While I like my CS757... I would image 733+734+735+freight+non-EFIS version would likely well over $200.....

Edited March 18, 20215 yr by C2615

I'll buy it  as soon as it hits the shelves.  In fact I might work out a side deal with Captain Sim to get the pre-release.

9 hours ago, Flyfox said:

And P3D is not dead (yet) ...

Why do people feel the need to post things like this on the P3D forum?

"MSFS is not dead (yet) - I would not post this on the MSFS forum.

"X-plane is not dead (yet) - I would not post this on the org.

How hard is it to just not post doomer nonsense here???

We're talking about airliners. P3D is the premier platform for complex airliner simming in 2021, full stop. It's not dying, it's not sick. It's the best ESP platform we've ever had, and it's steadily getting better.   

3 hours ago, OzWhitey said:

Why do people feel the need to post things like this on the P3D forum?

"MSFS is not dead (yet) - I would not post this on the MSFS forum.

"X-plane is not dead (yet) - I would not post this on the org.

How hard is it to just not post doomer nonsense here???

We're talking about airliners. P3D is the premier platform for complex airliner simming in 2021, full stop. It's not dying, it's not sick. It's the best ESP platform we've ever had, and it's steadily getting better.   

Easy, because for some reason people felt the need to plan P3D's funeral the day MSFS was announced. 

I remember all the predictions on this very forum:

• NG3 will be out on the same day as release
• Every developer will ONLY support MSFS
• Every house in the sim will be there and if you zoom in on my cousin's house you can see uncle Bob mowing the front yard
• 100 fps with the FSLabs A320 in London with full sliders

I can only speak for myself that in the months before MSFS was released, I did slow down my addon purchasing for P3D, just in case. I'm sure I'm not the only one. And I think the developers noticed the slowdown. Today, I still have MSFS installed for the odd sight-seeing flight, but P3D is still my simming platform (and will be for a very long time). My purchasing habits with add-ons are certainly no less-aggressive than they were prior to MSFS...($30 add-on airport I'll probably only fly into once? Don't mind if I do...)

FSX was out in 2006 and it wasn't until well into the next decade that I switched from FS9 on a permanent basis. And that was for a sim (FS9) that was no longer being updated. P3D is still being updated and alive. MSFS has pushed the benchmark (in terms of visuals, at least) to the next level, though. So I'm curious to see if and how LM responds. P3D is not going anywhere for the time being. 

Back on topic though: Good on CS for bringing a classic 737 to market. A lot of people were putting their hopes on QWsim to bring out theirs but sadly it wasn't to be. However, I don't think I'll purchase another CS product any time soon. The 757 was a huge disappointment for me. It steered me clear of purchasing the 767 even though they have a monopoly on the 767 in P3D. 

To be fair to Captain Sim, they were the ones who did the 727 and 707 for FSX when nobody else was prepared to have a stab at older Boeings, and they were in all honesty, pretty good. About the only thing you could be really critical of with those things, is that they fudged things a bit on the 727 with the modeling of the Pratt and Whitney JT8D, where they essentially used the same simulation of one engine variant across the 100, 200 and 200 ADV range of models included, which meant that it was either a bit under/over powered depending on which model you were using of the three included variants. Their 707 didn't quite get the EPR stuff right on its JT3s either, but you could kind of blag it a bit and still use the charts for the real things.

They were fun things and to be honest, I missed having them in P3D.

Now of course a 737-300 doesn't use turbojets, instead using the CFM-56, so they won't have to worry too much about that EPR malarkey, and it's a comparatively simple aeroplane compared to the other Boeings they've made, so I can't imagine it being too bad really. We kind of have to go all the way back to the Wilco one for a 737 of that variety, so it's a bit churlish of people to not really welcome a developer who is prepared to have a go at it.

8 hours ago, Chock said:

To be fair to Captain Sim, they were the ones who did the 727 and 707 for FSX when nobody else was prepared to have a stab at older Boeings, and they were in all honesty, pretty good.

I don't remember it that way at all, and I spent a *lot* of time hacking those panels to fix broken things trying to get those old birds to work.  CS would promise the fix was coming in "the next update" and that next update never came...they just turned their backs and moved on to a new product and then did the same thing there again.  Heck, their C-130 that ended up as a default acft in P3D still, all these years later, won't connect up the APU properly.  And a lot of those problems would have been really easy fixes, like the fuel quantity gauge on the 707 engineer's panel with a needle that was off by a factor of 10.

And then let's remember the old 767 "block" system...an add-on sold piecemeal one chunk at a time, and which never reached actual completion.

Anyone that doesn't insist on a complete, working product before giving these guys money deserves whatever dose of deja vu they get.

9 hours ago, w6kd said:

I don't remember it that way at all, and I spent a *lot* of time hacking those panels to fix broken things trying to get those old birds to work.  CS would promise the fix was coming in "the next update" and that next update never came...they just turned their backs and moved on to a new product and then did the same thing there again.  Heck, their C-130 that ended up as a default acft in P3D still, all these years later, won't connect up the APU properly.  And a lot of those problems would have been really easy fixes, like the fuel quantity gauge on the 707 engineer's panel with a needle that was off by a factor of 10.

And then let's remember the old 767 "block" system...an add-on sold piecemeal one chunk at a time, and which never reached actual completion.

Anyone that doesn't insist on a complete, working product before giving these guys money deserves whatever dose of deja vu they get.

They do that today...fix in next update.

 

51 minutes ago, Dreamflight767 said:

They do that today...fix in next update.

Yeah, and the 733 might explains why they are so quiet on other products resently...

Bob Scott's description of Captain Sim's support mirrors my memory exactly. I was so excited about their development of the 707 and 727 years ago and then so frustrated over promised simple updates that never arrived. I never bought anything from them again except for a few things from their $9 Christmas sales as that was all their never finished products were worth to me. If they ever develop the 707 or 727 for P3D or MSFS and if, and this is the big if, the reviews are good and represent they are complete, then I may buy them. I have no interest in a Captain Sim glass panel airliner when I can get dependable quality and support of those aircraft from PMDG.

Ted

On 3/18/2021 at 9:56 AM, OzWhitey said:

Why do people feel the need to post things like this on the P3D forum?

"MSFS is not dead (yet) - I would not post this on the MSFS forum.

"X-plane is not dead (yet) - I would not post this on the org.

How hard is it to just not post doomer nonsense here???

We're talking about airliners. P3D is the premier platform for complex airliner simming in 2021, full stop. It's not dying, it's not sick. It's the best ESP platform we've ever had, and it's steadily getting better.   

Amen

18 hours ago, Ted Striker said:

Bob Scott's description of Captain Sim's support mirrors my memory exactly. I was so excited about their development of the 707 and 727 years ago and then so frustrated over promised simple updates that never arrived. I never bought anything from them again except for a few things from their $9 Christmas sales as that was all their never finished products were worth to me. If they ever develop the 707 or 727 for P3D or MSFS and if, and this is the big if, the reviews are good and represent they are complete, then I may buy them. I have no interest in a Captain Sim glass panel airliner when I can get dependable quality and support of those aircraft from PMDG.

Ted

I wonder at these forums, which appear to have an automatic response to denigrate certain developers' products which is then allowed to run ad nauseam, whereas other critiques are either cut short or shot to pieces by acolytes of those products. To compare Captain Sim to PMDG is to compare a Rolls Royce to a Ford. Both are good at what they do but do it in different ways.

1 hour ago, Reader said:

I wonder at these forums, which appear to have an automatic response to denigrate certain developers' products which is then allowed to run ad nauseam, whereas other critiques are either cut short or shot to pieces by acolytes of those products. To compare Captain Sim to PMDG is to compare a Rolls Royce to a Ford. Both are good at what they do but do it in different ways.

That's what happens when a developer prices their product too high.  They are judged at that level.  

That "argument" is wheeled out every time. These products are not judged on even terms. Typically, a relatively minor shortcoming is divined and then amplified into a perceived massive issue. This happens across the board and is usually followed by complete silence from those who amplified it if it is subsequently fixed, or years later, condemnation of an entire product range if it was not fixed.

1 hour ago, Reader said:

That "argument" is wheeled out every time. These products are not judged on even terms. Typically, a relatively minor shortcoming is divined and then amplified into a perceived massive issue. This happens across the board and is usually followed by complete silence from those who amplified it if it is subsequently fixed, or years later, condemnation of an entire product range if it was not fixed.

The argument is used each time because a different one isn't necessary or required.  They literally charge more than the leonardo MD80 and the 787.  First one comes with failures, an EFB, working acars, CPDLC, GSX integration.  2nd one comes with an EFB and 3 variants of the 787 included.  I'm not anti captainsim.  In fact I said earlier in this thread I'd consider purchasing the 737-300 for the right price.  

Captain Sim have been going for a long time and are still here. The discussion had been turned to various old models that had been offered at 9.99 on sale and of which I have a complete collection. The only one I paid the full price for was the 707, which was worth every penny. Nevertheless, it was deemed necessary in this discussion, to denigrate the entire range, both current and future because of some small anomalies in one of these older products. I would agree that the current pricing is much higher but perhaps it reflects both what the customer is prepared to pay and the current state of the addon aircraft market. For the record, I did buy the 757 and do not regret it for a moment. I will not be buying the 767 because I already have a 757 and they appear to look the same inside, where I would spend most of my time. I am not a skilled airliner pilot in either the real or simulated world and if it looks good and I can fly it, that's enough for me.