15 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

Well, I think they know how to code LODs.  But there was certainly a mismatch between the functional teams that a) maintain the LOD system; and b) create the content that works with it.

Again exactly my point - they don't know what they're doing!

6 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

Incorrect. I must be on the same boat as this bunch then? :-

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/ground-textures-are-blurry-lod-system-is-too-aggressive-and-loss-of-detail-in-2024-streamed-scenery-and-clouds-looks-worse-than-2020/676315

Please tell me, what average end user cares how the system is created? Or how it functions. Or why it’s malfunctioning. Or who’s fault it is.

Probably hardly any of them! They just want it to function properly. And it doesn’t, otherwise we wouldn’t be having this discussion. 

Wanting it all to work happily without problems for you or anyone else is indeed a laudable objective.  My contention is simply that condemning the LOD system as rubbish isn't going to fix anything because the LOD system isn't at fault, its the way some content currently works within it!  

26 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

A functional mismatch?! Hahahaha my oh my the excuses are just getting worse and worse as this goes on. 

 

1. you misquoted me - I said a mismatch between functional teams.  You don't really believe the same physical people that code the simulator create the content that goes in it do you?

2. you inferred it as an excuse.  It is not, because I don't work for Asobo and don't need to excuse anything at all.  It is an explanation.

That you don't want to understand why your approach is flawed, and don't wish to seek to advance your knowledge concerning why that might be so, and what may be a more productive and constructive understanding, is crystal clear, and so I shall leave you believing, as you wish to, that everything is broken and go and have a very enjoyable flight, [the best that I can possibly have, now my sim is set up to make the most of my hardware and technical understanding]  Enjoy!

1 hour ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

A functional mismatch?! Hahahaha my oh my the excuses are just getting worse and worse as this goes on. 

 

That's just how game development works. The people working on the programming are not same people doing the art assets.

11 minutes ago, Tuskin38 said:

That's just how game development works. The people working on the programming are not same people doing the art assets.

Oh yes, that might be the case. But we all must understand that it's not their job to talk to each other. That would be too much to ask*. Everyone works for themselves and does (maybe?) a great job individually. It's just that the end result is shi... bad. But it's not their fault ... 

^*SMH^*

^*It's the same at my company. We don't talk to the other departments, otherwise something good might come out of it. 😂

Edited July 20, 2025Jul 20 by flying_carpet

1 hour ago, kevinfirth said:

you misquoted me - I said a mismatch between functional teams.  You don't really believe the same physical people that code the simulator create the content that goes in it do you?

I don’t believe anything that anyone at Asobo says in the Q&A sessions. Politicians have more respectability. 

1 hour ago, Tuskin38 said:

That's just how game development works. The people working on the programming are not same people doing the art assets.

Thanks for that Sherlock. It hasn’t been mentioned here before. 👀 Clearly these two sets of departments don’t have the ability to communicate with each other then we can assume? 

Edited July 20, 2025Jul 20 by Ianrivaldosmith

4 hours ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

For your information, I have several degrees. Is that intellectual enough for you? 

You have several  degrees Ian?

That is impressive. Big S!

I can't believe this has devolved to insulting people. 

In my opinion, MSFS promised a feature, and it wasn't delivered. It's that simple. There may be lots of good reasons for it, or maybe it's incompetence... I don't really care. I just want what was promised when I shelled out my money for this product.  It seems odd that anyone would defend this behavior. 

2 hours ago, kevinfirth said:

My contention is simply that condemning the LOD system as rubbish isn't going to fix anything because the LOD system isn't at fault

If the LOD system isn't at fault, why do I see hangers culled from view when I flying in the traffic circuit?  Why does an airborne airliner get culled when it is still large enough to be drawn?

1 minute ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I can't believe this has devolved to insulting people. 

In my opinion, MSFS promised a feature, and it wasn't delivered. It's that simple. There may be lots of good reasons for it, or maybe it's incompetence... I don't really care. I just want what was promised when I shelled out my money for this product.  It seems odd that anyone would defend this behavior. 

Agreed.  It really annoys me when MSFS2024 is loading and we see the helicopter flying low over crops - and those crops can be seen as far as the eye can see.  This feature is another one that isn't there - or it is, but the terrible LOD system culls them before you literally land on them.

5 hours ago, kevinfirth said:

I'd recommend reading the 2024 SDK on LODs to understand in detail why a ship model might not be displayed as we'd like in every circumstance.

I would prefer to fly in the sim AND SEE the promised life ships. I have no interest at all what the technicalities are.  If the technical challenges are too difficult to deliver worldwide live ship traffic, it should have been promised as part of the package.

6 hours ago, kevinfirth said:

if you don't understand the differences between 2020 and 2024, you are not intellectually equipped to criticise something that doesn't appear to work exactly as you'd like.

The customer shouldn't have to worry about technical subjects like LODS - why the hell should they care?  MSFS was advertised as having worldwide ship traffic, but it doesn't. If the ship is big enough to be draw, it should be.  It is not good enough to have to get closer to see it suddenly pop on the screen.  Same with airborne traffic.  I see it plotted on the TCAS but it can't be seen - I'm flying GA and I need to see it to avoid.  Absolutely awful when it suddenly pops into view when it was large enough to draw miles away (yes, I know other traffic can be difficult to spot at various distances, but no good looking for it if a LOD has culled it).  What about the crops we see during 2024 loading, where the helicopter is spraying the crops AND where we see crops in distant fields too - where are they in the sim?  Are they they but we can't see them due to LODS?

I was a staunch supporter of 2024 for six months after release, but continued technical issues, poor LODS AND being lied to has led me to XP12 where there are no LOD problems.  My trust in MSFS delivering what they promised started a slow decline when they ruined the excellent weather we had in 2020.  I currently can't use 2024 because of a sound issue that often crashes my PC.  I check in regularly, but it never improves.

Your patronizing statement is not relevant when discussing LODS.  If people were complaining about the speed of vehicles on the roads, your comment may be relevant. IT IS NOT RELEVANT when discussing content being culled when it should be visible!

In XP12 I can see ANY type of vehicle as far away as it can be drawn, and that includes cars, ships and aircraft.  I do not see airfield structures being culled when I'm in the circuit.  MSFS2024 has a poor LOD system, it can't be denied.

Just in case it helps anyone, I'm on SU2 (I don't do the betas) and I've been running OLOD=1000 for the last several months, and I see distant aircraft, contrails, taxiway signs, and landing gear. No issues with things popping in. 

I use AutoFPS so OLOD will be reduced if there are VRAM or frame rate issues (FPS locked at 60, no frame gen), but generally the only time OLOD ever gets reduced is in heavy clouds, where it isn't needed anyway.

I just mention this to anyone who is having issues while using a low OLOD (100, 200, etc.). You might want to max it out and see what your system does with it.

 

3 hours ago, prolixindec said:

Just in case it helps anyone, I'm on SU2 (I don't do the betas) and I've been running OLOD=1000 for the last several months, and I see distant aircraft, contrails, taxiway signs, and landing gear. No issues with things popping in. 

I use AutoFPS so OLOD will be reduced if there are VRAM or frame rate issues (FPS locked at 60, no frame gen), but generally the only time OLOD ever gets reduced is in heavy clouds, where it isn't needed anyway.

I just mention this to anyone who is having issues while using a low OLOD (100, 200, etc.). You might want to max it out and see what your system does with it.

 

But do you see any ships? 😛