Asobo may dumb down wind gusts again - stop them please!

[Cpt_Piett 4,779]

I really struggled to get the Caravan down safely at Vestmannaeyjar... METAR: Wind 320° 22kt, gusting 35kt. Due to terrain, I had to keep a fair amount of thrust, as I had a loss of lift just over the threshold (yeah, I tried this one several times). Then to get her down I had to go full flaps, cut the throttle - still she wanted to keep flying. A bit of reverse thrust finally got her down. Not sure how realistic this was, but it was certainly a challenge! 

 

[Bobsk8 12,814]

11 minutes ago, Cpt_Piett said:

I really struggled to get the Caravan down safely at Vestmannaeyjar... METAR: Wind 320° 22kt, gusting 35kt. Due to terrain, I had to keep a fair amount of thrust, as I had a loss of lift just over the threshold (yeah, I tried this one several times). Then to get her down I had to go full flaps, cut the throttle - still she wanted to keep flying. A bit of reverse thrust finally got her down. Not sure how realistic this was, but it was certainly a challenge! 

 

If you flew in a small GA aircraft in weather like that, you would probably wish you had never taken off. 

[Sceadu 117]

1 hour ago, TrafficPilot said:

I've made quite a few flights in my C42 where it was so calm we were literally "flying on rails".

My last flight between Dunkeswell and Popham along the Dorset coast was spectacular and, after trimming the aircraft I hardly needed to touch the controls until we got to Portland Bill!

 

A nice trip, I visit Popham fairly often but I think the last time I was at Dunkeswell was to take part in the guiness record mass take off, that was a great day

[LRBS 948]

1 hour ago, Doering said:

In responding to the OP, yes the wind gusts should remain the same and definitely not too hard to fly in as being claimed by others in the simming community. A significant difference between the sim and RL flying is your gut input on the stick or yoke to corrections in windy/gusty conditions. In turbulent conditions the stick is never still and moving back and forth extensively and abruptly (as also seen in the airliner videos). In the sim the aircraft kinda bounces back in a regular and repeatable motion after a gust with little or no aileron/rudder input.

NOTE: I fly about once a week and a little less in the winter (because the bottom of hangar door is often frozen in ice and snow!). There is no absolute correlation between what the sky is showing and the amount of turbulence you experience when flying. While you can predict what the sky and clouds will dictate, you will get it right most times, but never all the time. Last Friday the sky was totally clear and the air was cool. I had planned a flight over Toronto and maybe even land at Billy Bishop. I could see the Toronto skyline when airborne (50 nm line of sight) with clarity. Absolutely incredible visibility! After about 15 minutes I turned back to the airport. The flight was absolutely miserable with up/down and side to side turbulence. Back at the clubhouse, the flight instructors all stated the trouble with maintaining a set altitude because of the turbulence. I would not have believed the experience given the absolute clear sky had I not flown that day.

I think that all bad experience could have been prevented with a good wx briefing. For sure that turbulence was in the forecast, winds aloft or pirep, unless it was a situation of "let's see". 

As you know very well, there is always a strong possibility of CAT even under clear sky conditions, especially in that area.

[sd_flyer 6,073]

1 hour ago, ryanbatc said:

Then be should know that even the smallest of aircraft can experience totally smooth air - at any altitude.  The way his posts read to me also make me think he believes airplanes are always in constant turbulence.

Total smooth air doesn't guarantee flying on rails especially with per solo  few hours under belt student LOL

But it also depend on certain geographical locations. For example where I fly in I can always can find bumpy patches in the mountain even though there is no airmet tango! In fact have, specific places for smooth air that I usually take beginner before they get accustom to turbulence . Then again I fly between coastal area and desert where condition can change dramatically withing 10 miles.

[Dillon 2,197]

On 9/24/2022 at 12:48 PM, abrams_tank said:

Alright.  As I am not a real life pilot, I have been asking around some real life pilots what they think of the new wind gusts in SU 10.  I think several real life pilots said they like it (I would also like to hear back from @sd_flyer on what he thinks of the new wind gusts in SU 10). 737 NG Driver said that Asobo may dumb down the gusts again, because many "simmers" and not real life pilots, have complained that it's too hard to fly in SU 10 now.

Anyways, if you are a real life pilot and you like the new wind gusts, and you think they they are realistic, please post in this thread that you don't want Asobo to dumb down the wind gusts again: https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/thanks-asobo-this-turbulence-is-absolutely-spot-on/544851/24.  There is also a poll in that thread with 3 options: https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/thanks-asobo-this-turbulence-is-absolutely-spot-on/544851/57.  Please vote for the option, "I like it but would like to see turbulence improved, including interaction with clouds" because I think at the moment, there isn't any turbulence from being inside clouds.

I am basing my vote to keep wind gusts from the several real life pilots that I read comments from, including 737 NG Driver, who really likes the wind gusts:

I may change my opinion if other real life pilots say the gusts should be dumbed down, but for now, from the feedback that I have gathered, more real life pilots tend to like the new gusts and turbulence in SU 10.

Got on this a bit late but as a real world pilot Asobo is spot on in the direction they've gone with the gust in the 'SIMULATION'.  The 'sim' feels much better now in terms of what you get when the wheels leave the runway in comparison to the real world.  The challenge of landing is all the more present now in the 'sim'.  This discussion brings to light the expectation of none pilots, gamers, and XBOX users in their perception of real world flight.  It's shameful this title is called a 'Game' instead of a simulation.  Gamers are correct to have issue with the gust implemented in SU10, heck it's just a game right?  Simmers understand what's being simulated here and there's the conflict. Words actually mean something in how you properly classify something, it adjusts expectations...🧐

Next when Asobo gets around to it, I guess we'll have to fight to keep newly adjusted features like properly modeled 'Turn Slip' and 'ATC' from being dumbed down.  

Ooh yea, voted in the official forums as this feature needs to be kept as is.👍

Edited September 25, 2022 by Dillon

[sd_flyer 6,073]

48 minutes ago, ha5mvo said:

Give Rob some credit too. He’s a legend in flight modeling, responsible for some, if not the most, realistic models ever created for simulation as well as a pilot himself.

 

I absolutely love Robs work and have a deep respect for him as developer. All I'm trying convey that there are lot of people here who have sufficient RL flying experience to judge for themselves. Bob is one of them.

Perception even RL pilot often differs. We even have joke when reading two pireps. For example, 172 reports severe turbulence, 5 minutes later 737 passing same altitude at the same location during approach  reports light chop.

I have friend who flies for American Airlines but he also own Cub Legend that he flies quite often. He is senior captain and have enough opportunity to keep  most of his weekends open for $100 hamburger!   I must say not many airlines (unless retired) that I have met who have their feet in both words GA and commercial. He is very proficient GA pilot and also fellow CFI. Although he is not instructing actively because it interferes with his company limitation of duty time, I always take opportunity to fly with him and learn. 

[The Flight Level 2,116]

5 minutes ago, LRBS said:

I think that all bad experience could have been prevented with a good wx briefing. For sure that turbulence was in the forecast, winds aloft or pirep, unless it was a situation of "let's see". 

As you know very well, there is always a strong possibility of CAT even under clear sky conditions, especially in that area.

Yes, I'm usually on and off the ForeFlight app checking the ceiling and radar. With the excellent visibility, I made the trip to the hangar. Winds were gusting at 5-10 and I've completed many good flights with similar winds. The cameras were rolling thinking I was in for good video over Toronto. Always learning. First time with a beautiful blue sky and crazy turbulence way above the norm.

[LRBS 948]

8 minutes ago, Doering said:

 Always learning. 

Ohhh, please believe me this is a business where we constantly learn something new, every flight, there is no other way.

When I hear a pilot saying I know it, I run for my life.

We can share experiences (and that's very good) but we never know it, every time is so quite different. 

 

[bobcat999 8,489]

I have just had a one hour flight around the outskirts of London in the BN-2 Islander.  Live weather.  It started off with quite a bit of light to moderate turbulence between ground and 3000 feet.  As the time got later and the sun set, it smoothed out to the point that as I was on approach to Wycombe Air Park, it was quite calm and felt like it was almost on rails.  I loved the feel of the sim during the flight and the changing turbulence level.  I hope they don't alter it too much now.

[ha5mvo 259]

29 minutes ago, sd_flyer said:

Perception even RL pilot often differs. We even have joke when reading two pireps. For example, 172 reports severe turbulence, 5 minutes later 737 passing same altitude at the same location during approach  reports light chop.

It sure does! Hence I give little weight to perception or "feel" (what does "feel" really mean??) 

[sd_flyer 6,073]

10 minutes ago, ha5mvo said:

It sure does! Hence I give little weight to perception or "feel" (what does "feel" really mean??) 

Yes "feel" depend on pilots experience, background,  knowledge, stress test and so on. The rule of thumb is you are rocked less in heavier airfare and more in light.  I believe light sport and glider collect more of turbulence!

Yes it's true perception of turbulence is base on experience, but doesn't change how turbulence affect airframe. While I like general "jitters" in MSFS modeled turbulence I'm sorely miss one prominent aspect of turbulence - a wing drop.  

[Sky_Pilot071 580]

Most can relate to the difference between an RL rollercoaster ride to one on the PC.  Big difference.

sp

[Bdub22 1,616]

6 hours ago, ahsmatt7 said:

ive flown the NG in the real world. I think i have some idea what im talking about.

yawn. 

[snglecoil 1,828]

This reminds me of the whole flight model discussion. The experience is going to vary from person to person depending on so many factors related to hardware…and frankly will never replicate the real experience no matter how much we strive for it. Not saying it isn’t worth continued effort, but you have to be realistic about what is achievable on home sim hardware.