The New Faster, Leaner Next Generation Flight Simulator SIM-Posium is Now Available for Your Input

[srborick 0]

 

 

We all see the world differently I guess. But there's no need to be rude and ageist.  Lighten up!  The flightsim community is, in reality composed of many different age groups, and in my opinion no simmer ever grows old as they are young at heart with the spirit of flight in their veins.

 

Boy is that calling the kettle black!

 

 

My personal view of all this is that Stephen, well intentioned though he is, is out of his depth.  He's a well meaning amateur on many levels who often disagrees with highly experienced devs and members..and it's got to the stage now where Stephen's frustration at getting nowhere is turning into bitterness which is expressing itself in shouting, blame and anger in many of his posts.

 

Let me dissect that comment....

 

first... I am out of my depth, I knew from the get go that I didn't have the talent nor the skills to add to the discussion of creating a flight simulator or running a business on any intelligent level. Thus the reason for calling upon the community and the experts within the community to join in the discussion and lend their expertise. You would have known that if you had taken the time to read even the 4 Articles on the SIM-Posium. Throughout the SIM-Posium and through the threads here at AVSIM I have made that distinction over and over again.

 

second... I have never disagreed with any of the statements made here on this thread or the previous thread. I have read them and encouraged the conversations regarding the aspects of creating a next generation flight simulator from any perspective... as a matter of fact I've PM a few of those whose insights clearly show their level of expertise to join in the discussion over at the SIM-Posium because we could really use that kind of direction and leadership. If anything, I have taken the time to clearly direct the attention away from accusations of who I am and my intention and tried to move the focus more towards the purpose of the NGFS SIM-Posium 

 

third... It's gotten to the stage where Stephen has needed to defend himself against the slanderous statements being made by people like yourself. If I am bitter, it has nothing to do with the success or failure of the SIM-Posium but rather the defamation of my character as an individual and a member of the flight simulator community. If you doubt that... go read some of your own posts and the posts of some others. If you do not clearly see the harm you are intentionally inflecting upon one individual, then you are both blind and pious.

 

fourth... shouting, blame, anger.... more like defending and taken offensive to some of the disrespect shown by you and others. Apparently AVSIM allows anyone to slander anyone that they would like without any consequences. The priggish attitudes shown by a few has diminished the purpose, the comradery that was once predominate within the flight simulator community.

 

It's appalling that there are those among us who are supposedly older, more mature, who can abandon all decency and respect towards others and then turn their so called pointing fingers away from themselves and cast the blame on the innocent.

 

Shame on you... and others like you.

 

Stephen B.

 

 

Perhaps Next Generation Flight Simulator SIM-Posium will bring its  unique viewpoint - i'd love to read what that will be?

 

Stop wondering and go read the 4 MUST READ ARTICLES over on the SIM-Posium... if you read anything at all over on the SIM-Posium read Then vs Now. You'll see what the SIM-Posium's unique viewpoint is.

[mgh 89]

 

 

Clear enough for you?

 

Perfectly clear.

[n4gix 4,947]

His intention is quite clear to me. His credential, maybe not so but that's not what i meant. Luke and some others made extremely good/excellent posts but some persons only criticized without adding something constructive to this topic 

His intentions are clear to me as well. He seeks to be a catalyst for creating a forward-thinking movement, not the principal actor in that movement. He has also stated numerous times that he would happily step aside and allow anyone more qualified to take charge.

 

What could possibly be more clear?

 

Interestingly enough, the June issue of AOPA PILOT has an article about Bruce Williams, who was the business development manager of Microsoft's Flight Simulator division. He is also a very passionate advocate of simulators as a great tool for learning a broad range of aviation skills. Also of interest, he is not a programmer himself, having majored in English Literature.

 

Perhaps Stephen could ask Bruce to take an interest. http://www.bruceair.com

[cmpbellsjc 2,963]

Stephen, I think people are just trying to point out that what you are trying to do will be next to impossible to start from scratch.

 

Yeah, it's a great idea in theory, and having your forum is a nice centralized place for people to shoot the poop about it and maybe even make some meaningful contributions to your effort, but trying to start a new Sim from the ground up in this fashion will probably be futile.

 

If I were you, I'd send out some correspondence to the existing big developers of FSX/P3D add-ons and invite them to the discussion.

 

Call on FlyTampa, Orbx, FSDT, Flightbeam, PMDG, Carenado, etc. Send them an email or letter, introduce yourself and tell them what you are trying to do. Maybe if you can get any of the big developers to partner with you, you'll achieve something. Besides us, the developers have a lot to gain by having a next gen Sim to develop for and customers to sell to.

 

But, just having this thread and your forum, and waiting for someone to just drop in and do something will probably not yield anything.

[TooWings 17]

Stephen, I think people are just trying to point out that what you are trying to do will be next to impossible to start from scratch.

 

Exactly.  But the trouble is that Stephen seems to take many of our comments personally and in turn often resorts to direct personal attacks on members (just read the last 4 or so of his comments).  And this attack on AVSIM members is also happening over at his Sim-Posium forum (link enclosed) >

 

..So I suggest this thread should be locked before it gets any further out of hand.

 

Sim-Posium - sample comments.....

 

"I looked at this forum and followed the reaction at AVsim and I have to say it would have been less painfull watching Stephen get run over by a bus than the AVsim reaction...  the flight sim community eh

 

 "communicating with AVsim is like mud wrestling a pig.... sooner or later you're going to come to realise that the pig likes it"

 

...You might think it's debate but it's not, it's diversion, you're being diverted from the fact that as you engage these negative people you're losing momentum..."

 

"...Engaging them, just means that the ones you actually want to communicate with, stay over there instead of coming here.    Simply put you can't build momentum here by engaging in debate over there (AVSIM)... "

(end quotes)

 

http://nexgenflightsim.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=46

 

.

[srborick 0]

Jim... pointing out that what I'm trying to do will be next to impossible... has never been the issue with me, but... when individuals are allowed to conjure up any abusive accusations that they can think of and defame who I am as a person... is beyond reproach and should never have been allowed to happen.

 

Behavior and Your Actions: AVSIM’s goal is to provide an educational and entertainment resource for people with similar interests and a community that is fun to be part of by users from around the world. Your acts and words on AVSIM will not, in any way, infringe upon others enjoyment of the AVSIM site. Any acts of bigotry, profanity, or disregard for what is reasonably considered to be social “norms” will result in suspension or banning entirely.

 

 Freedom Of Speech: AVSIM is not a democracy, and there is no such thing as "Freedom of Speech" in our forums. If you believe that you are entitled to that freedom without restriction and that you should be able to do and say as you please, then reconsider... Please do NOT register.

 

As far as calling upon big developers to partner with... I doubt that they would rally around the cause unless the flight simulator community showed a genuine interest in moving forward towards a new and improved flight simulator and away from their current bread & butter. I did send out a few invitations, but those who received them didn't even take the time to respond back.

 

Let me reiterate... The NGFS SIM-Posium never had anything to do with me or the successful creation of a flight simulator from which I would profit. It had everything to do with the flight simulation community working together towards a common goal and moving the progression of flight simulation forward.

 

If we could all put the bias and the negativity ( the expression of criticism of or pessimism about something )  aside, we really could work towards achieving a community driven flight simulator. 

 

As I've stated before, it's a matter of numbers... the number of folks working together to achieve what others are not willing to do.

 

If the community is satisfied with what they have and the direction that flight simulation is going, which is the continuous use of old technologies... so be it. But.... if we as a community really do want to see the progression of flight simulation go forward, not only for us but for generations to come... then together we could make it happen.

 

"...waiting for someone to just drop in..." was always the goal... it just appears that not many folks want to do that.

 

Stephen B.

Exactly.  But the trouble is that Stephen seems to take many of our comments personally and in turn often resorts to direct personal attacks on members (just read the last 4 or so of his comments).  And this attack on AVSIM members is also happening over at his Sim-Posium forum (link enclosed) >

 

..So I suggest this thread should be locked before it gets any further out of hand.

 

Sim-Posium - sample comments.....

 

"I looked at this forum and followed the reaction at AVsim and I have to say it would have been less painfull watching Stephen get run over by a bus than the AVsim reaction...  the flight sim community eh

 

 "communicating with AVsim is like mud wrestling a pig.... sooner or later you're going to come to realise that the pig likes it"

 

...You might think it's debate but it's not, it's diversion, you're being diverted from the fact that as you engage these negative people you're losing momentum..."

 

"...Engaging them, just means that the ones you actually want to communicate with, stay over there instead of coming here.    Simply put you can't build momentum here by engaging in debate over there (AVSIM)... Post links over there of progress and interesting threads, but don't enter into debate".

(end quotes)

 

More...

http://nexgenflightsim.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=46

 

.

 

PropheadX... if you're going to ask people to read my last 4 or so comments... also suggest that people read your comments and Luke's and judge for themselves.

 

Perhaps rather than lock the thread before it gets out of hand, perhaps the "TERMS and Agreements" should be enforced.

 

Your quoting of the statements on the SIM-Posium is the exact reaction that others have had about yours and others comments that have lead to the defamation of my character.... they stated their comments on the SIM-Posium rather than here on AVSIM, because it was safe to do so.

 

 

Stephen B.

[cmpbellsjc 2,963]

As far as calling upon big developers to partner with... I doubt that they would rally around the cause unless the flight simulator community showed a genuine interest in moving forward towards a new and improved flight simulator and away from their current bread & butter.

I think the FS community has shown a large interest though the years in a new and improved sim, but how can we quantify that in terms of numbers? You can't.

 

 

I did send out a few invitations, but those who received them didn't even take the time to respond back.

 

Well that's a problem then if existing developers who have the know how and resources aren't even interested in partnering, unless of course they already know about new sim developments that they don't let on about.

 

 

Really there's not much to say or to add to this thread that hasn't been said or suggested before.

 

I guess you'll just have to keep the line hanging in the water and hope to get bite or at least a nibble from some unnamed outside source as its apparent that no one here has anything to contribute monetarily or technically.

[torium 207]

Clear enough for you?

 

Yes, Stephen. You have affirmed this clearly several times from your first post.

 

Ignore suspicion and further questions about your person.

 

I applaud your initiative.

 

I have read them and encouraged the conversations regarding the aspects of creating a next generation flight simulator from any perspective... as a matter of fact I've PM a few of those whose insights clearly show their level of expertise to join in the discussion over at the SIM-Posium because we could really use that kind of direction and leadership.

 

dtmicro appears to be an experienced and positive resource person. Such knowledgeable key personnel will be crucial for further progress.

[HiFlyer 9,360]

Exactly.  But the trouble is that Stephen seems to take many of our comments personally and in turn often resorts to direct personal attacks on members (just read the last 4 or so of his comments).  And this attack on AVSIM members is also happening over at his Sim-Posium forum (link enclosed) >

 

Sorry, I didn't see anything notable there. If that sort of shooting the breeze was cause for closure, numerous threads here where people talk about their impressions of the Orbx, or X-plane forums (amongst others) would have to be welded shut and posted with guard dogs. 

Edited June 8, 2015 by HiFlyer
Removed excessive quote. Again.

[codechris 9]

I'm sat here thinking that we know who wants to participate, and know who doesn't. So....are we done here? Now we just seam to be ######ing at each other and not getting anywhere. I believe that Steve has made his goal by giving people to chance to now about his site. Maybe we can call that goal achieved, and move on....

[torium 207]

move on....

 

 

Where?

[HiFlyer 9,360]

I'm sat here thinking that we know who wants to participate, and know who doesn't. So....are we done here? Now we just seam to be ######ing at each other and not getting anywhere. I believe that Steve has made his goal by giving people to chance to now about his site. Maybe we can call that goal achieved, and move on....

 

It's already a fact that me, you, and anyone reading this, already has the ability to move on at any time, when they have had enough.

 

I could end it all now by simply wandering off to get some sun.

 

Since the thread is days old, I've already ended it several times simply by going to bed! 

[srborick 0]

 

 

I think the FS community has shown a large interest though the years in a new and improved sim, but how can we quantify that in terms of numbers? You can't.

 

Yes you can! Through gathering all interested persons to one central place and let the primary discussion be about the thoughts and interests that have been spread throughout the various forums  through the years. The real challenge is getting past the skepticism and start believing in the possibilities.

[n4gix 4,947]

Please read this carefully.

 

1. When replying, trim the quoted material down to the bare minimum. In fact, most of the time no quote is even necessary.

 

2. As everyone has no doubt noticed, the warning flag has been set (a fellow moderator beat me to the task), so please think twice - or even thrice! - before clicking on the Add Reply button.

 

3. For the record, I've read every single word of each post made. I have not perceived any ad hominem to this point, else I (or one of my fellow moderators) would have taken more direct action.

[srborick 0]

I'm sat here thinking that we know who wants to participate, and know who doesn't. So....are we done here? Now we just seam to be ######ing at each other and not getting anywhere. I believe that Steve has made his goal by giving people to chance to now about his site. Maybe we can call that goal achieved, and move on....

 

 

No... I don't believe the thread has run it's course until no one is willing to post another thought regarding the development of a next generation flight simulator and getting more and more people involved. I for one am willing to continue that quest for at least a minimum of 6 months.

 

Everyday, folks read this thread... perhaps it's the interest in the cock fight, perhaps it isn't. But it just may be that someone will read this entire thread and decide that they want to become a part of the movement to create a next gen sim.

 

We've also enjoyed great discussions regarding the feasibility and how to approach a new flight simulator here in this thread and I encourage others to add their thoughts and opinions either here on AVSIM or over at the SIM-Posium.

 

Now that the staff has stated that the topic is being monitored, perhaps we can behave ourselves and approach the topic logically and constructively.

 

Stephen B.