A first glimpse at Prepar3d v2.3

[yorgosGK 7]

I think some issues are that P3D has a Vsync option interfering with NI...then we try to leave NI out of the equation and realize that AA is horrible in P3Dv2, then your back to square one. I still have not found the perfect settings, I am flying comfortably right now I guess but with some stutters and occasional frame drops.

 

Hope Rob and the gang can clarify some things here for us! I am no expert either on Vsync.

[Guest]

So again I don't expect to get to many simmers agreeing with me here. The previous MP4 demonstrated (at least on my system) that once v-sync is enabled and the display setting are dropped significantly to maintain 60fps on a 60hz screen that stutters are a none issue and virtually non-existent. So it follows that it should be possible to get the same experience with 30fps, Vsync enabled with a 30hz fresh rate. So many posts all over the forums stating that the human eye cannot tell the difference between 30FPS and 60FPS.  I beg to differ and here is my proof:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4aX5Q3-OT6kYlpJcnY5S0tRbjA/edit?usp=sharing

 

Again to see what's going on in this MP4 you have to download it.

You won't be able to tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps

in the streamed version:-)

 

For me the solution is further performance optimization and SLI/Crossfire support. If SLI doubles the FPS on given setting (I Doubt it will) that will be awesome and if not Hopefully 3-way SLI will. Problem solved:-)
 

[Juicehead 16]

So again I don't expect to get to many simmers agreeing with me here. The previous MP4 demonstrated (at least on my system) that once v-sync is enabled and the display setting are dropped significantly to maintain 60fps on a 60hz screen that stutters are a none issue and virtually non-existent. So it follows that it should be possible to get the same experience with 30fps, Vsync enabled with a 30hz fresh rate. So many posts all over the forums stating that the human eye cannot tell the difference between 30FPS and 60FPS.  I beg to differ and here is my proof:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4aX5Q3-OT6kYlpJcnY5S0tRbjA/edit?usp=sharing

 

Again to see what's going on in this MP4 you have to download it.

You won't be able to tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps

in the streamed version:-)

 

For me the solution is further performance optimization and SLI/Crossfire support. If SLI doubles the FPS on given setting (I Doubt it will) that will be awesome and if not Hopefully 3-way SLI will. Problem solved:-)

 

 

I am happy that more and more people are expressing interest in 60fps, there IS a major difference between the two!  Check out the links, especially the first one.

 

 

http://30vs60.com/

 

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/if-you-cant-tell-the-difference-between-30-and-60-fps-youre-lying-or-blind.452902287/

 

http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html

 

 

It is time we all quit accepting sub-par optimization/framerate!

[Matthijs 79]

As long as Prepar3D is based on ESP, it's impossible to get a stable 60Ffs in every situation and with different addons. I'm just realistic... B)

[Mickeyj 35]

Thanks Rob for your heads up in the beta testing and keeping us informed.

 

My suggestion to all P3D2 simmers out there is go out and enjoy the sim and follow the advices given by people knowing what they say. If one dont balance the system nor balancing the sliders in the sim nor staying away of not-really-P3D2-ready-but somehow-working-anyway- add ons P3D2 will not work as intended even the source of stutters can not be determined but will happen obviously.

 

While waiting that the "PC-Programming-Nerds" get v2.3 ready i as a real-world-airline-pilot-P3D2-simming-and-video-maker-nerd

i enjoy flying wether real or virtual ;)

 

greetz

 

a nerd

 

PS: Thanks to everybody giving constructive tips and infos!!!

[ChaoticBeauty 6,692]

For me the solution is further performance optimization and SLI/Crossfire support. If SLI doubles the FPS on given setting (I Doubt it will) that will be awesome and if not Hopefully 3-way SLI will. Problem solved:-)

 

It won't because with multiple GPUs you'll eventually become CPU-limited. I'm glad Lockheed Martin are working on optimising cloud shadows, but they need to optimise autogen further and thread out things like physics, AI and aircraft systems. Not saying it won't happen, but a task like this need lots of work and time. We're still far from what Prepar3D can do at its best, but it seems they're on the right path.  :smile:

[stryder011 2]

Goat Simulator is a mainstream game that was also released on Steam, of course that would have a higher priority. If we don't make some noise about the matter (and all of us have to participate), I don't think they will bother.

 

We should open up a new topic on the nvidia forums and post the link here. And everyone can respond to the topic and make it grow. If there are enough responses we might get there attention.

 

I would start it but my literally skills are questionable :) so best if someone else can volunteer. Lets keep the request as professional as possible and maybe each response can also mention the type of nvidia hardware that was invested in for P3D. Ex. "I bought the TITAN for P3D...."

[ChaoticBeauty 6,692]

We should open up a new topic on the nvidia forums and post the link here. And everyone can respond to the topic and make it grow. If there are enough responses we might get there attention.

 

I would start it but my literally skills are questionable :) so best if someone else can volunteer. Lets keep the request as professional as possible and maybe each response can also mention the type of nvidia hardware that was invested in for P3D. Ex. "I bought the TITAN for P3D...."

 

I agree. For anyone willing to start a thread, here's the link: https://forums.geforce.com/

[Guest]

I would run that by them on the LM forum first. It might be counter productive. Maybe Rob could ask them it they think it would be helpful if P3D user petitioned Nvidia for SLI support for P3D. Don't forget its not a video game. Its professional simulation training software!

[Guest]

The previous MP4 demonstrated (at least on my system) that once v-sync is enabled and the display setting are dropped significantly to maintain 60fps on a 60hz screen that stutters are a none issue and virtually non-existent.

 

Your previous video was not recorded at 60 fps, FYI.  This newer one is exactly 60 fps.  But you aren't really flying the simulator in this video - parked at an airport?  The terrain system is not putting any load on the CPU/GPU ... and since the terrain system is most likely the cause of delays in frame rendering you aren't really demonstrating the specific "stutters" I'm focused on.

 

Have you tried increasing your pan speed in you cameras.cfg (say 120 = PitchPanRate=120 HeadingPanRate=120 PanAcceleratorTime=0) -- change the PanAcceleratorTime if you want to see change is pan speed rather than constant -- I think you'll see similar results at 60 fps were you will NOT see stutters but you will seem "missing" frames (exactly like you did when locking to 30 fps) because 60 fps simply is not good enough to keep up with a very high pan speed.

 

I agree with you (and Ed) that VSync and matching fps is important to reduce stutters, but it's just one part of the puzzle, it's not the entire issue I'm trying to convey.  60 fps for 60Hz is sorta the hammer and sledge way.

 

Locked 30 fps in your video didn't "stutter", it simply just didn't produce as many frames, however the frames it did produce were very evenly distributed (going back to my original point about 1/60th to 60/60th) because your CPU/GPU in that scenario is capable of maintaining 60 fps and you've limited to 30 fps so the distribution of frames are very even (1 every 2/60th of a second).

 

What I'm focused on is the stutters caused by uneven distribution of frames being rendered in that 1 second of time duration.  You can see this demonstrated in my videos, you see "long frames" where it maybe able to produce 1 frame every 2/60th of a second but then it suddenly changes to 1 frame every 8/60th's of a second and then back to 4/60th ... that's the stutter I'm focused on.  The situation where a system might be able to maintain 36 fps, locks to 30 fps, HOWEVER, the frames are NOT being render 1 every 2/60th of second, they are being rendered unevenly.  

 

I don't have a goal of "absolute" fluidity as I know there is no hardware today (or within the next decade) that could render a frame every 1m (1 pixel) at 500 Kts at 500 AGL.  My goal is to see an even distribution of frames at a "locked fps" value.  There are some additional nVidia settings I can test out and will report back ... but all roads seem to go back to getting nVidia to provide a P3DV2.x specific profile.

 

Cheers, Rob.

 

 

Maybe Rob could ask them it they think it would be helpful if P3D user petitioned Nvidia for SLI support for P3D.

 

I believe LM would appreciate that, it certainly can't hurt.  

 

EDIT: perhaps if LM tossed in a few animated "Goats" in the sim we might be able to get higher priority :)

[Richard Sennett 2,499]

perhaps if LM tossed in a few animated "Goats" in the sim we might be able to get higher priority :)

 

:LMAO:

[Juicehead 16]

It won't because with multiple GPUs you'll eventually become CPU-limited. I'm glad Lockheed Martin are working on optimising cloud shadows, but they need to optimise autogen further and thread out things like physics, AI and aircraft systems. Not saying it won't happen, but a task like this need lots of work and time. We're still far from what Prepar3D can do at its best, but it seems they're on the right path.  :smile:

 

 

As P3D sits at present I agree.  They just need to move alot more over to the GPU like pretty much every other "game/sim" does these days.  As Rob had previously stated, it didn't matter whether he was overclocked or not, he only saw a 1fps difference.

[Richard Sennett 2,499]

As P3D sits at present I agree.  They just need to move alot more over to the GPU like pretty much every other "game/sim" does these days.  As Rob had previously stated, it didn't matter whether he was overclocked or not, he only saw a 1fps difference.

 

Well thats scary news 

[stryder011 2]

 

 

I believe LM would appreciate that, it certainly can't hurt.

 

 

looks like we have Rob's blessing. So any volunteers to start the petition.

https://forums.geforce.com/

[nicksort 8]

+1