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Posted

Perfect old school if you have 2 Saitek panels (radio and AP). And the Saitek multi panel is nice (or just the radio panel + Honeycomb yoke and quad).

Video (no Saitek panels).

 

  • Like 5

5800X3D, RTX4070, 600 Watt, one or two 1440p 32" screens, 64 GB RAM, 4 TB  PCle 3 NVMe, Warthog throttle, CH Flightstick, Honeycomb Alpha yoke, CH quad, 3 Logitech panels, 2 StreamDecks, Desktop Aviator Trim Panel. Crystal Light VR.

 

Posted
15 hours ago, Matchstick said:

It's a pack of two different, if related, aircraft (plus variants) so...

....highly related 😄

That's the problem (for me).  Do I want 4 different military versions of the Shorts?  I'd have snapped it up if it were a passenger and cargo version of the short and extended versions - 4 variants.  I'm not convinced people think Shorts when they're looking for a military aircraft.   Anyway, this is of course all subjective.   I watched a YT video of the addon today - there's no doubting how feature rich the systems etc are.  But then at the same time, there's also no doubting how below par the textures are.   All in all, I just think fifty euros for this (or any Black Box product) is really excessive. 

Bill

UK LAPL-A (Formerly NPPL-A and -M)

Posted
15 hours ago, air-ick said:

Yes, future versions are coming that are less expensive with fewer variations.

If that's the case, that's great news!

(Sorry for the D.P)

Bill

UK LAPL-A (Formerly NPPL-A and -M)

Posted

:laugh:  Have you seen the price of the separate packages!  Better off just buying the whole pack.

I wish a Skyvan 'variant' could have been included.  I would love one of those.  I thought that might have been the after the Islander / Trislander.  Still... I am very happy with what I have bought.

Rob (but call me Bob or Rob, I don't mind).

I like to trick airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool in my back yard by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio.

Intel 14900K in a Z790 motherboard with water cooling, RTX 4080, 32 GB 6000 CL30 DDR5 RAM, W11 and MSFS on Samsung 980 Pro NVME SSD's.  Core Isolation Off, Game Mode Off.

Posted
13 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

Have you seen the price of the separate packages!  Better off just buying the whole pack.

That's the marketing magic of "bundles".  For all the models you get with an "All-in-one" version, the cost ratio is not unreasonable...however, few simmers will routinely fly all of them so the "value" for the simmer is diminished.

In the virtual world where no product is physically produced, the company loses zero net profit as there is no cost for materials, like producing a can of beans for example.  A bean-making company that sells 10 varieties of beans can't just bundle them all in one package and sell them...the public would never buy it first off, 2nd, the cost of all those cans, shipping and storage, etc all cost money per can, regardless if they are packed into a bundle or not.

Virtual products on the other hand, have no appreciable costs (if any) associated with manufacturing, distribution, transportation, storage, etc.  So if they bundle all their varieties into one package and sell it at a higher price, it is no loss to them.  The perceived value of getting them all tugs at the basic human instinct to own everything, even though we may only use 10% of all we get.  Watch a young child amongst a bunch of toys he can't possibly ever play with at one time, and see how he reacts when another kid tries to take one of his toys, you'll get the idea LOL. 

Yeah...for the simmer's value, letting them just pick up the models they want at a reduced price is how we'd all prefer it.  And you obviously can't take the price of the total package and divide the cost evenly per model....while mathematically correct, it would never be cost-effective for the developer, and you want them to get a fair value for their hard work and to remain in business.

So, there could be alternate ways to compromise so each side is getting both value and compensation for each purchase.  One common and very popular method is to buy 1 at a set price, and each additional model you buy, you get XX% off that model's price, and so as you buy more, you save per model.  Sure, the overall cost for this method would be much more than the $50 if you added it up, but if you only want one, maybe even 3...the price would be close to $50, but you have control of what you buy and if you only bought ONE...for let's say $25...then that is a great value for the simmer.  Let's say you want a few more...and the next one would be $15, and the 3rd was $10...you'd be in for $50 with less models than the "Premium pack", but it would be all you need.  

To me...seeing one plane (any one I wanted in the pack) for $25 is a heck-of-a lot more enticing then having to be forced to plop down $50 for all of them and maybe only ever using 2 or so. 
This thinking throughout the whole community when deciding to buy this plane, would naturally lead to a ton of more sales at $25 vs very few at $50.  Some Devs just don't seem to get that, and they keep giving us these "Bundles" at a price that simmers will rebel against (esp when you compare it to the recent FSR M500 just released at $33)..and will be a solid "NO SALE"...vs seeing one model at $25 and thinking..."Yeah, I could swing that".  Simple marketing strategy....lost on some trying to cash in on the all-or-nothing methodology.

And as you mention about the price of the separate packages...laughable at best, insulting our intelligence at worst.

 

I really want this plane, but I'm not paying what they are asking for the bundles...any of them.  So there is a lost sale right there.  Switch to the sales model to the one I mention above, and I'll get one sale for sure...maybe 2 from me.  That's an assured $25, maybe $40 to Blackbox...current bundle strategy= $0...the math seems pretty simple to me. 🙂 

  • Like 6
  • Upvote 1

Regards,
Steve Dra
Get my paints for MSFS planes at flightsim.to here, and iFly 737s here
Download my FSX, P3D paints at Avsim by clicking here

9Slp0L.jpg 

Posted (edited)

I'm not sure why a dev asking what they think their plane is worth is "insulting your intelligence" ?

You can DEFINIETLY disagree with the pricing but considering it an insult is taking it WAY too personally.

Personally I think the individual prices are high but they are also highly detailed, extremely interesting aircraft that are worth paying for, especially in the bundle.

Edited by Matchstick
  • Like 1
Posted
3 hours ago, JYW said:

....highly related 😄

That's the problem (for me).  Do I want 4 different military versions of the Shorts?  I'd have snapped it up if it were a passenger and cargo version of the short and extended versions - 4 variants.  I'm not convinced people think Shorts when they're looking for a military aircraft.   Anyway, this is of course all subjective.   I watched a YT video of the addon today - there's no doubting how feature rich the systems etc are.  But then at the same time, there's also no doubting how below par the textures are.   All in all, I just think fifty euros for this (or any Black Box product) is really excessive. 

They are at least as different as two versions of the 737 but people seem to have little difficulty paying multiple times for those.

As for textures, visuals are nice but I'm there to fly the plane not admire the cockpit so those systems are what matter to me.

Posted (edited)

I think what I meant to imply was that the bundle price is much more value for money than the separate packs, by quite some margin.  The maths just don't work out.

Why buy a single pack for about 40 $/E when you can have the whole lot for 50?   I have gone all in anyway.  I will fly the 330, 360, and the Sherpa.

Edited by bobcat999

Rob (but call me Bob or Rob, I don't mind).

I like to trick airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool in my back yard by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio.

Intel 14900K in a Z790 motherboard with water cooling, RTX 4080, 32 GB 6000 CL30 DDR5 RAM, W11 and MSFS on Samsung 980 Pro NVME SSD's.  Core Isolation Off, Game Mode Off.

Posted

I bought the carranado 360 for P3D, I really wanted the 330 as well but didn’t want  to have to pay full price again for what appeared to be just cosmetic changes on their part.

The blackbox price seems reasonable to me considering the length of development time, depth and also considering it’s probably appeals to a smaller customer base than a modern glass cockpit GA aircraft.

 

  • Like 1

787 captain.  

Previously 24 years on 747-400.Technical advisor on PMDG 747 legacy versions QOTS 1 , FS9 and Aerowinx PS1. 

Posted (edited)

great video, Fielder

but I don't agree with your explanation why they used lower resolution textures. in spot view mode on the ground fps shouldn't be an issue. and there are plenty examples of photo realistic textures (Carenado) that look and perform great.

first time I have noticed the characteristic sound interference from slightly out of sync dual engines in MSFS.

superposition sound beat example:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Beat_-_superposition_of_104hz_and_110hz_sine_waves.ogg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Beatfrequency.ogg

technical explanation of beat frequency (superposition). unlike frequency mixing (generates 2 new frequencies: the sum and difference of the original frequencies), the resulting frequency changes only in amplitude.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beat_(acoustics)

 

Edited by turbomax

AMD 7800X3D, Windows 11, Gigabyte X670 AORUS Elite AX Motherboard, 64GB DDR5 G.SKILL Trident Z5 NEO RGB (AMD Expo), RTX 4090,  Samsung 980 PRO M.2 NVMe SSD 2 TB PCIe 4.0, Samsung 980 PRO M.2 NVMe SSD 1 TB PCIe 4.0, 4K resolution 50" TV @60Hz, HP Reverb G2 VR headset @ 90 Hz, Honeycomb Aeronautical Bravo Throttle Quadrant, be quiet 1000W PSU, Noctua NH-U12S chromax.black air cooler.

60-130 fps. no CPU overclocking.

very nice.

Posted
1 hour ago, Matchstick said:

I'm not sure why a dev asking what they think their plane is worth is "insulting your intelligence" ?

Allow me to explain.

"insulting your intelligence" is an idiom.

(id·i·om/ˈidēəm/ noun  A group of words established by usage as having a meaning not deducible from those of the individual words e.g., raining cats and dogs, see the light )

As an idiom, I'm not declaring that I've been or feel insulted, far from it.  In this use of this idiom, I am implying that a dev thinking that we'll spend $50 for 9 separate models or $10 less for only 2 models (in two different bundles to boot), or... FIVE models for $20 less than the original offer...or if you looking for just the commercial models (4 or them) that are not Sherpa's....spend $80 on 2 packages to get them??   That seems to be completely irrational, at least to me.  Not sure how you rationalize that, but like you said "You can DEFINIETLY disagree with the pricing"...which I did with that very common idiom, however you misinterpreted it as me meaning I felt directly insulted. That was my fault, I should have been more clear and stayed away from using idioms. 🙂 

I disagree with the pricing, I am not, nor do I feel personally insulted.  Sorry for the confusion. 😉

 

  • Like 5
  • Upvote 1

Regards,
Steve Dra
Get my paints for MSFS planes at flightsim.to here, and iFly 737s here
Download my FSX, P3D paints at Avsim by clicking here

9Slp0L.jpg 

Posted
5 hours ago, Steve Dra said:

  Watch a young child amongst a bunch of toys he can't possibly ever play with at one time, and see how he reacts when another kid tries to take one of his toys, you'll get the idea LOL. 

spacer.png

5800X3D, RTX4070, 600 Watt, one or two 1440p 32" screens, 64 GB RAM, 4 TB  PCle 3 NVMe, Warthog throttle, CH Flightstick, Honeycomb Alpha yoke, CH quad, 3 Logitech panels, 2 StreamDecks, Desktop Aviator Trim Panel. Crystal Light VR.

 

Posted (edited)

If you only one want plane you buy that, if you want more you buy the pack.

It's not the pricing structure I'd have chosen but it's what the dev wanted to do and I'm very happy with the pack.

Edited by Matchstick
Posted

Definitely getting this now I just need somone to do a good Convair either piston or turbine would be great.

ATP MEL,CFI,CFII,MEI. Type Ratings B-737, ERJ-190,ERJ-170

 

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