bit sim will convince everyone to start over, and behave as a community again. 

Now we are a week further down the road, just take a peek at it..

Its still has a long way to go.

 

As WingZ said: "But I am a very satisfied FS9.5'er"

 

Me too honestly, for tube flying that is of course.

I'm starting to get a chuckle because we're already now starting into the my framerates are bigger than your framerates style contests.  :lol: And we know there is always going to be someone coming along to one-up the other to show how cool they are, ad absurdum!

 

 

I'm hoping an excellent 64-bit sim will convince everyone to start over, and behave as a community again.

 

Take a very deep breath, you'll have to hold it for quite some time. :smile:

Very surprised you are not bored of FS9 or FSX. Its limitations are well known and there are things they cannot ever do. P3D V2 is the way forward. This morning I did a landing in Bilbao with my mid range computer with all settings on medium/high and it was just amazing. Smooth and fluid. It was raining and I turned on the wipers on my 757 Freenium and the wiper shadows on the cockpit window frame was amazing. Truly atmospheric. The volumetric fog adds so much to the immersion.

 

People here may snipe at P3D but for those that want more, its delivering in spades. I would have left Flight Sim if I was still stuck with FS9/FSX. Bored to death with its limitations. No new ground breaking add-ons with its limited API developer functionality. Boredom.

 

P.S its also why you are all talking about P3d. Nothing to talk about with FS9/FSX anymore...

 

Have a nice evening everyone.

Very surprised you are not bored of FS9 or FSX. Its limitations are well known and there are things they cannot ever do. P3D V2 is the way forward. This morning I did a landing in Bilbao with my mid range computer with all settings on medium/high and it was just amazing. Smooth and fluid. It was raining and I turned on the wipers on my 757 Freenium and the wiper shadows on the cockpit window frame was amazing. Truly atmospheric. The volumetric fog adds so much to the immersion.

 

People here may snipe at P3D but for those that want more, its delivering in spades. I would have left Flight Sim if I was still stuck with FS9/FSX. Bored to death with its limitations. No new ground breaking add-ons with its limited API developer functionality. Boredom.

 

P.S its also why you are all talking about P3d. Nothing to talk about with FS9/FSX anymore...

 

Have a nice evening everyone.

 

Oh, I'm VERY bored with FSX, believe me...

 

I don't understand the black and white thinking that sometimes abounds here, especially when something new is released.  One can believe that P3D is the way forward, but at the same time reject the outrageous "fanbwaah" hype and wait until the time is right for them to actually jump on board with P3D.  The things I didn't like about FSX was the amount of work it took to optimize, and the poor tradeoff of dollars spent on hardware upgrades compared to the performance gains achieved.  I'm definitely going to P3D, but maybe I just don't feel like spending 200 (p3d) + 700 (gtx780) + 300 (need faster memory) + ? (bigger SSD) + ? right this very second so that I can then wait several months for initial bugs to get worked out, and until such time as we see more P3D-optimized addons.   I made a joke aimed at N4Gix that "FSX is calling for a priest".  That doesn't mean it's actually dead.  And I absolutely don't agree that anyone who expresses some honest, critical observations about P3D from the sidelines is an enemy of P3D or a dead-ender forever opposed to moving forward, as some of you insist on categorizing it.  I don't like Groupthink, and I'm going to make smart decisions to enhance my own simulation experience, not to keep up with the Joneses or have the kind of simulation experience that somebody else thinks I should have. 

 

For 4 or 5 Grand, what would I be getting?

 

 

I can't imagine how you could spend that much on a FS rig. You could get a top of the line Intel/Nvidia rig for under $1500.

P3D, love it or hate, it's the direction that flightsim is heading. LM certainly has their hands full ironing out and improving MS code. Maybe a bigger challenge than the B-2 Stealth Bomber! :lol:   

 

 

Gone back to FS9, made it in FS9.5, and I am a happy 747 flyer for the time being

Good for you  ^_^  I unfortunately did not have much add-ons invested in FS9 but in FSX, so I am stuck.  Now P3D V2 is going to ask for even more money.  I also scaled back on FSX settings until I an happy and just leave it as that.  My future dollar goes to XPX (it's not too bad now with 10.25 and some new add-ons that are available, where the worst framerate that I ever had was 20).

 

Just curious, what is your settings in FSX that gave you FS9 performance before you move back?

 

Thanks

Ron Attwood, on 04 Dec 2013 - 6:05 PM, said:

Take a very deep breath, you'll have to hold it for quite some time. :smile:

 

Actually 'till Kingdom comes. There always have been vocal minorities in this hobby who have difficulties distinguishing flying a sim and going to a church   : THIS IS THE TRUE FAITH, BURN THE HERETICS  :lol:  !