27 minutes ago, Bjoern said:

All this detail will have to measure up at the most important point of all - frame times.

You can not simulate screw fastening torque variation with altitude when it means barely scratching at the 20 FPS line on a $800 CPU and $1500 GPU.

I remember how "heavy" the FF777v1 was back in 2007/2008 and seen form today it was an extremely simplified version. But based on the first streams, the FPS of the v2 are very good and at least as good as the FF757. So I hope you will be able to run it without any trouble when it will be out.

Edited May 26, 20242 yr by Franz007

1 hour ago, Bjoern said:

All this detail will have to measure up at the most important point of all - frame times.

You can not simulate screw fastening torque variation with altitude when it means barely scratching at the 20 FPS line on a $800 CPU and $1500 GPU.

That's true if the sim stays on its old legacy development strategy which they were originally design on limited system that depend mostly on single core performance and little untiltation of the GPU which has not change very much over the years (in terms of the fs sims) that is running in most modern hardware today.

But LR has already started to move away for the old way as much as it competition to a more multicores utilization and try to balance the workload between the cpu and gpu unlike in the past where single core performance has differentiate the FS Sim (FSX,P3D,X Plane and MSFS of the world) from the rest of the AAA world who specialize in a more core utilization and better balance workload of the cpu and gpu. The only reason you see complex animation with little performance hits is because for the most part, we have become a custom to run faster processes at, 4.9 to 6.0 ghz range, that can sometime overcome stutter effects and other performance limiting issue. But at the sametime those processor have not being utilize smartly as we have seen that either one on two cords get over uses while efforts have been made to spread the load, does not happen on its own because they were never design to do so. It mask the it defencency until the following happens. From time to time, in some of the most expensive hardware you still see stutters depending on the designs of the scenery or animations.

Austin said we have the technology, why not start using it, was the mission before all of what we are seeing today has started which has been their long time goal. So going forward I would hope the cost of such hardware will become less of a factor and only depend how much hardware or cords would be utilizes to make swinging hangers in the closet possible that you see in one of the FF 777v2 streams, less of a factor in performance and that does not just rely on raw speed.  

On 5/26/2024 at 5:45 PM, Franz007 said:

 

What a coincidence that this « someone » comes from that same community and was (more than obviously) offended, exactly like you.

First,  I wasn’t offended. Second, I  don’t come from that community you’re talking about. Third, I use all 3 sims and enjoy what each have to offer, with lots of my time still spent in  P3D.  I get my opinion isn’t shared by your biased views, but my reply was simply stating that from what I’ve seen, it still doesn’t come close to other top aircraft add ons in either sim. 

On 5/26/2024 at 3:48 PM, Franz007 said:

But based on the first streams, the FPS of the v2 are very good and at least as good as the FF757. So I hope you will be able to run it without any trouble when it will be out.

No doubt it will on my system, but there's got to be a real convincing sale before you'll see a 777 in my hangar (no time for long haul).

Still, keep me updated. Curious to see how all the detail works out for the non-reviewer folk.

While we're at it: Does FF use a proprietary plugin or do they rely on SASL?

 

On 5/26/2024 at 5:50 PM, BobFS88 said:

That's true if the sim stays on its old legacy development strategy which they were originally design on limited system that depend mostly on single core performance and little untiltation of the GPU which has not change very much over the years (in terms of the fs sims) that is running in most modern hardware today.

But LR has already started to move away for the old way as much as it competition to a more multicores utilization and try to balance the workload between the cpu and gpu unlike in the past where single core performance has differentiate the FS Sim (FSX,P3D,X Plane and MSFS of the world) from the rest of the AAA world who specialize in a more core utilization and better balance workload of the cpu and gpu. The only reason you see complex animation with little performance hits is because for the most part, we have become a custom to run faster processes at, 4.9 to 6.0 ghz range, that can sometime overcome stutter effects and other performance limiting issue. But at the sametime those processor have not being utilize smartly as we have seen that either one on two cords get over uses while efforts have been made to spread the load, does not happen on its own because they were never design to do so. It mask the it defencency until the following happens. From time to time, in some of the most expensive hardware you still see stutters depending on the designs of the scenery or animations.

Austin said we have the technology, why not start using it, was the mission before all of what we are seeing today has started which has been their long time goal. So going forward I would hope the cost of such hardware will become less of a factor and only depend how much hardware or cords would be utilizes to make swinging hangers in the closet possible that you see in one of the FF 777v2 streams, less of a factor in performance and that does not just rely on raw speed.  

Since we don't know when Laminar will finally push XP toward increased multithreading (this includes plugin authors to leverage this capability), I just hope that FF applies all known optimization tricks to their code.

36 minutes ago, pommy80 said:

I get my opinion isn’t shared by your biased views, but my reply was simply stating that from what I’ve seen, it still doesn’t come close to other top aircraft add ons in either sim. 

Just stop that nonsense please. In contrary to you I have watched entire streams. Everyone (streamers included) were blown away and agreed that it was beyond everything we’ve seen in an airliner-addon so far. Of course some usual suspects were offended and denied everything making their usual toxic comments (see above). Your comment « not at all » without any argument speaks volume. The question is why do you feel offended? But since you are not biased,  I am sure that you will now tell us in details which other addon offers that system-simulation depth? As a hint: Toliss, Fenix, PMDG don’t come close. The only one would be the CL650. But that is not an airliner.

So, pommy, why are you that offended by having such an amazing-looking addon having many things never seen before? Can you at least explain the reason?

Edited May 27, 20242 yr by Franz007

25 minutes ago, Bjoern said:

No doubt it will on my system, but there's got to be a real convincing sale before you'll see a 777 in my hangar (no time for long haul).

I know that for example Lauda-Air had a flight from LOWW to LGKR with the B777. So you can perfectly fly short hauls with it. The insane features alone make it worth in my opinion.

25 minutes ago, Bjoern said:

While we're at it: Does FF use a proprietary plugin or do they rely on SASL?

I have seriously no clue about that. I just know that if this level of simulation will be the new standard for the planned A350, BB787 and A330, we can look forward to very exciting times. Not forgeting a 3D-weather-radar coming  in 12.2.0 that I loved in P3D.

Edited May 27, 20242 yr by Franz007

21 hours ago, Franz007 said:

I know that for example Lauda-Air had a flight from LOWW to LGKR with the B777. So you can perfectly fly short hauls with it. The insane features alone make it worth in my opinion.

Freight ops may also offer a few shorter hops, but an extensive feature list isn't enough for me to throw money at it.

On 5/27/2024 at 10:41 PM, Franz007 said:

 I have watched entire streams. Everyone (streamers included) were blown away and agreed that it was beyond everything we’ve seen in an airliner-addon so far.

For those of us that have lives and dont have the opportunity to watch entire streams, what, specifically, are you actually talking about.

The local head of police training was "blown away" that you can add a full motion platform to your flight sim for under $20k now, that doesnt mean either of us will be picking one up any time soon (although gotta admit, I do find that tempting).

The EFB provides tons of functionality for weight, load, failures, maintenance, configuration, simbrief etc etc

The walk-around feature is unique, the comms process to ground and flight crews seems unique to me as well, but might become a little irritating.

The aircraft FMC and all engine/hyd/fuel etc systems seem to be fully simulated, including 1,000 available failures.

I'm an avid MSFS'er, but I don't think it's rhethoric to say this is probably the most comprehensive *airliner* addon in the works currently.

I'd be (pleasantly) surprised if PMDG include a lot of the above in their initial 777 release.

2 hours ago, EGLD said:

The aircraft FMC and all engine/hyd/fuel etc systems seem to be fully simulated, including 1,000 available failures.

Those failure are not just that, it has a checklist system that will walk you to resolving those failures as well, both annunciated and non annunciated alarms. BB711 perform a bird strike which he looked in the checklist display found bird strike as a non annunciated item. The instruction for bird strikes interactively walks you through the procedure that covered dumping fuel and level changes before return and land and check off after each items that is complete. That aircraft is loaded with feature and this is just the first run. I can't wait to see what they will add in the coming weeks during the alpha stage. 😊

Edited May 29, 20242 yr by BobFS88

I am looking forward to the release of the FF B777 v2. It will be interesting to see how well it performs. All of the touches to approach reality add complexity. In the end I am most interested in how it handles and navigates. Their B757 and B767 are quite good.

4 hours ago, EGLD said:

El EFB proporciona toneladas de funcionalidades para peso, carga, fallas, mantenimiento, configuración, simbrief, etc.

La función de recorrido es única, el proceso de comunicaciones con las tripulaciones de tierra y de vuelo también me parece único, pero puede resultar un poco irritante.

El FMC de la aeronave y todos los sistemas de motor/hidráulico/combustible, etc. parecen estar completamente simulados, incluidas 1000 fallas disponibles.

Soy un ávido partidario de MSFS, pero no creo que sea retórico decir que este es probablemente el complemento de *avión de pasajeros* más completo que se está trabajando actualmente.

Me sorprendería (gratamente) si PMDG incluyera mucho de lo anterior en su versión inicial 777.

I would be satisfied if they fix the obsolete lnav on PMDG aircraft.

I think Aerowinx takes the crown. 

Not technically an add on for a flight sim, but instead a flight sim in its own right. But with a scenery generator like Xplane or MSFS for eye candy it, in my opinion, stands alone for flight simulators. If you are into flight sims for the absolute most realistic experience Aerowinx sets the standard. 
 

3 hours ago, Geoffery said:

I think Aerowinx takes the crown. 

Not technically an add on for a flight sim, but instead a flight sim in its own right. But with a scenery generator like Xplane or MSFS for eye candy it, in my opinion, stands alone for flight simulators. If you are into flight sims for the absolute most realistic experience Aerowinx sets the standard. 
 

Well, it's not even comparable. Talking about systems for flying alone it must be extremely accurate. But it doesn't simulate anything beside that like a crew-interaction, ground-handling stuff or visible damages of the tires etc. It doesn't even have a 3D cockpit as far as I know. And why do you think it would take the crown over for example the CL650? Based on which criteria?

Edited May 30, 20242 yr by Franz007

3 hours ago, Geoffery said:

I think Aerowinx takes the crown. 

Not technically an add on for a flight sim, but instead a flight sim in its own right. But with a scenery generator like Xplane or MSFS for eye candy it, in my opinion, stands alone for flight simulators. If you are into flight sims for the absolute most realistic experience Aerowinx sets the standard. 
 

No argument there when you can interface a lot of the hardware and those function that many look for. Over time that gap seem to be getting narrow each year. The example of what contain in the 777v2 is not just the start but a great trend toward that reality. The Hotstart Challenger IMO is there when it comes to system simulation and even that can still go further. When you start couple those type of aircraft simulation to VR and then add things like adding motion simulation like the YAW3 

https://www.yawvr.com/

Or adding to your chair with the Haptic gaming pad, (which I have an earlier version of) that brings that level of simulation, closes that gap to some other types of simulators for that absolute realistic experience.

https://nextlevelracing.com/haptic-feedback/

This is really exciting times in flight simulation.

 

Edited May 30, 20242 yr by BobFS88