9 minutes ago, Mike_CFII_MEL said:

Hi,

I think you keep coming back trying to win over new users because if the subscription based cash flow slows/stops... so does MS2020 and you're worried! 

Yes, that's it, absolutely. We are fearing the soon-to-be-expected demise of MSFS, killed by the glorious takeover of the much more advanced XP.

8 minutes ago, rka said:

Yes, that's it, absolutely. We are fearing the soon-to-be-expected demise of MSFS, killed by the glorious takeover of the much more advanced XP.

Check out the repetitiveness of the X-Plane 12 autogen. I've circled only a small number of the repeating elements.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/0NYONCPOG-6ZuMzyNieOYNOaw

 

3 minutes ago, David Mills said:

Check out the repetitiveness of the X-Plane 12 autogen. I've circled only a small number of the repeating elements.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/0NYONCPOG-6ZuMzyNieOYNOaw

 

Yeah, they are providing just a canvas again, I think that's pretty obvious by now. They showcased a handfull of tombstones and maybe 15 or 20 lighthouses, that's really the opposite of variety considering this is for todo el mundo. If some payware devs remain, people will probably be able to buy more houses and tombstones via 3rd parties. One city or graveyard at a time. And you will need still need ortho and stuff like XEurope if you don't want to feel like you're flying over Cities:Skylines.

46 minutes ago, David Mills said:

Check out the repetitiveness of the X-Plane 12 autogen.

You might want to cross-check the repetitive same negative comments in this topic for a fair comparison, and if not, at least just accept that what they showcased was a very early technological preview of some, well, technical aspects of the direction XP12 is going to (volumetric clouds, physically based lighting, GPU generated scenery like trees and water, immersive sound, seasons, etc...). You might want to also accept this is in no way representative of the final product, it is just their way to answering simmers what direction is XP12 going to.

In other words, the argumentative of this topic shouldn't be whether XP12 tech preview makes anyone feeling like ditching whatever game or simulator they are currently using, rather, whether the technical direction XP12 is going to is something which resonates or not for your "simming style.". This is just my personal opinion here, not RXP's.

NB: I do share the passion with all of you, really it has been a driver for founding and growing RXP for the last 20 years, but passion aside, the FSExpo presentations (and the explanations) were really in the "technical preview" category. Now maybe it is not something some or most simmer would have expected and they would have prefer slightly more hyperbole and marketing, but this is what it is.

Edited September 27, 20214 yr by RXP

6 minutes ago, RXP said:

You might want to cross-check the repetitive same negative comments in this topic for a fair comparison, and if not, at least just accept that what they showcased was a very early technological preview of some, well, technical aspects of the direction XP12 is going to (volumetric clouds, physically based lighting, GPU generated scenery like trees and water, immersive sound, seasons, etc...). You might want to also accept this is in no way representative of the final product, it is just their way to answering simmers what direction is XP12 going to.

In other words, the argumentative of this topic shouldn't be whether XP12 tech preview makes anyone feeling like ditching whatever game or simulator they are currently using, rather, whether the technical direction XP12 is going to is something which resonates or not for your "simming style.". This is just my personal opinion here, not RXP's.

did they show it too early ? Obviously it looks very early access to me and didn't really go into details on how far they are in the development process. I am convince that people who enjoy XP11 today, will enjoy XP12. The question is always can they gain  people back that left. I used to fly XP11 a lot more before MSFS came around.  I am certain that I will acquire XP12 but I might not invest as much money as I do with the competitor. At the end of the day, if more people are like me, it's not good for the platform. I want XP12 to thrive so that it keeps MSFS honest in the same way MSFS is keeping XP12 honest. They need each other to push the boundaries of what they can achieve.

20 minutes ago, fogboundturtle said:

did they show it too early ? Obviously it looks very early access to me and didn't really go into details on how far they are in the development process. I am convince that people who enjoy XP11 today, will enjoy XP12. The question is always can they gain  people back that left. I used to fly XP11 a lot more before MSFS came around.  I am certain that I will acquire XP12 but I might not invest as much money as I do with the competitor. At the end of the day, if more people are like me, it's not good for the platform. I want XP12 to thrive so that it keeps MSFS honest in the same way MSFS is keeping XP12 honest. They need each other to push the boundaries of what they can achieve.

It would be up to LR to judge whether it was too early or not. However I've just listened to the LR FSElite interview and if I understand correctly, they had to put up a video/virtual only show at the last minute because they couldn't come to the event as planned. This might explain the video presentation cuts and effects which were less "formal" than probably expected.

In any case, the event schedule was what it was (Sep. 2021) and if LR is planning to release XP12 within the next 12 months, this was one of the only "simmer" show in town until then. So it might have been too early but I do prefer early tech preview like this which gives a clear direction where it is heading, and which also gives ample time to evolve the product during the months prior release, thanks to the initial feedback from this event and thanks to the other things in the LR XP12 plan they didn't reveal yet to surprise us at the last minute...

I also believe it is too early to gauge about the number of people who have left... I've read public comments (let alone what I can't share publicly) that are not indicating any "massive" flood of X-Plane simmers to FS2020 at all, and for some vendors I know of, quite the contrary. In my opinion it is really too early to draw any conclusion at all. And for those who have also watched the P3D event, unlike what I've read on Avsim this morning, it was far but really far from being an hollow event as well. There was actually a lot of sound and good information in there albeit if your read between the lines instead of counting the number of people in the room.

 

Edited September 27, 20214 yr by RXP

7 minutes ago, RXP said:

It would be up to LR to judge whether it was too early or not. However I've just listened to the LR FSElite interview and if I understand correctly, they had to put up a video/virtual only show at the last minute because they couldn't come to the event as planned. This might explain the video presentation cuts and effects which were less "formal" than probably expected.

In any case, the event schedule was what it was (Sep. 2021) and if LR is planning to release XP12 within the next 12 months, this was one of the only "simmer" show in town until then. So it might have been too early but I do prefer early tech preview like this which gives a clear direction where it is heading, and which also gives ample time to evolve the product during the months prior release, thanks to the initial feedback from this event and thanks to the other things in the LR XP12 plan they didn't reveal yet to surprise us at the last minute...

I also believe it is too early to gauge about the number of people who have left... I've read public comments (let alone what I can't share publicly) that are not indicating any "massive" flood of X-Plane simmers to FS2020 at all, and for some vendors I know of, quite the contrary. In my opinion it is really too early to draw any conclusion at all. And for those who have also watched the P3D event, unlike what I've read on Avsim this morning, it was far but really far from being an hollow event as well. There was actually a lot of sound and good information in there albeit if your read between the lines instead of counting the number of people in the room.

 

I can only judge base on the anecdotal data of some of the community that I am part of. It's clear to me that people who enjoy XP11 in its current state are still flying XP11. People who were frustrated with the limitation of the poor optimization of XP11 have left. The user base in MSFS is enormous compare to XP11. I am sitting on the fence. I really want XP12 to be much better. They have address the weather, the cloud and the trees which was a major complain that I had. I am still waiting on optimization and performance. Having more option to tweak  different graphical settings would be a huge upgrade. Modern TAA instead of what it's being used today. Better multithreading with the engine. These are the thing XP12 needs. The rest was already good and any improvement is gravy.  If they deliver on that, I will certainly give them my money. I may sound overly critical at time but I do believe XP12 has it's place in the market as long as they can listen to what the community wants. Austin insistence on still using autogen versus streaming scenery is what will make XP12 look very generic and old school compare to MSFS. It's just a reality. People say visual doesn't matter but it does for VFR. I have to do TB of orthos as default scenery and meshes were a mess in XP12. I am expecting more high quality DEM and better default scenery to at least look like it's not 10 years old. 

I'll keep an open mind, I'll wait to see the development improved and we can judge once it's closer to release. I understand it's WIP. 

4 hours ago, David Mills said:

We MSFS users spread the Gospel here for the same reason that churches send missionaries to foreign countries: To provide the uninformed with an opportunity to hear the One Truth. 

Thats funny, whos truth, yours.

Edited September 27, 20214 yr by mjrhealth

All I can say is - if the FSExpo presentation stirred the urge of the MSFS fanb**s to swamp these forums with comments...Laminar must be doing something right 😉

Regarding the "ghost town" theory - yes, MSFS has more users (Candy Crush Saga 2 has even more 🙄), but so far user numbers for XP are pretty steady...or at least not declining faster than MSFS users.

https://steamcharts.com/cmp/1250410,269950#1y

 

We certainly have had a few new users on teh forums.

5 minutes ago, Janov said:

All I can say is - if the FSExpo presentation stirred the urge of the MSFS fanb**s to swamp these forums with comments...Laminar must be doing something right 😉

Regarding the "ghost town" theory - yes, MSFS has more users (Candy Crush Saga 2 has even more 🙄), but so far user numbers for XP are pretty steady...or at least not declining faster than MSFS users.

https://steamcharts.com/cmp/1250410,269950#1y

 

Not everyone is a hater you know ? and I am sure there is more Xplane user who bought directly from LR is the same way that the majority of MSFS users bought it on MS Store. That being said, the number of concurrent user on MSFS compare to XPlane 11 at any given time based on Steam data is not even close. This morning there was 4700 users on steam which is higher than the best of all time on Xplane 11.  There is close to 3 millions copies of MSFS sold. I don't think LR has even slow 1 million on Xplane 11 since it came out. So if you are going to pick a fight , maybe try to pick on that you can actually win.  

You guys have to stop being on a defense all the time. I can only speak for myself but I love flight simming and aviation,. I will use whatever software works for me. Sometimes it's Xplane 11 sometimes it's MSFS. There is nothing wrong with using multiple products.

90% of the time I have to take a second look at a MSFS screenshot to see if its a real picture or not - XP I dont have that issue - its obvious its a flightsimulator on a computer

That said I luv how XP represents night environment - MSFS is not even close imho

2 hours ago, rka said:

Yes, that's it, absolutely. We are fearing the soon-to-be-expected demise of MSFS, killed by the glorious takeover of the much more advanced XP.

That is really funny....🙄

2 hours ago, David Mills said:

Check out the repetitiveness of the X-Plane 12 autogen.

Check out the repetitiveness of the arguments in this forum of MSFS vs XP too…

The world is filled with miserable people need an outlet to whine and complain, when people feel threatened well you see the results. Xplane is like a faithful wife that will never leave you gets better with age like fine wine. MSFS is like a woman who needs to keep changing her makeup to get the young men to run after her, and that they do well. I will stick to xplane because I can, not because I have too, if you dont like it, than go back to your holes and leave us enjoy what we have.